Apple Bee (Woodchuck Clone)

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jayhuff

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2 gal Apple Juice/cider (not from concentrate)
8 oz crystal 10L
4 oz chocolate malt
WLP300 (or wheat yeast)

makes 2.5 gallons

steep grains at 154 for 20 mins (I use a grain bag) in 1 qt of water
sparge grains with 1 qt at 170 (I just dunk for about 5 mins)

Ferment for about 4 weeks (similar to apfelwein) to get rid of the rhino farts smell. I think it tastes a lot like Granny Smith Woodchuck. People liked this alot.
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No hops in this so not a true beer- hence the Apple Bee. It is an excellent drink though, and I made my second batch of this tonight. A few tweeks, I added 1 ounce of torrified wheat (head retention) and 8 oz of german pilsner (malty fermentables). 8 oz of DME would work too. I didn't have hefe yeast, so I pitched plain muntons yeast. After 1 hour, it has a small krausen forming. I think I need to get ready for a violent fermentation!

Recipe Note If you are going to add more grains to do a mini mash, you will need to add more than 1 qt of water. The above notes were added as a side note to alterations that I made as an experiment for a mini mash- Follow the lb/grains=1.25qt strike & 1.25 qt sparge. Read up on mini mashes before you try this though. The original recipe works as written, any thing else you do, you are on your own (but that is the fun part of brewing!).
 

Aleforge

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My wife loves granny smith woodchuck. I actually perfer Hornsbys Amber, a little drier.

I made some of Edworts apfelwein a few weeks ago, but I might try this to get something sweeter for my wife.
 
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jayhuff

jayhuff

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og was 1.044 and a fg of 1.006. i am expecting this batch to finish a little higher because of the torrified wheat addition.
 

GreatWhiteSlark

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I'm going to add a pound of light brown sugar to your recipe, I got the grains listed in the first post only. It'll darken the color a bit and add quite a few points the FG. I'll be sure to record it and let you know what I come up with.

The new woman is a big cider fan and really likes what she's had in Germany, which she described as being between Hornsby's and Woodchuck but stronger. I gave her a friend's Apfelwein and she said it was good, but what she's had was sweeter and not as strong. Hopefully this will be it...

Thanks for sharing!
 
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jayhuff

jayhuff

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UPDATE
As of last night, 12/3, 9 days, it is starting to clear up and look good.
OG reading was 1.044
Last night SG reading: 1.004
Taste: Great!

I will say that I and thinking of racking this onto a bag of chopped apples for a few days before bottling. That is in a few more weeks, so I will update if that happens and the results.
 
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jayhuff

jayhuff

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Well I didn't rack onto apples, but I did bottle on the 14th (3 weeks fermenting) and today it is carbed good enough to drink and if very good. This is one that will be in the rotation every month. It has a quick tart taste and then mellows with the malt flavor for a finish.
 

Zul'jin

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Search ye. find ye.

So how abou tthis?

1/2-1 pound crystal malt grain for steeping
3-4 pounds extra light or ligth DME
1-2 cups Hawiian brown sugar at end of boil
2-5 gallons of treetop apple jiuce. cut with water if less than 5 gallons
Primary for maybe 2 weeks or till hydrometer says go

Secondary with chooped green apples for a while 9?) Peel or no? Cores remved , yes.

Prime bottle carb

chill n Serve

Its fo r SWMBo so no hops
 
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jayhuff

jayhuff

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That looks like a great recipe. I would peel and core the apples, unless you really clean the skins well. I know on apples, there tends to be wild yeast, and you wouldn't want this to mess with the final product.

Quick tip... let it go in primary for 2-3 weeks. Even if hydro says go... there is a smell apple juice puts off that is not pleasant, and it clears the longer you let it sit. 2 weeks for sure. Then taste AND smell.

Good luck and report back on how it all goes!
 

Zul'jin

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OK. Refined recipe. The one I'm going with.

*1 pound crystal grain cracked and steeped from room temp to 170F
*3 gallons treetop apple juice or 2 gallons apple and 1 gallon some other flavor
*1 1/2 cups turbinado brown sugar
*3 pounds extra light DME full boil
*1 1/2 cups turbinado brown sugar near the end
*Some cinnamon near the end
*Maybe some nutmeg also near the end
*Cool and pitch starter made with red Star champagne yeast, turbinado brown sugar and water
*Let 3 gallon wort ferment for 2-3 weeks, taking hydrometer readings
*Put 3 gallon wort plus 2 more gallons juice and maybe 1 cup turbinado brown sugar into secondary
*Probably wait a long time since fermentation will ramp back up
*Maybe transfer to thirduary vessel
*Prime and bottle
*Wait
*Druck

This will probably be real sweet. Good. SWMBO likes sweet and fruity drinks.
 

