50 point beer

[DaveSeattle]

What are some tips to take your beer from consistently very good to amazing? I follow all the best practices I know of: Pitch lots of healthy yeast, pitch cold, temperature control, use a RIMS to maintain mash temps, adjust water for pH and minerals, use fresh and high quality malt. Almost all my beers are very good on the first try, including a 42 point beer and a 2nd BoS (interestingly, different beers in the same competition). I brew all styles including lagers and sours.

Where do I go from here? How can I consistently brew high-40s beers? Or is it just a matter of repetition, blending, and luck?

 

[Bensiff]

What are some tips to take your beer from consistently very good to amazing? I follow all the best practices I know of: Pitch lots of healthy yeast, pitch cold, temperature control, use a RIMS to maintain mash temps, adjust water for pH and minerals, use fresh and high quality malt. Almost all my beers are very good on the first try, including a 42 point beer and a 2nd BoS (interestingly, different beers in the same competition). I brew all styles including lagers and sours.

Where do I go from here? How can I consistently brew high-40s beers? Or is it just a matter of repetition, blending, and luck?

I've never hit high 40's in competition so take it for what it is worth...then again I usually don't enter competitions and when I do I just fill a bottle from a tap and toss it into the contest.

I would say that brews in the mid 30's are respectable beers with little to no flaws, high 30's-low 40's are beers that have no flaws and are excellent examples of the style. Obviously you have controlled the variables that can really make or break a beer and know that your process is solid enough that you can toss together pretty much anything and yield a quality beer. Going to that next level, IMO, is that hard part. That is where it isn't about process, it is about perfecting the recipe. That means taking your 42 point beer and figuring out exactly where it is weak and make a small tweak, whether it be with grains, mash temp, water profile, etc. Obviously keep to standard scientific process of only changing one variable at a time. If you want to hit those high numbers, I'd say you had better have perfect notes and perfect consistency and run trial after trial as you dial in that perfect beer.

 

[Yooper]

A score of 42-44 is a very high score, and generally would be the high score in any BJCP competition. I've only seen one or two 44+ scores, ever. I judge competitions, including the final round of the NHC, and the beers are excellent, but still, none are a "50".

A 'perfect' beer is probably unattainable, and I've never had one.

 

[DaveSeattle]

I wonder if scores around me are inflated then . I got a 42 on a robust porter that didn't even place in its group. My overall question is more focused on perfecting my beers than getting high scores, though.

Bensiff is probably right that those last few points come from iteration and tweaking. That sounds like a lot of effort. Isn't there something I can buy to make it easier? Part of the problem is that I almost never brew the same beer twice, because I like variety and want to try all the styles, but I guess that might be a good first step...

 

[Bensiff]

I wonder if scores around me are inflated then . I got a 42 on a robust porter that didn't even place in its group. My overall question is more focused on perfecting my beers than getting high scores, though.



Bensiff is probably right that those last few points come from iteration and tweaking. That sounds like a lot of effort. Isn't there something I can buy to make it easier? Part of the problem is that I almost never brew the same beer twice, because I like variety and want to try all the styles, but I guess that might be a good first step...

I have the same problem with jumping around with styles. If I had my heart set on making a perfect amazing beer I would research the style exhaustively, look at winning recipes and processes, and then design a recipe based off that research. I wouldn't expect to hit it out of the park first go. I would expect to have to keep brewing over and over again. There are some tricks though. You can brew a base beer and split it doing multiple 1 gallon ferments with different yeasts (I'm doing this with brett yeasts right now as I determine how I want to infect my barrels), dry hop schedules, or ferment temp. That way you can try multiple variables side by side instead of waiting a month between batches and never truly being able to side by side the beers. But, I wouldn't expect to ever reach your goal if you don't take the hard road, if you do I would say it likely was more to do with getting really lucky one time than anything.

 

[Braufessor]

I have had some 44-46 scores....... generally never from a National BJCP or higher judge. Almost always from a "professional brewer" or something like that. To be honest, I think the only way you score 45+ is you have some luck. Now, I am not saying you randomly brew a beer that good...... I think you first need to brew a really fantastic beer, to style, super clean, in its prime, perfectly carbed, do a good job bottling it...... and then, you need to be lucky enough that it gets set in front of a judge where it also just nails their personal preferences in regard to that style. It needs to show up in the right order in a flight, etc....
I would say that if you almost never brew the same beer twice, the only chance you have of brewing a really high scoring beer is probably somewhere in the realm of luck.
I would pick a style (or a couple) that you really like. Start with a high quality recipe ( BCS or NHC Gold Medal winner, or similar), brew it, enter it, repeat. Even then..... if you can get a beer that is a pretty consistent 38-42..... that is outstanding. Get it in front of the right judge, at the right time, in its prime.... you could get a 44-46. 50 though? I doubt it.

 

[idiotsinc]

I belong to the Homer Simpson school of brewing. "Hmmmmm, beer".

