Adding Coriander and Orange Peel to Belgian Wheat

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kyle6286

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Hello,

I'm reading a lot of different opinions on when and how long to steep the orange peel and coriander. I'm making a Belgian Witbier tonight. The coriander came crushed and it looks like cinnamon. The guy from Midwest said to throw it right into the wort but I've read that leaving coriander and orange peel in the primary fermenter can result in overwhelming flavors. My lhbs is closed today so if I decide to steep them in a muslin bag, I can't buy any today. I only have one muslin bag which will be used for the grains and hops. Can I add the orange peel and coriander to the same bag the hops are in, or am I better off just throwing them into the boil without a bag? Any advice on what to do would be great.

The recipe came with 1 oz bitter orange peel and 1 oz crushed coriander. Also not sure how much to use of each. I've read 1 oz of coriander for a 5 gallon batch can be too much.

Sorry for asking this as I've seen it discussed in a few older threads, but I am brewing tonight and just want to ensure I don't screw anything up. It's only my second batch. Thank you in advance!
 

Wagon_6

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I crush fresh coriander and add both directly to the boil. Between 5 and 10 minutes left in the boil for the coriander and the last minute or two for the bitter orange peel. I've used 1 oz of coriander and it wasn't overloaded with flavor. If it's a kit you purchased, roll with it and RDWHAHB!
 

bgruis

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I have a really good Belgian Wheat Recipe so I've done this ton's.

For a 5 gallon batch...

1.25 tsp corriander seeds at 10 mins left in the boil
.33 oz sweet orange peel at 5 mins left in the boil

Assuming you don't dump the whole boil into the ferementer you will be leaving the seeds and orange peel behind when you transer out of the BK.

Prost!
 
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kyle6286

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Ok, so I'll add them both directly to the boil and auto-siphon the wort into my primary, hopefully leaving behind any residue (orange peel, coriander). Thanks for the help! I love this forum!
 

onipar

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I guess I'm late to the party, but I thought I'd put my two cents in since the only beer I've made so far (which is still fermenting) was a Blue Moon Clone with these ingredients. My lhbs told us to use "no more than 3/4 ounce" of each ingredient into the boil. I used 1/2 ounce of each figuring that way I'd be able to make another batch with the other 1/2 ounce, rather than having a 1/4 ounce left with no use. (They were 1 ounce bags).

I put mine into a little muslin bag the lhbs gave us. I think he said to let it boil for 10 or 15 minutes, but I ended up leaving it in for more like 25 minutes. Not sure if that ruined the flavor.

I will say when I tasted a hydrometer sample at about 6 days in, I couldn't detect any of the orange or coriander flavor. Not sure if it's more pronounced after maturation...

Good luck!
 

PhelanKA7

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I'm not a fan of coriander myself so don't ever use it but I typically boil 1 oz. sweet orange peel in a muslin bag for the last 30 mins in my Belgian wheats. It doesn't impart a noticeable orange flavor for the beers I make. It can make for a forward citrusy note if that makes sense but it's not overpowering or noticeably "orange flavored." I think only .5 oz more peel would make the orange much more noticeable if that is what you're going for.
 
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kyle6286

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Just finished brewing. Things went smoothly except for the transferring wort part. As I mentioned, I didn't have additional muslin bags for the powdered coriander and orange peel. After cooling my wort, I tried to create a whirlpool using my stirring spoon to no avail. Not sure why this didn't work. I looked for a while but I couldn't find how long to stir so I did it for a minute. Anyways, this didn't work so I just auto-siphoned and left the last inch or so in the brew pot. After I finished, I did see a bunch of the orange peel at the bottom of the pot so I did avoid to suck a lot up. Hopefully I didn't get much, if any, into my primary fermenter.
 

bgruis

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I've made this beer like 8 or 10 times, I've never worried about getting pieces of orange into the fermenter and my beers have come out phenomenal....so...If I were you...I certainly wouldnt worry.
 

bgruis

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You could, however most recipes here (that I've seen are based upon dried orange peel ) the reason thats significant is the moisture content. 3/4 tsp of zest vs 3/4 tsp dried peel are two totally different things.

