amazing deals on honey and cider
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The NYC Target had the Market Pantry Spiced Cider on clearance for $2.58. Best price I have seen so I picked up 5 gallons. Hope it makes a good spiced hard cider!
On a side note, I like how I now habitually check the prices of AJ and cider in any store I walk into
On a side note, I like how I now habitually check the prices of AJ and cider in any store I walk into
Darklordenron
Well-Known Member
Same deal in VA I saw it today. Was hesitant because it contained some acid and I wasn't sure if I could use it (it was my first cider batch today!) hindsight? I'll go back tomorrow and pick some up if it is ok to use!
The acid in question is malic acid, and it's on the ok list, in-fact malic acid is naturally present in all apples. It is sometimes added to bring up the acidity level and tartness of the juice.
So stock up on some juice Darklord!
So stock up on some juice Darklord!
Darklordenron
Well-Known Member
DoctorWho said:
Tomorrow is the day! Listen, since I have your attention, I've got some noobie questions.
1. Do I simply let ferment and bottle/carb as I would with beer?
2. Are any timeframes different than with beer's usual 2-2-2 rule?
3. What is a safe temperature to ferment this at? Right now my little keg reads 72. Not certain if this is must/wort temp or ambient temp..
I've just been reading a lot lately and some sources say to rack to a secondary for up to three months. Necessary or no? First time for everything, but there doesn't seem to be an idiots guide in this section of the site
Rockape66
Well-Known Member
First: the old "2-2-2" rule is out the window. Yes you can just ferment it and bottle carb as with beer. I suggest taste testing your results first. Many of us like to back sweeten with a non-fermentable sugar. I use stevia myself. Fermentation can take longer than with beer. Check the O.G. with a hydrometer, and you can adjust the gravity with other fermentables to your desired ABV level; assume close to 1.000 FG. Once you have a stable final gravity, you can rack to secondary for clarification and cold crashing if you can. Malic acid and Ascorbic acid are both acceptable in your juice, but avoid Potassium Sorbate. Have fun!
Darklordenron,
What recipe are you using? A lot depends on the ingredients.
But generally what rockape66 said, with the addition that time is definitely your friend on cider. They really only get better the longer they age (typically, at least 2 months.)
Let me know your recipe and i'll be more specific.
Welcome to the cider side of Homebrewing!
-The Doctor
What recipe are you using? A lot depends on the ingredients.
But generally what rockape66 said, with the addition that time is definitely your friend on cider. They really only get better the longer they age (typically, at least 2 months.)
Let me know your recipe and i'll be more specific.
Welcome to the cider side of Homebrewing!
-The Doctor
Darklordenron
Well-Known Member
I've posted the recipe in my first or second post. It's just something I came up with, it's nit really a recipe, just what I figured should go into a cider to make it decent for my first go at it.
Should I rack to secondary in a few weeks once fermentation ceases and leave it there for a few months or just bottle and let it age that way? Both? Kind of confused on the timeline of events for cider.. :/
Should I rack to secondary in a few weeks once fermentation ceases and leave it there for a few months or just bottle and let it age that way? Both? Kind of confused on the timeline of events for cider.. :/
Darklordenron
Well-Known Member
Also, how do you backsweeten?
Ok, I found your recipe:
2 gal. Apple cider (natural, obviously)
2 cups dark brown sugar
2 oz. Peach extract
1/2 packet Lalvin K1-1115 wine yeast
Just kind of heated it up a bit, mixed everything together and pitched at around 80 (high as hell I know, but it wouldnt cool quickly enough for my liking and behaved differently than beers I've brewed. It is an experiment and it's currently in my basement at around 55f.
So, my advice is...experiment! Obviously, the longer you let the stuff age the better it will taste. If you are fermenting at 55f, that's lower than normal (68f) so it might take a few weeks or a month longer than at 68.
Racking to secondary is more for clarity than aging. It will age the same in bottles or secondary. So that one is up to you.
I would just let it go in the primary for a few months until fermentation stops and it clears up and then go straight to bottling.
To backsweeten, you add non fermentable sugars(splenda, xylitol, lactose, ect) at the time of bottling. Again, this is up to you, as your cider might not need it due to the yeast or peach extract. Time can also help this one a lot, because the number one complaint about cider is that it tastes watery, hoochy, and not very apple flavored in the beginning, but as time goes on the apple taste comes back and the hot alcohol flavor mellows.
Hope this helps!
