OK, so I go out to get a carboy to rack a stout into it and free up my bucket for another brew. I carry the bucket with the stout from the basement to the kitchen upstairs only to find the airlock bubbling again. It had stopped bubbling a week ago. Do I rack or wait now? It's bubbling like every 40 - 60 seconds or so
Another noobie question about racking to secondary
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Golddiggie
Well-Known Member
How long has it been in primary??
Personally, I would leave the stout along and just use the carboy as your new primary. Depending on the yeast, you might need a blow-off tube in the carboy (easy to do)... I've done several batches in 5 gallon primaries so far, with great results.
I would say to make sure you shield them from light while in there. I put mine in a dark room, wrapped in towels and sometimes with thick t-shirts over them.
The only buckets I use for brewing these days are the bottling bucket and those for measuring water, or for blow off tubes to go into (2 gallon pails/buckets there)... Something so nice about taking a peek through the side of a primary and seeing all that's going on there. :rockin:
Personally, I would leave the stout along and just use the carboy as your new primary. Depending on the yeast, you might need a blow-off tube in the carboy (easy to do)... I've done several batches in 5 gallon primaries so far, with great results.
I would say to make sure you shield them from light while in there. I put mine in a dark room, wrapped in towels and sometimes with thick t-shirts over them.
The only buckets I use for brewing these days are the bottling bucket and those for measuring water, or for blow off tubes to go into (2 gallon pails/buckets there)... Something so nice about taking a peek through the side of a primary and seeing all that's going on there. :rockin:
VTBrewer
Well-Known Member
Its probalby just off gassing. What was your OG and current SG? If you're racking to secondary its not critical that you've reached FG, though many prefer to wait for that if they are using a secondary.
OG 1.060 FG 1.015
So what use the 5 gal carboy as my primary next brew or rack the stout (2 weeks in the fermenter) to the carboy?
McGarnigle
Well-Known Member
If your next batch is 5 gallons, then don't use the 5g carboy for it. Rack the stout when you need to free the fermneter.
And you don't see any connection between what you did and your airlock bubbling? *shakes head*
If you guys would stop thinking of your airlock as a magic fermentation gauge, and realize it is just a vent, a valve to release any built up gasses, you would see the connection between the action of carrying a beer up a flight of stairs (and sloshing it around as you do so) and it's need to release any gasses that got produced or released during the action.
VTBrewer
Well-Known Member
I'd rack it. Your current SG is most likely your OG. I don't like using the 5 gallon carboys for fermenting.
And you don't see any connection between what you did and your airlock bubbling? *shakes head*
If you guys would stop thinking of your airlock as a magic fermentation gauge, and realize it is just a vent, a valve to release any built up gasses, you would see the connection between the action of carrying a beer up a flight of stairs (and sloshing it around as you do so) and it's need to release any gasses that got produced or released during the action.
I kinda did but need you folks to to make sure I don't do anything stoopid
Golddiggie
Well-Known Member
I would check the stout to see how close to being done it is...
If you're ok with the contamination risk involved when racking to secondary (and again to the bottling bucket) then go ahead. Personally, I would let it go one or two more weeks in primary, and (as long as it's ready) bottle it up.
For the carboy, I would also find out where the 5 gallon mark is on it... Typically, it's close to where the neck starts to taper inwards.
I'm brewing today, and will be using one of my 5 gallon carboy's as the primary. The brew will sit in that for the duration and then get bottled up. If you want to brew in something that is completely light tight, get a corny and convert it into a primary. I'll be doing that around next weekend. That will become my fourth primary that I'll be able to use...
Glad to see Revvy has poked his [very] wise head in here... :rockin:
Since coming to these boards, and learning more, I've come to not use the airlock as a gauge for what's actually going on inside the wort. SG readings (or from a refractor) will tell you what's going on. Spacing them a few days apart will also tell you if fermentation is still going on or not...
I've also come to find that that extra week or two on the yeast makes for a much nicer brew. No more 'need' to rack to get it to clear up. The yeast cleans up after itself when you give it more time too...
For a heavier brew, like a stout, I would let it ride on the yeast for at least 3-4 weeks... Lighter brews (in OG) can be ready earlier, depending on the yeast... Don't think that yeast works on a time clock, they don't. They'll be done, when they're done. We just have to wait until they've done all they're going to do. Brewing helps one learn more patience... Well, if you want good beer with any regularity that is.
