Another yeast starter question

[sparkyaber]

I Just want to clear a few things up:

The most important thing is the yeast cake on the bottom of the flask?


1L starter = .5 cup dme with two cups water????
It is not even close to one liter.


I hear people talking about decanting the yeast. Is this just pouring off the top layer, leaving the slurry, mixing the slurry with what is left of the old wort and then pitching?


When Mr Malty says to have a 1.XXXX liter starter, is that a true liter, or a liter like stated above. I only have a 1liter flask, so it is worthless, or could a guy "decant" the old wort off, and then add new fresh wort on top of the yeast cake to build up the number of yeasties?



Thanks

 

[Piotr]

I Just want to clear a few things up:

The most important thing is the yeast cake on the bottom of the flask?

Yes, but assuming that all yeast had time to settle down to the bottom

1L starter = .5 cup dme with two cups water????
It is not even close to one liter.

Just take 100g for 1 liter (a bit less than 1/2 cup)

I hear people talking about decanting the yeast. Is this just pouring off the top layer, leaving the slurry, mixing the slurry with what is left of the old wort and then pitching?

Yes, and the top layer = liquid beer

When Mr Malty says to have a 1.XXXX liter starter, is that a true liter, or a liter like stated above. I only have a 1liter flask, so it is worthless, or could a guy "decant" the old wort off, and then add new fresh wort on top of the yeast cake to build up the number of yeasties?

No, it is no good. Get another 1 liter flask. Or maybe pour off the slurry to another sterile container (jar?), leaving some slurry as a starting point for second 1 liter starter, ad pitch them all together.

 

[reim0027]

Question about your last point. Why do you think that "stepping up" the yeast starter (as was described by the OP) is not good?

 

[Piotr]

Question about your last point. Why do you think that "stepping up" the yeast starter (as was described by the OP) is not good?

AFAIK number of yeast cells is a function on volume, when they reach certain density, they don't multiply any more. If you want more new cells you have to make room for them.

 

[sparkyaber]

Just take 100g for 1 liter (a bit less than 1/2 cup)QUOTE]

So what you are saying is 100 g= 1L? Shouldn't 1000g= 1L? This should not be just the slurry??? I am missing something here aren't I.

When Malty calls for 2 L of starter, what exactly is it saying??


Thanks for answering the other questions, I thought I was right on both of them, glad you set me strait on the last question. Might have to get a cider jar, or I like the Mason Jar.

 

[Piotr]

Just take 100g for 1 liter (a bit less than 1/2 cup)QUOTE]

So what you are saying is 100 g= 1L? Shouldn't 1000g= 1L? This should not be just the slurry??? I am missing something here aren't I.

When Malty calls for 2 L of starter, what exactly is it saying??


Thanks for answering the other questions, I thought I was right on both of them, glad you set me strait on the last question. Might have to get a cider jar, or I like the Mason Jar.

I add 100g of DME to 1L of water, that gives me wort of 10 Plato (maybe slightly less...), just right for starter.

If you have Mason jar, why don't you use it as a container for making starter? Just don't forget to sterilize it properly. I make my bigger starers in a 2.5L glass jar.

 

[caver95]

Does this make me a redneck? while taking some recycling to the dump, I came accross a used gallon wine bottle. I thought hey that might make a nice starter bottle. now it is sitting in bleach at my house.

 

[jds]

Just as a data point, here's my starter method:

Boil 100g/l of DME in water, cool to around room temperature, transfer to 1/2 gallon growler. Pitch yeast, toss in sanitized stirbar, and cover loosely with foil.

Let it whirl for 24-48 hours, then transfer to fridge, to flocculate the yeast.

The morning of brewday, pour off (decant) enough of the starter beer to leave 1/4 to 1/2 inch over the cake, cover again, and let it warm to room temperature on the counter while brewing. Easy peasy.

If I need more than 2l of starter, I decant the first starter, and then pour about 3/4 of the slurry into a sanitized jar, and cover the yeast with boiled and cooled water. I add new starter wort on the remainder of the yeast in the growler, and grow it up for another 24-48 hours. An extra couple of days in the fridge for the first go-round of starter hasn't been a problem.