In other words, yes you could, however I think you would need to do some experimenting to get the amounts right.

Prost!
 
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kyle6286

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bgruis said:
I've made this beer like 8 or 10 times, I've never worried about getting pieces of orange into the fermenter and my beers have come out phenomenal....so...If I were you...I certainly wouldnt worry.

Thanks for the reassurance. I hope you're right :)
 

Veaderko

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I’ve made this recipe two different ways. 1st batch was with the coriander and orange peel dumped right into my primary. The 2nd was strain out the coriander and orange peel. I made these both the same day as an experiment, and tried to do everything exactly the same. The majority of people like there 1st batch more than the 2nd. I also liked the 1st batch the most. And in reality it only really matters if I like it because I will be the one drinking it. So I say the next time that you make this batch, maybe try it another way to see what you think.
Cheers!
 
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kyle6286

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Veaderko said:
I’ve made this recipe two different ways. 1st batch was with the coriander and orange peel dumped right into my primary. The 2nd was strain out the coriander and orange peel. I made these both the same day as an experiment, and tried to do everything exactly the same. The majority of people like there 1st batch more than the 2nd. I also liked the 1st batch the most. And in reality it only really matters if I like it because I will be the one drinking it. So I say the next time that you make this batch, maybe try it another way to see what you think.
Cheers!

Good to know. Does the orange peel and coriander dissolve eventually after two weeks in the fermenter, or did you have to leave it behind when you siphoned to the bottling bucket?
 

Veaderko

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I noticed that there was "some" coriander and orange peel left behind. Cant say exactly how much was, but there was some left in the primary.
 
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kyle6286

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It's been one week in the fermenter and my beer is still showing signs of fermentation. Although I'm using a 6.5 gallon ale pail, I replaced my airlock with a blow-off tube that is resting in some star san in case of any overflow. The star san is still bubbling a few times every 10 seconds or so. I'm wondering when this is going to stop. I'll prob wait until this Friday to take a hydrometer reading. My last batch, an amber ale, appeared as though it had completely fermented within the first few days. The difference with this batch is I used wyeast activator 3944 with a starter. Hopefully it settles down soon because I'm very anxious to try this one out.
 

Homebrewtruth

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It depends which brand of Belgian Wit you're trying to emulate. For Wits like Du Monde Blanc/Hoegaarden, use about an oz of both and do leave them in the primary fermenter (these are heavy, one could even say overbearing, on the spices and fruit). The orange and coriander flavour diminishes once it is bottled but will then pick up again after 2/3 weeks in the bottle. For other Wits, e.g.Leffe, don't use so much and/or strain before transferring the wort to the fermenter.
 

tipping

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Since you guys are discussing Belgian wheat. I have a question about Belgian wheat yeast 3942. Saturday I ran down to my beer guys and picked up the ingredients for a Bavarian hefeweizen. I told him I was going for a bavarian hefe similar to a Doppel weizen. After getting my stuff home I noticed he gave me Belgian wheat yeast 3942, my question is how will this effect my bavarian Hefe? Because I was expecting a different kinda yeast for this batch of beer. Will I still get the banana clove flavor or not?
 

OHIOSTEVE

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I use Mccormicks spices in my blue moon clone.. .17 oz of coriander @ 15 mins, 1/2 oz valencia orange peel at 5 mins. pretty tasty brews if I do say so.
 

VillageBrew

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Since you guys are discussing Belgian wheat. I have a question about Belgian wheat yeast 3942. Saturday I ran down to my beer guys and picked up the ingredients for a Bavarian hefeweizen. I told him I was going for a bavarian hefe similar to a Doppel weizen. After getting my stuff home I noticed he gave me Belgian wheat yeast 3942, my question is how will this effect my bavarian Hefe? Because I was expecting a different kinda yeast for this batch of beer. Will I still get the banana clove flavor or not?

