A simple staggered nutrient protocol?

[Pendragon524]

Two questions. First, let's say I've got some Fermaid-K on my hands, as well as some simple "yeast nutrient" (DAP), and I want to start using a staggered nutrient protocol for my meads. What's the simplest method to use? A bit of research revealed lots of lovely, albeit complicated, equations to calculate everything, but is there a relatively simple method I can start with before making things more complicated? Second, how much advantage is there to using Go-Ferm to rehydrate my yeast? Enough that I should seriously consider buying it? Thanks in advance!

 

[videojunkie1208]

https://www.meadmakr.com/batch-buildr/Generally I am finding that I need about 20g or GoFerm, and 25g of Fermaid O in a 5 gallon batch. How that translates to Fermaid K and DAP, I'm not sure.


My take on GoFerm is that it certainly speeds up initial fermentation. I haven't run objective tests to confirm this, but anecdotally I am seeing my yeast (D47) burn through upwards of 10-20 gravity points per day. (1.120 -> 1.000 in just over a week!) And this has been consistent since I started using it.

 

[bushpilot]

Regarding GoFerm, I hink it depends on the water you use. I so far have not used it, so I guess I should not pronounce my uninformed opinion!

I use the BatchBuildr calculator, and have it calculate how much Fermaid K and Dap to use. I then us that info, substitute the LD Carlson "Yeast Energizer" and "Yeast Nutrient", and divide in 4 portions. I add 1/4 when fermentation activity is apparent (generally 12 hours), and then 1/4 each day for the next three days.

It has so far worked for me, though I am not experienced brewer, with less than 10 batches under my belt. There are likely better methods.

 

[Miraculix]

I really would use one of the tosna calculators. They are online and they are easy to fill in, no complicated equations to do manually. You can specify that you use fermaid k, which already contains dap. Dap overdosed or given too late during fermentation leaves a disgusting residual taste. I would just stay with fermaid k or switch to fermaid o for the late additions and fermaid k only for the first. But these options are given in the tosna calculators.

 

[Miraculix]

Sorry, forgot the link:

https://www.meadmaderight.com/tosna.html
Edit: it is important that you do not add anything after the 1/3 sugar break, which means after 1/3 of the sugar has been consumed by the yeast. The reason is, that after this point, the yeast stops taking the nutrients in and they will stay at least partially in the liquid and cause off-flavours.

Everything else is written on the calculator's page. If you have any question, just ask!

Btw. Go.Ferm provides trace nutrients, that are not included within fermaid-k or fermaid-o. You want to use it if you can. It is not expensive, so get yourself some.

 

[videojunkie1208]

Sorry, forgot the link:

https://www.meadmaderight.com/tosna.html
Edit: it is important that you do not add anything after the 1/3 sugar break, which means after 1/3 of the sugar has been consumed by the yeast.

You use the 1/3 break? I look for the 1/2 break. Although honestly my last couple of batches have been so quick that sometimes I shoot past the 1/2 sugar break before day 4 additions ... (in which case I skip it for the reasons you cite)

 

[Miraculix]

You use the 1/3 break? I look for the 1/2 break. Although honestly my last couple of batches have been so quick that sometimes I shoot past the 1/2 sugar break before day 4 additions ... (in which case I skip it for the reasons you cite)

It is what is recomemnded by the TOSNA 3.0 Protocol. If the mead has a lower starting gravity I would even consider throwing in everything at the start as per BOMM instructions.

 

[Maylar]

9% abv is the point where yeast can no longer assimilate inorganic nutrients like DAP, according to published reports. So about 65 gravity points is the limit. After that you're feeding the other micro organisms in the mead and what gets left behind tastes like crap.

 

[videojunkie1208]

@Maylar, 1/2 sugar break for 1.120 would be right in that neighborhood. With what I am getting the last few batches, 1/3 sugar break is about day 3!

 

[Raptor99]

Edit: it is important that you do not add anything after the 1/3 sugar break, which means after 1/3 of the sugar has been consumed by the yeast. The reason is, that after this point, the yeast stops taking the nutrients in and they will stay at least partially in the liquid and cause off-flavours.

This is good to know. I just started my first batch of mead, and looks like it might reach the 1/3 sugar break by day 3. So in that case, I won't add the 4th and final nutrient addition.

 

[Miraculix]

This is good to know. I just started my first batch of mead, and looks like it might reach the 1/3 sugar break by day 3. So in that case, I won't add the 4th and final nutrient addition.

I would just throw it in on day three then. That's also the tosna recommendation.

"NUTRIENT ADDITION SCHEDULE

Add each nutrient addition at 24, 48 & 72-hours after yeast pitch.

The fourth nutrient addition is added at the 1/3 sugar break listed above, or Day 7. Whichever comes first."

 

[Raptor99]

Should I throw in the 72 hour nutrient addition only, or also the 1/3 sugar addition? If it is already at 1/3 sugar break, maybe it doesn't need the final nutrient addition.

 

[Miraculix]

Should I throw in the 72 hour nutrient addition only, or also the 1/3 sugar addition? If it is already at 1/3 sugar break, maybe it doesn't need the final nutrient addition.

If you calculated it, throw the 3rd and 4th addition in together if the 1/3 sugar break is on day three.

 

[Maylar]

I have missed the last addition on occasion when the ferment was progressing faster than I expected with no ill effects. It's reported that organic yeast nutrient (Fermaid-O) can be utilized later than the inorganic (Fermaid-K or DAP) but I haven't seen definitive numbers published. It's somewhere around 10% I believe.

I do know that adding nutrient late in the ferment will leave some nasty tasting **** behind.

 

[Miraculix]

I have missed the last addition on occasion when the ferment was progressing faster than I expected with no ill effects. It's reported that organic yeast nutrient (Fermaid-O) can be utilized later than the inorganic (Fermaid-K or DAP) but I haven't seen definitive numbers published. It's somewhere around 10% I believe.

I do know that adding nutrient late in the ferment will leave some nasty tasting **** behind.

Yes I agree. If you're past the 1/3 sugar break, I also wouldn't add anything anymore.

 

[Pendragon524]

https://www.meadmakr.com/batch-buildr/Generally I am finding that I need about 20g or GoFerm, and 25g of Fermaid O in a 5 gallon batch. How that translates to Fermaid K and DAP, I'm not sure.


My take on GoFerm is that it certainly speeds up initial fermentation. I haven't run objective tests to confirm this, but anecdotally I am seeing my yeast (D47) burn through upwards of 10-20 gravity points per day. (1.120 -> 1.000 in just over a week!) And this has been consistent since I started using it.

I really liked the calculator you liked to, so thank you for that! I’ll probably buy some GoFerm!

 

[videojunkie1208]

Usually if the yeast have gotten past the 1/2 sugar break in 4 days, you really don't need the extra nutrients.