If you're ok with the contamination risk involved when racking to secondary (and again to the bottling bucket) then go ahead. Personally, I would let it go one or two more weeks in primary, and (as long as it's ready) bottle it up.
For the carboy, I would also find out where the 5 gallon mark is on it... Typically, it's close to where the neck starts to taper inwards.
I'm brewing today, and will be using one of my 5 gallon carboy's as the primary. The brew will sit in that for the duration and then get bottled up. If you want to brew in something that is completely light tight, get a corny and convert it into a primary. I'll be doing that around next weekend. That will become my fourth primary that I'll be able to use...
Glad to see Revvy has poked his [very] wise head in here... :rockin:
Since coming to these boards, and learning more, I've come to not use the airlock as a gauge for what's actually going on inside the wort. SG readings (or from a refractor) will tell you what's going on. Spacing them a few days apart will also tell you if fermentation is still going on or not...
I've also come to find that that extra week or two on the yeast makes for a much nicer brew. No more 'need' to rack to get it to clear up. The yeast cleans up after itself when you give it more time too...
For a heavier brew, like a stout, I would let it ride on the yeast for at least 3-4 weeks... Lighter brews (in OG) can be ready earlier, depending on the yeast... Don't think that yeast works on a time clock, they don't. They'll be done, when they're done. We just have to wait until they've done all they're going to do. Brewing helps one learn more patience... Well, if you want good beer with any regularity that is.
Only hydrometer readings can tell you for sure if your stout is ready to bottle but since it's been a week since it stopped bubbling I can tell you for sure that it isn't really ready. Sure, if your hydrometer reading stays constant for 3 days it will be ok (you did take a hydrometer reading, didn't you) but giving it more time in the fermenter gives the yeast time to clean up some of the byproducts of fermentation. I prefer to leave mine for at least 3 weeks and 4 might be better.
Now, the bubbles you see are not renewed fermentation but instead are from the dissolved CO2 being disturbed by you moving the bucket.
I know the frustration of having a full fermenter when you want to brew again but instead of moving your beer too soon, go spend a few dollars (probably under $20) and buy a second fermenter bucket. Your beer will turn out better and you won't be as frustrated.
Now, the bubbles you see are not renewed fermentation but instead are from the dissolved CO2 being disturbed by you moving the bucket.
I know the frustration of having a full fermenter when you want to brew again but instead of moving your beer too soon, go spend a few dollars (probably under $20) and buy a second fermenter bucket. Your beer will turn out better and you won't be as frustrated.
I would plan ahead next time and be sure you have your primary in a location that you can siphon without having to move it... bring everything to your primary, not the other way around.
I would say you have disturbed it enough to cause some bubbling. Same thing happens when you rack to your secondary, some bubbling will occur after everything is settled.
Once you have it where you are going to siphon, let it sit for a day or two and give time for everything to settle back down. Your secondary is for clarity or dry hopping, so by moving it you have stirred up a lot of stuff that you want to avoid siphoning into your secondary
I would say you have disturbed it enough to cause some bubbling. Same thing happens when you rack to your secondary, some bubbling will occur after everything is settled.
Once you have it where you are going to siphon, let it sit for a day or two and give time for everything to settle back down. Your secondary is for clarity or dry hopping, so by moving it you have stirred up a lot of stuff that you want to avoid siphoning into your secondary
Golddiggie
Well-Known Member
I kinda did but need you folks to to make sure I don't do anything stoopid
Let it ride on the yeast for another week or two... We won't think any less of you if you do that... Being patient with the yeast is a good thing.
I racked it to the secondary Better bottle 5 gal carboy. I got back to see some of you recommended I leave it on the yeast another week. I probably would have but pulled the trigger too soon.
That stout has been in the primary 2 weeks I'll leave it in the secondary for another 2 weeks then I'll bottle in which it will stay in bottles for at least a month before I open one up.
Next time I'll let it sit 3 weeks in the primary and 1 week in the secondary. What do ya think!?
Thanks for your help guys!:rockin:
That stout has been in the primary 2 weeks I'll leave it in the secondary for another 2 weeks then I'll bottle in which it will stay in bottles for at least a month before I open one up.