2 gal. Apple cider (natural, obviously)
2 cups dark brown sugar
2 oz. Peach extract
1/2 packet Lalvin K1-1115 wine yeast
Just kind of heated it up a bit, mixed everything together and pitched at around 80 (high as hell I know, but it wouldnt cool quickly enough for my liking and behaved differently than beers I've brewed. It is an experiment and it's currently in my basement at around 55f.
So, my advice is...experiment! Obviously, the longer you let the stuff age the better it will taste. If you are fermenting at 55f, that's lower than normal (68f) so it might take a few weeks or a month longer than at 68.
Racking to secondary is more for clarity than aging. It will age the same in bottles or secondary. So that one is up to you.
I would just let it go in the primary for a few months until fermentation stops and it clears up and then go straight to bottling.
To backsweeten, you add non fermentable sugars(splenda, xylitol, lactose, ect) at the time of bottling. Again, this is up to you, as your cider might not need it due to the yeast or peach extract. Time can also help this one a lot, because the number one complaint about cider is that it tastes watery, hoochy, and not very apple flavored in the beginning, but as time goes on the apple taste comes back and the hot alcohol flavor mellows.
Hope this helps!
Darklordenron
Well-Known Member
DoctorWho said:
I normally do that with beer because the wort temperature usually rises about 5-10 degrees in the initial fermentation phase. It has a nice layer of krausen (that's what beer makers call the foam, dunno what it would be in this situation) and its emitting pretty pleasing odors.
It does, thank you! So I did do it right?
Yep, you'll have a cider on your hands in a while!
As for temps, I have never used k1-1115, but the few that I have used ferment slower and so the wort doesn't change in temp. Only the Graff cider, which used Nottingham ale yeast ever had krausen. Your Milage may very, but at most it will just take more/less time to ferment.
The real sign of when things are finished (as, I take it) is when the cider clears up.
As for temps, I have never used k1-1115, but the few that I have used ferment slower and so the wort doesn't change in temp. Only the Graff cider, which used Nottingham ale yeast ever had krausen. Your Milage may very, but at most it will just take more/less time to ferment.
The real sign of when things are finished (as, I take it) is when the cider clears up.
Darklordenron
Well-Known Member
DoctorWho said:
Do I simply let it sit on the trub for as long as fermentation takes to finish up? Should I get it off as soon as it is done fermenting and go to bottling then?
Doc, you've been really helpful, can't thank you enough!
With cider it isn't as important to get it off the trub, because it's really just the yeast. I am just following the advice of people like Edwort and Brando O, who have some seriously good apfelwein and cider, respectively. They say that secondary aging is not necessary.
If you were at a hotter ferment temperature I would recommend racking to the secondary, but for a few months, I don't think it will do anything to leave it alone in the primary. At hotter temps there is some concern that the yeast cake can produce off flavors.
It won't hurt it to secondary it (and will probably clear it a little faster) so it's up to you, I just don't.
If you were at a hotter ferment temperature I would recommend racking to the secondary, but for a few months, I don't think it will do anything to leave it alone in the primary. At hotter temps there is some concern that the yeast cake can produce off flavors.
It won't hurt it to secondary it (and will probably clear it a little faster) so it's up to you, I just don't.
Darklordenron
Well-Known Member
Cool, thanks. Just picked up as much of the sale spiced cider as I could afford. I think I walked out if there with about 13 gallons. They definitely didn't have any left after I got out of the store
With stuff this easy to make, a few 5 gallon carboys won't be missed for a couple months!
Is it necessary to pasteurize the stuff after I bottle? I hear of people doing things like this and am curious if it's in my best interest (or the chicks who will be drinking it, haha)
Also, sorry for the thread hijack, really didn't mean to do that :/
With stuff this easy to make, a few 5 gallon carboys won't be missed for a couple months!
Is it necessary to pasteurize the stuff after I bottle? I hear of people doing things like this and am curious if it's in my best interest (or the chicks who will be drinking it, haha)
Also, sorry for the thread hijack, really didn't mean to do that :/
I doubt you will need to pasteurize. This is done to kill the yeast when it is still active, like when you are trying to achieve a sweet cider that is still bottle conditioned.
If you let your cider finish fermentation, which is confirmed by several hydrometer readings a few days apart, then there is no reason to pasteurize, even if you prime with sugar to carbonate in the bottle.
Also sorry for the tread hijack. But nice to share info with a new cider maker!
If you let your cider finish fermentation, which is confirmed by several hydrometer readings a few days apart, then there is no reason to pasteurize, even if you prime with sugar to carbonate in the bottle.
Also sorry for the tread hijack. But nice to share info with a new cider maker!
