Yet another where do I start with electric thread

Okay, so I just killed one of the two propane tanks I had filled less than a week ago, and I only got 5 batches out of it.
I have been eyeing the electric breaker box in my garage which comes off of the main box in the basement. The breaker downstairs is 240v 60 amp and leads to the box outside which has room for at least one 240v breaker for brewing and maybe more. I can rearrange the garage so I could brew just a few feet from the breaker box if need be.

What would be the best way to jump into brewing electric in that scenario be?
Can I wire an outlet directly into the breaker panel or should I add another step like the spa panel option I have seen?
I just acquired two Omega PIDs to play with(which I will need to find wiring info for) and can source some SSR’s from ebay for cheap.
I have a keggle that I can convert to electric and a 10 gallon igloo mash tun with false bottom that I plan on continuing to use as a mash tun until I can get another keg to convert. I would prefer to go with a HERMS system to avoid the possibility of burning the wort.

I want to be able to set the desired temperature on the mash and then be able to walk away, the same with the BK but don’t need such full automation that the system will activate pumps - I enjoy brewing and want to be part of it but I dislike using propane.
I know this is disjointed and my terminology is probably off, I am just starting to obsess about electric brewing and as such I am not completely up on the lingo.

I have been following this thread: http://www.homebrewtalk.com/f170/simple-electric-build-pros-276477/
And have been reading through the build posts in electric brewing and has answered some questions but I think I need some hand holding to get me through this.

Cheers, Ian

 

First off you need to find a way to add GFCI protection to either your 60amp circuit or whatever you put in new. The spa panel is used a lot here because it is (somehow) cheaper to get a spa panel with a built-in 50amp gfci breaker than it is to just purchase a 30/50/60amp gfci breaker for your breaker box.

As far as the PIDs/SSRs/Wiring goes, look around for PJ's wiring diagrams. The wiring might be a little intimidating but it really is not all that difficult. G'luck!

 

wow, why would the entire thing be cheaper than a simple breaker?

 

found this, will it work: http://www.ebay.com/itm/SIEMENS-2-P...ansformers&hash=item25689495d7#ht_1119wt_1270

 

Breakers are not universal, that may not fit your panel. The spa panel is around 49 dollars and a 50 amp breaker is like 10-20.

Check out Kals, TheElectricBrewery.com. I build my panel following his directions and love it. I would leave out the volt and amp meter. You could also exclude the mash pid and pump controls, but they really dont cost that much.

If you ever think you will go larger than 20 gallons, wire everything to handle 50 amps.

 

I think if I ever make more than 20 gallons I will be brewing with a huge group of people . I do like to overbuild and be prepared though. 50 amps it is.

 

here is a video of 2000w five gallon boil. With only 2000w you will need a bit of patience. The upside of low wattage kettles is that you can walk away and come back to a boil without fear of boilover. With only 2000w you need to have time to relax and be patient...watching and waiting for a boil is not fun...but if you can plan to have the time and do other things while brewing it will work fine...

 

One of these please! From what I have gathered the control panel can be pricey no?

 

yes if you could please ask about the total cost, any chance of taking a look at that parts list?

I will be building mine I think, I work for beer but its probably best I don't take my payment whilst toiling over electrical work.

I feel like I can probably get the price down by getting stuff bit by bit from fleabay.

I may also have to try to build a stand, since I don't think my wooden work table would mix well with brewing.

 

I just saw the pm. I do still have a list somewhere but it's not really complete as we reused some parts.

I actually just finished a 50A panel that I have been helping another member with. We really tried to keep cost down while still using good componenents. I think it turned out pretty well. I hope to post some info in the next few days on that build along with a linked parts list. I will let you know here when I get it posted.

 

so if I had two PID's I won't need to scavenge my temp controller then? one PID for BK and one for HLT right?

 

alright then, I'll start looking for heating elements then.

Low density or not for this? I know for a rims system you want ultra low density to avoid scorching but with this would it matter?

 

I have been using PWM circuits for boil controls. Cheaper than a PID if you don't mind a bit of soldering.

I am just finishing up my boil control and haven't boiled yet with an element. Yoopers element is standard density. She hasn't had problems with scorching as far as I know.

Edit...yeah what she said...

 

I already have two omega PIDs that I want to try to use, I have soldered a bit but nothing extensive - just fixing small broken boards and other stuff.

so a low density element is ideal then? although I take it normal elements are cheaper.