Next time I'll let it sit 3 weeks in the primary and 1 week in the secondary. What do ya think!?
Thanks for your help guys!:rockin:
Golddiggie
Well-Known Member
Longer primary, zero secondary... Get more carboy's/primary fermenters... Brew the recipe again, and skip the secondary, using just a ~4 week primary... Or brew a double batch, using a secondary for half, and just long primary for the other half... Chances are, they'll either be the same, or the long primary will be better... Same results, or better, with less work is a win in my book.
I've noticed that my brews are better since I went to the long primary model. Of course, I've also gone all grain, which could have something to do with the better brew too.
Whatever you do, just remember... RDWHAHB
Isn't it possible around here for a guy to say he wants to secondary a beer? Ideally he would have more primaries and not need to rack, but that's not the case here. As far as the sanitation risk, if you can't rack a beer without infecting it then you probably can't brew consistently decent beer. There is nothing wrong with moving the beer off the yeast at this point and in some cases you don't want to "clean up" everything. Some of what you are cleaning up is part of the profile of certain styles. Longer is not always better while I'm on the subject. Sorry about the rant but everyone of these threads ends up with the same rhetoric about long primaries instead of actually solving the OP's problem or answering his question. There is more than one way to do things. Btw Golddiggie, you shouldn't measure the gravity of fermented wort with a refractometer. You need a hydrometer at that point.
VTBrewer
Well-Known Member
I tend to agree, he wanted to know if he could rack to secondary to free up his primary, and yeah, he can and still have a fine beer.
As far as the refracto goes, yep, there sure is more than one way to do things. Using a refracto all the way thru the process is fine. You just need to have a way to convert it. Here's a link for a spread sheet that somebody gave me a few years ago on here.
www.clubhomebrew.com/refracto.xls
As far as the refracto goes, yep, there sure is more than one way to do things. Using a refracto all the way thru the process is fine. You just need to have a way to convert it. Here's a link for a spread sheet that somebody gave me a few years ago on here.
www.clubhomebrew.com/refracto.xls
I had the same dilemma! Last night I racked my stout to a secondary. Mainly to free up the primary for another batch. The prospect of another brew was greater than the risk of infection. Besides, I know my sanitation skills are better than my brewing skills.
For us bucket users, its the first time we get a glimpse and taste of our brew! I say RACK IT!
For us bucket users, its the first time we get a glimpse and taste of our brew! I say RACK IT!
haha yeah it seems to be the most constant answer you get when bringing up this subject from the "members with upgraded accounts"
jk. I like cleaning things up a bit, it makes it real easy to not get any unwanted particles when transferring again into my bottling bucket.haha yeah it seems to be the most constant answer you get when bringing up this subject from the "members with upgraded accounts"
But not any easier than leaving it it in the primary
haha yeah it seems to be the most constant answer you get when bringing up this subject from the "members with upgraded accounts"
Well, maybe those "members with upgraded accounts" know some **** about this. And have been doing this no secondary thing for YEARS...and if we didn't think it made our beers clearer and better tasting, we wouldn't still be doing it, and advocating it, would we?
This is my yeastcake for my Sri Lankin Stout that sat in primary for 5 weeks. Notice how tight the yeast cake is? None of that got racked over to my bottling bucket. And the beer is extremely clear.
That little bit of beer to the right is all of the 5 gallons that DIDN'T get vaccumed off the surface of the tight trub. When I put 5 gallons in my fermenter, I tend to get 5 gallons into bottles. The cake itself is like cement, it's about an inch thick and very, very dense, you can't just tilt your bucket and have it fall out. I had to use water pressure to get it to come out.
I average 52, 12 ounce bottles/5 gallon batch doing it this way? Can anyone say that with 5 gallons starting out, using a secondary?
This is the last little bit of the same beer in the bottling bucket, this is the only sediment that made it though and that was done on purpose, when I rack I always make sure to rub the autosiphon across the bottom of the primary to make sure there's plenty of yeast in suspension to carb the beer, but my bottles are all crystal clear and have little sediment in them.
Half the time I forget to use moss, and you can't tell the difference in clarity.
The only filtering I've ever done has been through my kidneys.
I get the barest hint of sediment in my bottles....just enough for the yeast to have done the job of carbonating the beer.
In all the years I've been enterring contests, just about every beer I've entered the judges comment on the clarity of my beer, and usually the crispness of the taste as well.