Darklordenron
Well-Known Member
But I am shooting for a sweet cider. Not over the top but definitely noticeable. Should I simply back sweeten? Also, how does one back sweeten exactly?
dcHokie
Well-Known Member
The NYC Target had the Market Pantry Spiced Cider on clearance for $2.58. Best price I have seen so I picked up 5 gallons. Hope it makes a good spiced hard cider!
On a side note, I like how I now habitually check the prices of AJ and cider in any store I walk into
How is this Target Spiced Cider for Apfelwein? My Target had it marked down to $1.84/gallon so I just started a new batch with it this weekend...can't beat a full batch for under $10.
I started my spiced cider test gallon batch last week, so I am at least 2 months from an answer. But I think as long as you have the time to let it age you could pretty much use apple flavored gasoline and it would come out tasting great.
And then you'd go blind.
And then you'd go blind.
Darklordenron
Well-Known Member
They just reduced it further to 1.89 or close to it, so you know I had to pick up some more today! Mine is about ready to secondary this week, so I will keep it updated with my findings. You never know, this stuff could be money. Or it could be completely terrible, but I just have to find out!
dcHokie
Well-Known Member
An update on this Target Spiced Cider Apfelwein for anyone interested:
I used 5 full gallons of the spiced cider, 2 lbs of dextrose and pitched a slurry of Wyeast 3711 French Saison yeast. I took a gravity reading last night after just over 3 weeks, it is sitting at 1.000 and is champagne pale. The sample tasted great; had some of the residual spice in muted notes of clove and pear, and a bit of a grassy, earthy twang from the yeast. I'll probably let it sit another month or so, but this batch is gonna be great!
I'll share my update on Target Spiced Cider, as well:
I made a 5 gal batch of heaven, I mean Graff, and separated 1 gal using the spiced cider and 1/4 of the wort. It was in primary for 1 month and I bottled it today.
Smelled amazing and the sample was very flavorful. Orange and clove notes mixed with the malt and hops! A little strong (but also sweet) on the first sip as those flavors battle out, but subsequent tastings were much smoother as my palate adjusted. In 2-3 weeks when it's carb'ed I'll let you know, but I expect good things!
I made a 5 gal batch of heaven, I mean Graff, and separated 1 gal using the spiced cider and 1/4 of the wort. It was in primary for 1 month and I bottled it today.
Smelled amazing and the sample was very flavorful. Orange and clove notes mixed with the malt and hops! A little strong (but also sweet) on the first sip as those flavors battle out, but subsequent tastings were much smoother as my palate adjusted. In 2-3 weeks when it's carb'ed I'll let you know, but I expect good things!
Darklordenron
Well-Known Member
DoctorWho said:
What was your recipe again? Hops and malt were added?
Well, I did an AG version of Brandon O's Graff and used fuggles as my choice of hops. When making that I used regular Motts for most of it, but used the spiced cider to make a 1 gal batch. Basically, you make the beer wort from the Graff recipe, split into 1/4 gallon (or only make 1/4 recipe) and add to Target spiced cider and then add nottingham yeast.
If you haven't tried Graff before, I highly suggest it. It's very good.
renshaw
Well-Known Member
ignore this post
dcHokie
Well-Known Member
DoctorWho how'd your batch of Graff with this Spiced Cider turn out?? I forgot about mine and just saw the fermenter in the back of a closet...going on 6 months in primary.
It turned out so much better than I would have thought. The cider right out of the bottle (the non fermented stuff) tastes a little harsh to me, but once it's fermented and given a few months to mellow it's really nice stuff.
I get a nice mix of honey/clove/orange that then gives way to the apple flavour. I liked it so much I made a new batch just now to get ready for fall. I highly recommend trying it, and it's so easy because the juice is pre-spiced. No need for guessing how much spices to add!
I get a nice mix of honey/clove/orange that then gives way to the apple flavour. I liked it so much I made a new batch just now to get ready for fall. I highly recommend trying it, and it's so easy because the juice is pre-spiced. No need for guessing how much spices to add!
Darklordenron
Well-Known Member
I left mine fermenting in secondary for at LEAST 4 months now...wonder if it's still ok or should I just chuck it? I just forgot about it completely! Man I never do that with beer and if I did, I would most definitely pitch it down the drain..
dcHokie
Well-Known Member
Walk away from the fermentor! Don't dump
It should be fine, likely better, there are plenty of folks that have let apfelwein go for 1 year+
Yeah, 4 months is a great time for secondary...the main problem that people seem to encounter in cider is if you leave it in the primary for too long the lees can throw some funky flavors into the cider after a few months, but in secondary I have gone 6 months (and would like to go more but usually don't have the patience) with no problems. And the result is a wonderful mellow flavored cider.