Zul'jin

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I really messed up this time. Yep. I should have made 1 pot to ferment and 1 pot to drink right now. I'm sipping a glass of it. WOW! It's apple and cinnamon and caramel (I didn't add caramel) and a light taste of beer all at once. Tspt-tspt-tspt... I can tastes a little allspice too. It is VERY sweet.

Revised, again. I cannot have a big pot boiling and not add stuff to it. :D Brown sugar has been lessened by 2 cups and other spices measured.

*1 pound crystal grain cracked and steeped from room temp to 170F
*3 gallons treetop apple juice
*3 pounds extra light DME full boil
*1 cup turbinado brown sugar near the end
*Heaping 1/8 cup cinnamon near the end
*4 dashes nutmeg also near the end
*4 dashes allspice near the end
*Cool and pitch starter made with red Star champagne yeast, turbinado brown sugar and water
*Let 3 gallon wort ferment for 2-3 weeks, taking hydrometer readings
*Put 3 gallon wort plus 2 more gallons juice and maybe 1 cup turbinado brown sugar into secondary
*Probably wait a long time since fermentation will ramp back up
*Maybe transfer to thirduary vessel
*Prime and bottle
*Wait
*Druck
 

Brandon O

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Did the recipe just as it is but I doubled the amount of DME.

I gotta tell you, the grains and malt add soooooo much to this recipe.

I reccomend doing the recipe just as it is before you start messing with it. It is tart and dry yet sweet. It cleans up after itself like a flanders red and leaves you with a malty sweetness in the background. I wouldn't want to make this any bigger than it is, the taste is just too good.
 

Brandon O

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Gosh this stuff is sooooooo good!!!! If you read this you must brew it!

I stopped fermentation at 1.008 by kegging and putting in the kegerator. It's nice, only a tiny bit sweet. Something you can slug down and quench your thirst with.
 

Brewkowski

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So what would happen if you changed it to something like a PM of 4oz each of Flaked Rice, Flaked Wheat, Honey Malt and Crystal 80, and then carried on with the fermentation and such. I've never made a cider so I really have no idea what I'm talking about, but it's all about experimentation right. Would the rice add anything and would it be worth PM'ing for?
 

GroosBrewz

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Well, I made a batch last night.. Bought 5 gallons of Apple Juice and made a 2.5 gallon batch of this and a 2.5 gallon batch of Ed's Apfelwein... I followed the instructions to a T, but I ahve a few questions for you guys that have cider experience... First off, the original instructions were not that great, especially for a guy who has never made cider.. I cracked the grains and steeped them at 156 for 20 min.. then in another pan, I heated another qt to 170 and "dunked" the grains in that for 5 minutes.. Then I dumped both pots of wort into the fermenter and added the Apple Juice.. Sound right?

Also, I didnt stir this as I normally would stir a wort.. In other words, I didnt add as much 02.. Is this important in a cider? Also, I didnt add any yeast nutrient but have since read many posts that yeast nutrient is important for ciders.. Should I have added it? I used Wyeast Wheat yeast

Thanks
Chris
 

Zul'jin

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This wort you made, was it made of water? Cause that plus 2.5 gallons of juice is more than 2.5 gallons of brew. Just looking to clarify that.

I dunno if it was "right" but it sounds good.

This is only my third batch of apple juice booze. I really don't and shouldn't call my stuff Ed Wort's anything, but the only liquid I use is juice.
 
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jayhuff

jayhuff

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sorry about the orginal instructions... not so friendly to those who are new. sounds like you did a good job though. I have never used a nutrient to make this or any ciders. good luck and report back on how it turned out.
 

GroosBrewz

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sorry about the orginal instructions... not so friendly to those who are new. sounds like you did a good job though. I have never used a nutrient to make this or any ciders. good luck and report back on how it turned out.

thanks Jayhuff- I will keep you guys posted.. As of today, it is still bubbling merrily along.. Just to clarify, I dont need to cover this with a blanket or anything for purposes of light, right?
 