So maybe with "upgraded accounts" comes "upgraded experience" as well?
*shrug*
Az just posted this in another thread, about long primarying in a bucket.
I was told the same thing. They warned of the results of fermenting in an ale pail for ~2 months.......the results? gold medal beers.
Revy good post thanks for the photos. Kinda puts things into perspective for me
Note to self: Get more buckets!
Don't feel bad about that 5 gallon carboy, put it to use as a fermenter for 3 gallon experimental batches. It will work fine with an airlock on it
.
Don't feel bad about that 5 gallon carboy, put it to use as a fermenter for 3 gallon experimental batches. It will work fine with an airlock on it
Or wait til he discovers the joys of apfelwein. That is where many a 5 gallon former secondary goes to retire.....
Rockape66
Well-Known Member
When I am going to rack a brew; I move it the day before to let anything I stirred up settle back out before I rack. There is no sense in racking everything you wanted to get rid of right into your secondary. Bump, Revv.
Well, maybe those "members with upgraded accounts" know some **** about this. And have been doing this no secondary thing for YEARS...and if we didn't think it made our beers clearer and better tasting, we wouldn't still be doing it, and advocating it, would we?
So maybe with "upgraded accounts" comes "upgraded experience" as well?
*shrug*
You can't buy experience with an upgraded account. I don't have an upgraded account and I've only been on this forum for 4 months or so but I've been brewing for 13 years. My point wasn't that extended primaries are worse, I do extended primaries. I only secondary for lagering or other long aging (and I use kegs for that). My point was that the guy asked a question about when to transfer in order to free up his primary. I gave him advice to measure the gravity and rack if it's done. I should have also told him in the future to buy more buckets so he wouldn't have to rush things in the future. That's decent advice I think. But then came the usual crowd of people who believe that you can't secondary under any circumstance citing things such as an increased risk of infection (which is about as ridiculous as autolysis in book). If you really want to cite the risks of secondary they would be the risk of oxygenation and the longer conditioning/cleaning up time. Conditioning happens much quicker ime when the beer sits on the yeast a little longer and one less transfer certainly limits my beers exposure to oxygen. Since I know how to sanitize, infection isn't really much of a risk. Anyway, my point is that long primaries are the best option but not the answer to this question.
As far as refractometers go, yes you can run them through a formula but hydro's are more accurate and don't require the extra effort. You could weigh the mass if you wanted as well but who would want to. Buy a hydro to measure the fg and use your refracto (you really only need it for AG) for og. That's how the pros do it.
mlyday
Well-Known Member
I take everything I read on these forums as suggestions not gospel. Experience is the best teacher. My first few batches were 2 weeks in the primary and out to the secondary. Then I read about people saying to leave it in the primary for 4 weeks, so I tried it. After the 4 weeks I still rack to a secondary with gelatine for a week, but it was clear enough I probably didnt need to. And that beer was the best one I had made, so now I do that everytime. Take what everyone says as a suggestion and maybe try them, but dont take them as hard and fast rules.
Well put mlyday. Sorry for my crabbiness, I promised my wife I would skip a brew day (because I spent money I wasn't supposed to) and I haven't brewed in almost a month now. No excuse but it might explain why I've been crabby the last couple of days. Brewing an American Brown on Sunday and I can't wait!
Yeah I appreciate everyone's input. I was thinking of taking a particular beer that I like and brewing the same batch with different resting times after it's done fermenting and just sort of experimenting based on what I learned here.
this is soo much fun though, all I think about is what my next brew will be.
mlyday
Well-Known Member
Yep there are no rules, its your beer. If you always do the same thing youll never learn anything. One thing I want to try that I havent done yet is brew one batch and try 3 different yeasts on the same wort. This would help me distinguish what flavor each yeast actually give the beer since the rest of the ingredients all come from the same batch of wort.
revgreen
New Member
I've currently got a Belgian Trippel sitting in a 5g primary bucket in my room. I was thinking of letting it sit in the primary for a few weeks, and then moving it to secondary, where we would let it sit for a few months. Are we better off doing that, or the opposite (keeping it in primary for as long as possible, and then moving it to secondary)? Or does this make little to no difference?
Normally if I intend to bulk age, I rack it to a secondary after a month.