 

[Hoppity]

I have had some 44-46 scores....... generally never from a National BJCP or higher judge. Almost always from a "professional brewer" or something like that. To be honest, I think the only way you score 45+ is you have some luck. Now, I am not saying you randomly brew a beer that good...... I think you first need to brew a really fantastic beer, to style, super clean, in its prime, perfectly carbed, do a good job bottling it...... and then, you need to be lucky enough that it gets set in front of a judge where it also just nails their personal preferences in regard to that style. It needs to show up in the right order in a flight, etc....
I would say that if you almost never brew the same beer twice, the only chance you have of brewing a really high scoring beer is probably somewhere in the realm of luck.
I would pick a style (or a couple) that you really like. Start with a high quality recipe ( BCS or NHC Gold Medal winner, or similar), brew it, enter it, repeat. Even then..... if you can get a beer that is a pretty consistent 38-42..... that is outstanding. Get it in front of the right judge, at the right time, in its prime.... you could get a 44-46. 50 though? I doubt it.

I've watched enough subjective-based contests to understand the exaltation of triumph and cries of defeat aren't necessarily spread evenly by merit. Be true to your brew. Titration by judges may be a fool's errand.

 

[Natdavis777]

Ive had one beer hit a 40, and I was damn proud. My first comp beer netted a 36, I thought I was kind of a failure.

Then I researched. I looked up beers that had high BeerAdvocate scores and found some BJCP scores... Really put things in perspective. Some of our favorite beers dont score as high in BJCP as you would think. I was shocked. For example, Fathead Headhunter (awesome IPA btw) nets a 39/50 (http://onlinebeerscores.com/commercial-examples.php), but a 96 on BeerAdvocate.

Case in point, even if your beer is in the 30s it can still be a very good beer. Dont focus on someone elses numbers, but your own taste!

 

[Bensiff]

The whole thing where 50's aren't given makes it seem more of a logarithmic scale where 50 is infinite. I don't think it should be treated like that. If you can clone a beer that a judge can't distinguish from one of the commercial examples provided by bjcp as the definition of the style, that should be a 50 point beer. Otherwise it is saying that commercial examples can go to 11 while homebrewers can only go to 10.

 

[betarhoalphadelta]

Part of the problem is that I almost never brew the same beer twice, because I like variety and want to try all the styles, but I guess that might be a good first step...

I have the same problem. If you're scoring like that with first-time beers and your own recipes, then you're also very good at writing recipes.

But I agree with others. If you're consistently putting out beers that score in that range, then you're putting out commercial-quality beer. That's great.

How to make it better? Well, probably the way to make it better is iteration. If you can make a really good beer the first time with a recipe, honing in your consistency and dialing in the recipes are the way to turn "really good" into "really great".

Even then, you're not going to score a 50, and scores >45 are probably luck of stars aligning between a really great beer and nailing the personal tastes of the judges.

 

[DaveSeattle]

To be clear: My goal isn't scores per se. My goal is to make transcendent beer.

 

[aangel]

I'd say maybe start doing blind tastings of your beer style against the world's best commercial examples of that style, and seeing how you compare. By the sounds of it, you've probably reached that pro-am stage. Ever considered going pro?

 

[Yooper]

The whole thing where 50's aren't given makes it seem more of a logarithmic scale where 50 is infinite. I don't think it should be treated like that. If you can clone a beer that a judge can't distinguish from one of the commercial examples provided by bjcp as the definition of the style, that should be a 50 point beer. Otherwise it is saying that commercial examples can go to 11 while homebrewers can only go to 10.

But many of our calibration beers are well known commercial examples, and they routinely score in the 30s. Just because they are successful commercially doesn't mean that they meet the style guidelines perfectly or that they are awesome beers.

I've actually had better homebrews than many commercial beers in my lifetime, and especially as a BJCP judge.

 

[DaveSeattle]

Yes, but I have a good day job and from all I hear pro brewing is often less satisfying than homebrewing. More business less brewing, and having to brew the same beer over and over. That said, I have an idea for a brew pub that recreates the old three threads method, with historical and novelty appeal, but I don't think it could do enough volume to be profitable.

 

[Bensiff]

But many of our calibration beers are well known commercial examples, and they routinely score in the 30s. Just because they are successful commercially doesn't mean that they meet the style guidelines perfectly or that they are awesome beers.



I've actually had better homebrews than many commercial beers in my lifetime, and especially as a BJCP judge.

Are calibration beers the same as listed in the style guidelines as examples? If those only rank in the 30's then I hope the new guidelines use beers that are world class examples of the style that should be considered a 50 point beer.

But, I suppose I should keep my mouth shut as I know there is a ton of debate with how judging and guidelines should be and it will never be agreed on. That is part of why I never tested to become a judge, I deal with those types of arguments at work all day, I don't want to hear more of it on my weekend .