All Late/First Wort Hopped Rye IIPA

[Ouroboros]

I am turning into a hopeless hop addict. I've barely put a dent in my last IIPA and I'm already planning another. I want to take a different direction this time - pine, spice, and cannabis aromas with less pronounced citrus presence. The hop bill is an amalgamation of things I've stumbled across on this site. 13 oz of hops seems ridiculous, but it seems to be the only way to get the IBU's. I'm shooting for ~ 100. I'm intrigued to see what the effects of FWH/late additions will be. The grain bill is basically my roggenbier with Maris Otter taking the place of the pilsner malt and some of the rye. And yes, I'm aware that OG > 1.100 is out of style for an IIPA, but I did that with my last IIPA and am pleased with the result (even though the beer is still green).

Any input would be greatly appreciated, especially concerning the hops. Are the amounts, timing, and varieties appropriate? Should I stick with FWH, or just move the first wort hops to the 20 min mark? Thanks!!

===== Vital Statistics =====

Volume: 6 gal
Projected OG: 1.103
Projected FG: 1.031
IBU: 107
ABV: 9.4%
(Assuming 70% attenuation and mash efficiency)

===== Fermentables =====

6 lb Maris Otter
6 lb Malted Rye
3 lb Munich
0.75 lb Crystal 40
0.25 lb Special B
0.125 lb Roasted Barley

3 lb Extra Light DME
2 lb Honey

Saccharification rest at 150F for 90 min or until negative iodine test. After 30 minutes of mashing, pull a decoction, hold at 156F for 30 min, and boil 15 min Add decoction to raise mash >170F.

===== Hops =====

First Wort Hops - Bitterness Calculated as a 20 min addition
2.0 oz Millennium (17.6% AA)
1.0 oz Columbus (14.2% AA)
1.0 oz Simcoe (12.4% AA)

15 min
0.5 oz Nugget (12.5% AA)
0.5 oz Columbus (14.2% AA)
0.5 oz Simcoe (12.4% AA)

10 min
0.5 oz Nugget (12.5% AA)
0.5 oz Columbus (14.2% AA)
0.5 oz Simcoe (12.4% AA)

5 min
0.5 oz Chinook (11.7% AA)
0.5 oz Columbus (14.2% AA)
0.5 oz Simcoe (12.4% AA)

1 min
0.5 oz Chinook (11.7% AA)
0.5 oz Columbus (14.2% AA)
0.5 oz Simcoe (12.4% AA)

Dry Hop
1 oz Nugget (12.5% AA)
1 oz Simcoe (12.4% AA)
2 oz Columbus (14.2% AA)

===== Yeast =====

2L Rogue pacman starter, stepped up in 1.040, 1.080, 1.100 wort. Ferment at 60-64F.

 

[artguy]

About the FWH, I've been bittering with FWH instead of 60 minute additions for Pale Ales recently, and it seems to me that the bitterness level is pretty similar, so I'm a bit skeptical that FWH really tastes like a 20 minute addition. I haven't got hard science or side-by-side experiments to back up my impressions, and I know a lot of people do calculate FWH = 20 min. so YMMV, but wither way you'll end up with plenty of hop bitterness and flavor/aroma in that brew!

 

[mans]

FWH does not give the same bitterness as a 20 minute addition. You boil the hops for 60-75-90-whatever minutes and soak them for some time before that as well. So you actually get a bit more bitterness that you'd get from a 60-75-90 minute addition.

 

[Ouroboros]

FWH does not give the same bitterness as a 20 minute addition. You boil the hops for 60-75-90-whatever minutes and soak them for some time before that as well. So you actually get a bit more bitterness that you'd get from a 60-75-90 minute addition.

I've read that the concentration of iso-alpha acids after FWH is on par with that of a 90-minute addition, but the subjective level of bitterness is like a 20 minute addition and the character of the bitterness is somehow different - perhaps less harsh while more flavor is preserved. I'm really confused by that, but I've read it in a lot of places and people who FWH love it.

 

[maskednegator]

That's a barleywine, bro, and a delicious-sounding one at that.
Only issue I see is the presence of roasted barley. Why?

 

[Ouroboros]

That's a barleywine, bro, and a delicious-sounding one at that.
Only issue I see is the presence of roasted barley. Why?

Barleywine? I thought those weren't supposed to be as hoppy as an IIPA. I'm happy to call it whatever is most appropriate. I was going to add the roasted barley for color adjustment. Just wanted it a little darker.

 

[HokieBrewer]

American Barleywines are really hoppy. Grab a fresh Sierra Nevada Bigfoot for a classic example of the style.

But potato potahto, sounds great either way.

 

[Ouroboros]

I brewed this awhile ago after making some changes to keep the recipe more along the lines of an IIPA so that I could drink it sooner. I figured I should give a little update.

I missed my mash temperature and was concerned that the beer was going to end up as watery rocket fuel. Fortunately that wasn't the case. It's light in body and high in alcohol, but you don't notice any heat from higher alcohols. This beer is probably my favorite creation to date. The hop intensity has started to fade from what I remembered of hydrometer samples and earlier bottles, but it is still full of citrus and pine. Definitely on my list of things to brew again. I don't have a camera, but I'll try to find a way to get some pics.

===== Batch Info =====

Volume: 5.5 gal
OG: 1.083
FG: 1.017
IBU: 112
ABV: 8.9%
Apparent attenuation: 80%

===== Fermentables =====

6 lb Maris Otter
6 lb Malted Rye
3 lb Munich
0.75 lb Crystal 40
0.25 lb Special B
0.125 lb Roasted Barley
1.5 lb Dextrose

Add 1 lb rice hulls to mash tun. Single infusion rest at 153F for 60 min (I missed my target temperature and mashed at 151F for 90 minutes).

===== Hops =====

60 min
1.0 oz Millennium (17.6% AA)

20, 15, 10 min
0.5 oz Nugget (12.5% AA)
0.5 oz Columbus (14.2% AA)
0.5 oz Simcoe (12.4% AA)

5 min, flameout
0.5 oz Chinook (11.7% AA)
0.5 oz Columbus (14.2% AA)
0.5 oz Simcoe (12.4% AA)

Dry (2 weeks)
1 oz Nugget (12.5% AA)
1 oz Simcoe (12.4% AA)
2 oz Columbus (14.2% AA)

===== Yeast =====

Pacman, cultured from a 6-pack of Dead Guy Ale. The fermenter was held at 62F for 1 week, after which the temperature was allowed to rise freely. Dry hops were added to the primary once terminal gravity was attained.