Not at all! Wyeast Labs describes it as "Isolated from a small Belgian brewery, this strain produces beers with moderate esters and minimal phenolics. Apple, bubblegum and plum-like aromas blend nicely with malt and hops. This strain will finish dry with a hint of tartness." It is used in Belgian Pale Ales, Triples, and Witbiers.
 

tipping

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Not at all! Wyeast Labs describes it as "Isolated from a small Belgian brewery, this strain produces beers with moderate esters and minimal phenolics. Apple, bubblegum and plum-like aromas blend nicely with malt and hops. This strain will finish dry with a hint of tartness." It is used in Belgian Pale Ales, Triples, and Witbiers.

Thanks for the reply. Im dissapointed now but im sure it will turn out drinkable anyhow. Ill just be more careful next time. I put in extra halertau hops and 6lbs of extract with some red, honey, and another type of wheat. We will see what it does, what are your thoughts?
 

VillageBrew

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It should turn out to be a tastey beer. It may not be exactly what you wanted at first, but this is the fun of brewing. Anyone can follow a recipe and like it, but to experiment and really like what you did that you can call your own is something else. Either way, you will have 5 gallons of enjoyability!
 

cch0830

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Boiling or steeping ingredients for a longer time than called for doesn't always extract more flavor, aroma, etc. It can't also have negative effects.

Don't mind if I do!
 

PrivetDriveBrewery

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I'm making a summer orange ale and wanted a little input on adding coriander and orange into my beer. During the boil I added rind from two oranges 10 minutes before flame out. There is definitely some orange aroma in the primary right now.

I'm getting ready to transition to secondary here in the next few days and was considering trying to dry hop with some citra hops, a little more orange peel (packaged from NB), as well as add some coriander seeds and black peppercorn for a little spice.

Most of the topics I've seen have added coriander/black peppercorn/orange just during the boil. Would it work to add this into secondary instead? How much coriander and black pepper would be good to add? Should it be ground?

Any input would be a huge help! Thanks!
 

mgr_stl

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I made the Austin Homebrew agave wit and it called for 0.5 oz bitter orange peel and 0.5 oz crushed coriander with 15 minutes left in the boil.

I don't know how it turned out yet because I just bottled it a few days ago.

And I always strain my wort when transferring to the fermenter.
 

jpr0930

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Not sure about "dry spicing" but I think it would probably be fine. Could always serve with fresh orange if you want more of that flavor.
 

Spazmodo

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I love the flavor and aroma of both coriander and the orange in a wheat beer. I add more than most putting 1 full oz of each with 15 min left in the boil. I also buy whole coriander seed and crush it myself with a mortar/pestle. The aroma is incredible. I also use sweet orange instead of bitter orange.
 

geonjay

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@PrivateDriveBrewery - I've been researching this as well, both for coriander and grains of paradise. For the GoP most folks mention soaking the grains in vodka (for flavor extraction and sterilization) for a few days before adding the slurry to the secondary. I have a few more days before brew day to decide what to do.
 

Oceantendency

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Personally, I get Blood Oranges from my fishing buddy everytime we take the boat out. So I'll load up on a some, eat the oranges, skin the peels myself just pure peel with no white fuzzy stuff on the inside, lightly toast them in the oven to help dry them out, hand shred them up and divide the peelings between my two hop additions in the same muslin bags...works like charm and no mess to worry about.
 

2_gal_brewer

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The other thing that is different with peel or zest is that peel includes the pith. The pith is bitter so it adds a different flavoring. Belgian Wits in part use less hops but use the dried peel to impart bitterness from the pith. It also creates some of the interesting aroma. Zest will give more "fruitiness".
 

2_gal_brewer

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The other thing with the Coriander and Peel is that I think there are 2 ways to do it and you will get different flavors with both approaches. You can put in a larger amount and boil it some then take it out. Or you can put a smaller amount in and just boil a small amount (e.g. 5-10 min to sterilize) and leave it in the fermenter. I have always left it in the fermenter but I am thinking to try the first approach to try and get more "lemony" out of the coriander.
I also am trying different types of coriander, from Indian grocer (oval seeds) and from supermarket (round seeds) they have different smells and tastes a little bit. At bottling, my one with Supermarket coriander in tasted a little more spicy and licoricey.
I am also experimenting with peel vs zest. I like the fruitiness that zest gives but I am now trying peel to see what different taste the whole peel gives.
 
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