Adding a little rye malt for better foam?

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z-bob

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I'm getting ready to brew a batch of my American Porter. (90% Rahr pale ale, 5% C20, 5% black patent, Willamette hops) Would subbing a little rye malt for some of the pale malt help with body and with head retention? Like maybe 3 or 4% of the total grist. I don't want it messing with the flavor, but I think the black malt will overpower anything that the rye brings at that level. I don't have any Carapils or other dextrin malt.

Last time I brewed this I used Bell's yeast (cultured from a couple cans of Oberon) and it was one of my best beers ever. I don't have any Bell's now, so will use either S-33 or Nottingham; whichever packet is older, and use GoFerm to rehydrate and proof it.
 

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not to hijack, but would the rye beta-glucans help or hurt head? head is usually protein, but i thought beta-glucans, were like a flax or psylum husk in water? just slimy? wouldn't that hurt head?
 

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I don't know, that's why I'm asking! :)


me too! i've got some psylium husk, and flax, if you want i'll grab a glass of milk, and a straw and blow bubbles in it with and without the flax seed thickener? lol ;) :mug:


personally, i'd use the rye because i love the spicyness, but you said you don't want that.

edit: i just filled a cheese spread container, one of the ones all your moms collected, 3/4 full grabbed a straw...blew i head, big bubbles...added some flax seeds and letting it soak till thick, will blow again, and report back!
 

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not to hijack, but would the rye beta-glucans help or hurt head? head is usually protein, but i thought beta-glucans, were like a flax or psylum husk in water? just slimy? wouldn't that hurt head?
I've used 16% Rye in a NEIPA and it foamed just fine. I mashed @152F, no beta glucanase rest.
 

bracconiere

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well, i got about 30-40 seconds of stay around bubbles blowing into milk without flax....with flax it was like instant death bubbles, meaning no head AT ALL! the little that formed died almost instantly.....
 

dmtaylor

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not to hijack, but would the rye beta-glucans help or hurt head? head is usually protein, but i thought beta-glucans, were like a flax or psylum husk in water? just slimy? wouldn't that hurt head?

Nope, it doesn't hurt a dang thing. You'll get the best head of your life ;) from rye, if you use enough, I guarantee it.
 
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z-bob

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If beta-glucan is anything like pectin -- and both are polysaccharides -- it should give great head. I just poured some seltzer into a glass with a little crabapple syrup in the bottom (very pectin-y, like failed jelly) and it had a great long-lasting white foam.
 

bracconiere

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If beta-glucan is anything like pectin -- and both are polysaccharides -- it should give great head. I just poured some seltzer into a glass with a little crabapple syrup in the bottom (very pectin-y, like failed jelly) and it had a great long-lasting white foam.


i never get any foam on my ciders? anyway, my next stout, i'm going to try to add whey protein to it.....and i wish you luck with the rye! (and truth be told, if it wasn't for dressing up for pictures....i don't even like head, lol :mug:)
 
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z-bob

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Don't forget to mill that Rye malt (separately) on a narrow gap, even narrower than for wheat, or it's not gonna do anything.
Thanks again. I ground the rye separately, and over half of it passed through the mill unscathed. (I didn't do all of it, just enough to notice) I cranked the mill down and ground to coarse flour. Stirred the flour into the rest of the grain and readjusted the mill and ground it all up. If I had mixed the whole rye in with the barley I might not have noticed.
 

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One of my favorite recipes is a rye brown ale. It has 23.5% rye in the grain bill and always has the thickest creamiest head, that lasts the entire pint. I've never used that small amount of rye in a beer so can't say how much effect it will have but it can't hurt. I'd ramp it up even more because the rye flavor and mouth feel is really great in a brown ale.
 

lumbergh

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One of my favorite recipes is a rye brown ale. It has 23.5% rye in the grain bill and always has the thickest creamiest head, that lasts the entire pint. I've never used that small amount of rye in a beer so can't say how much effect it will have but it can't hurt. I'd ramp it up even more because the rye flavor and mouth feel is really great in a brown ale.
Would you mind sharing that recipe?
 