 

[steelerguy]

Does this make me a redneck? while taking some recycling to the dump, I came accross a used gallon wine bottle. I thought hey that might make a nice starter bottle. now it is sitting in bleach at my house.

No way, I love my 1 gallon jug when it comes to making starters!

https://www.homebrewtalk.com/f13/my-belgian-strong-ale-wyeast-1388-yeast-starter-99589/

 

[sparkyaber]

Just as a data point, here's my starter method:

Boil 100g/l of DME in water, cool to around room temperature, transfer to 1/2 gallon growler. Pitch yeast, toss in sanitized stirbar, and cover loosely with foil.

Let it whirl for 24-48 hours, then transfer to fridge, to flocculate the yeast.

The morning of brewday, pour off (decant) enough of the starter beer to leave 1/4 to 1/2 inch over the cake, cover again, and let it warm to room temperature on the counter while brewing. Easy peasy.

If I need more than 2l of starter, I decant the first starter, and then pour about 3/4 of the slurry into a sanitized jar, and cover the yeast with boiled and cooled water. I add new starter wort on the remainder of the yeast in the growler, and grow it up for another 24-48 hours. An extra couple of days in the fridge for the first go-round of starter hasn't been a problem.

jds, is this a two liter starter or one. Why can't I grasp this, I am getting pretty frusterated with my self
I apologize for me being an idiot.

 

[sparkyaber]

Palmer, and others say 1L starter is .5 cup (100g, whatever, they are close) and 2 cups of water. This is only about what 500 ml of wort. I still don't see where the Liter starter comes in.

And if that is a liter starter, could a guy just put in 1 cup dme to 1 liter of water and have a two liter starter, or is this considered a 1L starter.
See post above about how I am feeling about now.

 

[fratermus]

Palmer, and others say 1L starter is .5 cup (100g, whatever, they are close) and 2 cups of water. This is only about what 500 ml of wort. I still don't see where the Liter starter comes in.

I would be surprised to see page references where that recipe is stated for making a 1l starter.

On p73 Palmer says that .5c of DME = ~120ml, not 100g. I just did a quick measure of .5c on a scale and got about 65g.

The recipe you state is not suggested to be a liter starter in Palmer online that way, and it's not in Jamil's starter faq that way.

Palmer says:

Boil a pint (1/2 quart) of water and stir in 1/2 cup of DME.
...
I recommend that you add another pint or quart of wort to the Starter to build up the yeast population even more.

On page 74 of the book Palmer says you can step the volume up and that a 1qt starter would be sufficient. He does not claim that the recipe as given equals a liter.

Jamil says:

Add 1 gram of DME for every 10 ml of final volume. (If you're making a 2 liter starter, add water to 200 grams of DME until you have 2 liters total.)

 

[jds]

jds, is this a two liter starter or one. Why can't I grasp this, I am getting pretty frusterated with my self
I apologize for me being an idiot.

Don't worry. The starter size depends on the beer I'm brewing. I use the Jamil Z calculator at Mr Malty Pitching Rate Calculator to figure out how big of a starter I'll need, and then I round up to the nearest half liter. I measure out 100 grams of DME per liter (e.g. 150 grams for a 1.5l starter), boil and cool, pitch, cover, and chuck it on the stirplate.

A half-gallon is just under two liters (1.89 l), but my growler seems to have enough headspace that it will take 2l on the stirplate. YMMv, particularly if you're not stirring continuously. Any big enough container you can sanitize will work fine for starters.

Example: For 1.060 wort, 5.5 gallons, ale yeast, using a stirplate, the calculator says I need one vial of yeast in a one liter starter.

 

[sparkyaber]

fraturmus- yup I appologize, I reread Pages 73-74. I have another loose leaf set of instructions that are palmers instructions (almost to a T) with "Making a 1L starter"as the heading. Good, Glad I got that figured out. I did read that quote from Jamil after I posted. Did not make sense at the time, now it does. Thanks
Finding out that the instructions I had were wrong is parmount. It is much easier to understand.
Thanks for setting me strait on this guys, even though I still feel like a moron.