APA and AIPA hop bills critique

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Tamir

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Hi guys,

Just planned out two new recipes for an APA and an IPA.
I wanted to try hop bursting, meaning I get all my IBU's from late additions, while having a lot of flavour and aroma.

I brew 12 liters batches (about 3 gallons), and this is what I came out with (15g = 0.5oz, 30 = 1oz):

APA: (OG: 1.058, Total IBU: 42.3)
15.00 g Simcoe [13.00 %] - Boil 15.0 min Hop 7 19.8 IBUs
15.00 g Amarillo [9.20 %] - Boil 15.0 min Hop 5 14.0 IBUs
15.00 g Cascade [5.50 %] - Boil 15.0 min Hop 6 8.4 IBUs
15.00 g Simcoe [13.00 %] - Dry Hop 7.0 Days Hop 11 0.0 IBUs
15.00 g Cascade [5.50 %] - Dry Hop 7.0 Days Hop 10 0.0 IBUs
30.00 g Amarillo [9.20 %] - Dry Hop 7.0 Days Hop 9 0.0 IBUs

IPA: (OG: 1.070, Total IBU: 74.3)
15.00 g Centennial [10.00 %] - Boil 60.0 min Hop 6 28.6 IBUs
15.00 g Amarillo [9.20 %] - Boil 15.0 min Hop 7 13.1 IBUs
15.00 g Simcoe [13.00 %] - Boil 15.0 min Hop 9 18.5 IBUs
15.00 g Centennial [10.00 %] - Boil 15.0 min Hop 8 14.2 IBUs
30.00 g Simcoe [13.00 %] - Dry Hop 7.0 Days Hop 11 0.0 IBUs
15.00 g Amarillo [9.20 %] - Dry Hop 7.0 Days Hop 12 0.0 IBUs
15.00 g Centennial [10.00 %] - Dry Hop 7.0 Days Hop 13 0.0 IBUs

What would you say about the hops I chose and their proportions?
Do you have better suggestions and/or tips for what I'm into?

PS: I'm kind of afraid both recipes will taste the same.
I thought about using Summit somewhere, but I am afraid it will overpower the other hops.
 
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Tamir

Tamir

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Help? please?
 

Pappers_

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Hi Tamir. Looks interesting. I think you will have similar flavors and aromas in the two beers, because you are using the same hop varieties, especially if you consider the similarity between Cascades and Centennial. But the beers will also be distinct, because of the different grain bills, IBU levels, etc. Sounds like a fun experiment.

I like using Summit in American ales, I think it works nicely with Mosaic, Amarillo, Chinook, and Citra. I've given up on Simcoe, I haven't enjoyed the results I've gotten as much, but I know other people brew great beers with it.

In terms of the timing of your hop bursting, have you considered adding some at 15, 10, and 5 minutes rather than just 15 and dry hopping? I like the results I get that way, plus dry hopping.
 
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Tamir

Tamir

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Thank you for your answer.

I like piney hops. I am kinda tired of cascade, citra etc.
So I want to do something more interesting.

What do you think about Chinook-Amarillo-summit combination? All for flavour and aroma?

Do you have more suggestions?
 

hottpeper13

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I can't comment on variety,my tastes are different then yours, but at the present time I am experimenting with hop timing and am doing first wort hopping with a dual purpose or aroma hop and a flameout addition with a 10min hop stand(no pump). The FWH really mellows the bitterness.
 

Pappers_

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Thank you for your answer.

I like piney hops. I am kinda tired of cascade, citra etc.
So I want to do something more interesting.

What do you think about Chinook-Amarillo-summit combination? All for flavour and aroma?

Do you have more suggestions?
I've never used Chinook late, only early in the boil. I think the Chinook, Amarillo, Summit pairing is nice.

If you want to try something different, you could experiment with some New Zealand hops, I've used them in American ales. I made a pale ale witg Chinook fwh and then Nelson Sauvign at 15, 10, 5 and dry hop. A high alpha acid hop that gives blackberry and piney flavors is Pacific Gem.

If you want to stick with American hops, I really enjoy Mosaic.
 

Pappers_

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I can't comment on variety,my tastes are different then yours, but at the present time I am experimenting with hop timing and am doing first wort hopping with a dual purpose or aroma hop and a flameout addition with a 10min hop stand(no pump). The FWH really mellows the bitterness.
+1 And for IPAs, I've also been throwing hops into the mash!
 
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Tamir

Tamir

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Unfortunately, I don't have access to Nelson currently.

What would you think about Amarillo, Chinook and Summit for flavour and dry hopping?

Will Chinook be too weird?
I like piney hops a lot, but I don't know if this specific one is good for flavour and aroma.
 

sweetcell

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i think that combo of hops looks great, but i too question having a 15 min addition and dry hopping only. personally, i think 15 mins is too far out. move it to 10, if not 5. also, split them up - do 10/5 mins and a flameout addition. you can either split your current hop bill in half, and add evenly. or you could add one variety at 10 (say, Centennial), another at 5 (Simcoe) and the last at flameout (Amarillo).
 
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Tamir

Tamir

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I will probably split them because the bitterness will be too high (I want something in the area of 33-5 IBU for the APA).

On the IPA, my intention was to only use them as flavour hops, and treat the aroma with dry hopping.

Is it not a good idea?
 

sweetcell

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On the IPA, my intention was to only use them as flavour hops, and treat the aroma with dry hopping.

Is it not a good idea?
the aroma you get from dry-hopping isn't the same as a flameout addition. to make a good american APA or IPA, you need both in my opinion.

somewhat related: there is no magic line about X minutes or more = flavor and Y minutes and less = aroma. you'll get some aroma from 15 minute addition (just not as much), and you'll get flavor from a flameout addition. so personally, i like to cover the spectrum. i also think that 15 mins is too long, you're boiling off too much volatile oils...
 
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Tamir

Tamir

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Of course there is a lot of overlap, but 15-20 minutes additions are considered to be the most common flavour additions.

I will do some more research about hops additions, I waned to try hop stands for a while :)
 
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