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Don't mind a bit...
Batch size: 5.5G
Eff: 70%
OG:1.058
FG: 1.015
SRM: 26
IBU: 39
Abv: 5.7%

6.5# 2 row 51%
3# rye malt 23.5%
2# biscuit 15.7%
.75# chocolate malt 350L 5.9%
.5# Cara 60 3.9%

Hops:
.75 oz Colombus @ 60 min
.25 oz Colombus @ 15 min
1 oz Willamette @ 5 min
Yeast: I use either wlp007 or Nottingham

Mash @ 152* for 60 min
Start fermentation @ 65* and slowly ramp up to 70*

Another nice addition to this recipe is adding crushed caraway seeds for an extra spicy note. Comes out tasting a little like pumpernickel bread. I've used. 5 oz @ flange out and steeped for 15 min. Came out nice.

Cheers!
 

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Don't worry about a little oil (flax, etc.) pre-fermentation. The yeast will consume it. Oil will absolutely kill head post-fermentation.
 

Steveruch

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Don't mind a bit...
Batch size: 5.5G
Eff: 70%
OG:1.058
FG: 1.015
SRM: 26
IBU: 39
Abv: 5.7%

6.5# 2 row 51%
3# rye malt 23.5%
2# biscuit 15.7%
.75# chocolate malt 350L 5.9%
.5# Cara 60 3.9%

Hops:
.75 oz Colombus @ 60 min
.25 oz Colombus @ 15 min
1 oz Willamette @ 5 min
Yeast: I use either wlp007 or Nottingham

Mash @ 152* for 60 min
Start fermentation @ 65* and slowly ramp up to 70*

Another nice addition to this recipe is adding crushed caraway seeds for an extra spicy note. Comes out tasting a little like pumpernickel bread. I've used. 5 oz @ flange out and steeped for 15 min. Came out nice.

Cheers!
I added some caraway in the rye porter I brewed several years ago. 👍
 

Coastalbrew

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A tablespoon steeped in a cup of hot water in a three gallon batch. Unfortunately my note taking was somewhat lackadaisical back then and I don't remember exactly when I added it. I'm guessing after the boil.
I've been thinking about making a tincture with them and trying to add them that way.
 

monkeymath

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I don't think 3-4% rye malt will be noticeable in any way in the final product.
It's not like rye has a super strong flavour. Go for 10% at least. There's nothing to be afraid of.

And yes, rye does make a super creamy and long-lasting head.
 
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z-bob

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I found a 17 year old packet of Nottingham in the fridge. I'm going to pitch that, *if* it wakes up in the Go-Ferm. :) Last time I used Go-Ferm it was with an almost 10 year old packet of something (a wine yeast, I think) and it quickly foamed up and over the top of the jar and made a mess.

Edit: the Nottingham was very slow waking up, and was kind of weak but it is alive. I pitched it anyway a few minutes ago; I hope that wasn't a mistake. I should have made a starter with it 2 days ago.
 
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z-bob

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I found a 17 year old packet of Nottingham in the fridge. I'm going to pitch that, *if* it wakes up in the Go-Ferm. :) Last time I used Go-Ferm it was with an almost 10 year old packet of something (a wine yeast, I think) and it quickly foamed up and over the top of the jar and made a mess.

Edit: the Nottingham was very slow waking up, and was kind of weak but it is alive. I pitched it anyway a few minutes ago; I hope that wasn't a mistake. I should have made a starter with it 2 days ago.

This morning there was an inch of foam on top, so the old yeast was just fine. I'm sure I under-pitched it, but not sure if that matters much with Nottingham.
 
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z-bob

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I might be a little late to the party…
How about a few oz of chocolate rye malt. I just used a 1/2 lb in a red.

Don't know, but I have used cararye and carawheat before instead of C40 or C60 to give more foam and more body. Don't know if it did what I wanted or not, but the beer turned out good. (I also don't know how well they were crushed. I learned this time that rye will pass through the mill with very little damage)
 
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