Yooper

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thanks Jayhuff- I will keep you guys posted.. As of today, it is still bubbling merrily along.. Just to clarify, I dont need to cover this with a blanket or anything for purposes of light, right?

I cover mine. Cider doesn't have hops, so it won't get skunky but it can definitely suffer from being "lightstruck".
 

GroosBrewz

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I cover mine. Cider doesn't have hops, so it won't get skunky but it can definitely suffer from being "lightstruck".

Thanks Yooper- That kinda bums me out 'cause I was really enjoying sitting on my couch looking at the fermentation happen... ould never do that with a batch of beer.. Alas, all good things must end
 

flyweed

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Hey Jay, got a couple questions in regards to this recipe. I just orderd all the "stuff" to make this including the torrifed wheat and german pilsner additions.

1st question..When you boil all of this, do you use a steeping bag? Did you buy crushed grains or not?

Thanks
Dan
 
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jayhuff

jayhuff

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Hey Jay, got a couple questions in regards to this recipe. I just orderd all the "stuff" to make this including the torrifed wheat and german pilsner additions.

1st question..When you boil all of this, do you use a steeping bag? Did you buy crushed grains or not?

Thanks
Dan

Yes I buy them crushed and I steep them in a bag. I have done this as a mini mash too:

mash in a small cooler at 156 for 60 min (in a bag- using 1.25 qt/water per pound of grain) and then sparge at 175 for 20 min with 1 qt/water per pound.

Good luck and let us know how it goes.
 

flyweed

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THanks Jay..I can't wait to get this one going..it sounds like it's going to have some really nice complex flavors and colors from the sweetness of the 10l malt, to the nice body and chocolate overtone of the chocolate malt. If I can get a nice frothy head from the torrified wheat addition, I'll be very happy. I can't wait to taste this. I'll keep you posted.

I made a nice "green apple" cider using edworts apfelwein as the base. I then added some buckwheat honey and couple more cans of concetrate to backsweeten, the kegged. It was good and was excellent when it was fully carbed..my friends drank all 5 gallons in one night!! I will admit it tasted nice..but was fairly thin bodied, not really complex at all. SO I am hoping to really WOW them with this new recipe.

DO you know what this will finish at for a final gravity? Does it have any lingering sweetness at all?

Dan
 
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jayhuff

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FG at about .006 and the maltiness gives it a nice sweetness... the apple finishes dry and a tad tart like the apfelwein. The two together make for a nice complex taste- a lot like the Grannysmith Woodchuck. It is very tasty. :)
 

Brandon O

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Here's my Favorite

4oz Chocolate Malt, 8oz Crystal 10L, 1oz Torrified wheat. Steep at 155 for 30 mins in half gallon of water. Then boil 2 lbs light DME for 15 mins. Combine with 2.5 gallons of applejuice. Ferment with Nottingham, keg at 1.008.

This is what my 3 gallon carboy is used for all the time now.
 

syd138

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So do you actually boil the apple juice?

I've done this before with real apple juice I made and it turned it into Apple Sauce
 

flyweed

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Jay...just so I have this straight, this is alot like a partial mash beer style of brewing? I am going to steep the crushed grains first in their sparge bag. Then after that time is up, I transfer that same sparge bag over to the water used for the sparge and basically just rinsing the grains of their sugars? Is that right?

One last thing, did you add the torrified wheat and german pilsner to the sparge bag during the steeping process?

Thanks
Dan
 

flyweed

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Syd, I don't think you boil any of the Apple juice..it only talks about steeping in a quart of water and then sparging in another quart. I assume you'll just add those 2 quarts of hot liquid to your room temp apple juice.

Dan
 
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jayhuff

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fly- yes you steep the all the grains together. You use strike water to steep in to maintain ~155 degrees. Then transfer the grains to another pot, leaving behind the water you steeped in, and then sparge the grains with water about 175-180, which is a rinse of the grains to wash out sugars. Add the rinse and sparge to the apple juice in primary, and you're in business.

syd- do not boil the apple juice.

brandon- I have used DME for a batch as well. I only used a pound, but 2 lbs would be good too!
 

syd138

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So I've seen a few different recipes...

Whats the final verdict if I want to do a 5 gallon batch?
 

flyweed

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Jay, Yeah I think I am actually going to do a full 5gallon batch of this...should I just double all measurements and water, but I'll keep the yeast to just one package.

Dan
 
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