 

Thi is what I use. The camco is popular and you can dry fire it



http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B000BPG4LI/?tag=skimlinks_replacement-20

 

your link does not work.

 

Try now or just search for camco 5500 ulwd

 

The dry fire sounds like a good feature. Does anyone know if the nut and threads are steel on these? I weld my elements to a junction box and have noticed some are brass.

 

They look like steel, but the could be nickel covered brass. I used a 2 gang box and jb welded a cover like Kal did and zero leaks after 15 batchs.

 

I use 2 5500w camco ultra low watt density elements, 1 for the HLT, and 1 for the boil, along with a couple of these contactors and SSRs.
http://www.homebrewtalk.com/f16/contactors-e-brew-heating-elements-273489/

 

Your mash PID can go on temperature, like a normal PID.

Your BK one you need it to be able to do 'duty cycle'... i.e. set the period to 1 sec, and have it on 100% of that when approaching boil, then you lower to 65% or so once that is reached to maintain a nice boil.. this does not even have to be a PID, but it makes it simple...

you may want something for your HLT... could be as simple as a mechanical thermostat or a ranco/johnson, or a PID.. a recirc pump and a PID make the most stable and accurate..

 

The other thing you want is an E-Stop button on your panel that anyone can easily identify as what to hit or throw a large object at. This should disengage all 120/240 leaving the control panel and be really fail-safe....... and locat you control panel far enough away that the hose on your pump output wont spray it when it flies out of the kettle, LOL...

 

I saw that video. funny.

also I will have to read up on what my PID's will do - need to find the manuals online.

 

runningweird,

I posted my latest project here. Maybe it will be of some help to you.

 

your parts list doesn't work

 

Figures, first time I tried to share a file. Try again I think I fixed it.

 

Alright, time to bring this back from the dead.

I was inspired to dive in because my mash tun developed a nice crack in the plastic and I managed to find a keg to convert. Another forum member sold me two 5500 w camco RIPP elements - which should be shipping today. I built the bakatronics PWM and it works, I am going to be scrounging for electrical boxes and the like at a junk store today.

so, as I need to have my hand held through this entire enterprise here is today's first question:

Will either of these cheap SSR's work for a 5500 watt element running on 240 in my BK powered by a PWM?

Solid state relay SSR 90-480V AC/ 90A output 3-32V DC | eBay

Brand New Solid State Relay SSR 3-32VDC/24-220VDC 40A | eBay
http://www.amazon.com/40A-SSR-Solid-State-Relay/dp/B005KPIX9A/ref=sr_1_2?ie=UTF8&qid=1326293751&sr=8-2

 

I would rather the one from amazon - since it will be at my house in two days

 

The amazon one should work fine. 40A is what I used. I dont know why the listing says 3500W max?? I would suggest an external mount heat sink. It makes mounting much easier.

 

Make sure that you also get a heatsink for the SSR.

Edit: Well - I waited too long before posting. lschiavo, you beat me too it.

 

I like the Mager ones myself, here is one with a heatsink included for $12.49 shipped:
Solid State Relay SSR 24-480V AC 40A + Heat Sink[K226] | eBay

That one is shipped from China, which I have had no problems with. If you want one shipped form the US, your FUTEK with a heatsink is a few dollars more, $18.76 shipped:
SSR-40DA-H DC 3-32V Input Solid State Relay 40A w Aluminum Heat Sink | eBay

I suggest using a 30A fuse of circuit breaker to protect the SSR, cheap insurance..

-mike

 

I have a couple heat sinks - I can make them work.

okay, now I need an enclosure to house all the stuff in, hope I can find one cheap. I also need to go buy a spa panel.

 

Some guys have all the fun. My system is done Now all I can do is brew with it...

 

bad news everyone. The junk stores turned up nothing. Now I have to pay retail.

cheap enclosure from Home Depot here I come.

going to follow ischiavos parts list somewhat - with room to grow.

 

got a hole for the weldess bulkhead put in - took me a long time to discover the gash in my thumb through which I had been bleeding on all the tools...stupid razor sharp edge.

 

so today I got two camco 5500 elements, a spa panel, and a 4 prong drier cord from truevalue.

in wiring the spa panel is do I have to wire it from a breaker in the other panel?

I have a secondary panel in my garage that comes from the main box in the basement - its a 60 Amp 220/240 line leading to it - can I just wire the new panel from the main line connects?
Im not explaining myself properly - so here is a picture. Is there any way to connect the spa panel to this breaker without adding anything else?

please forgive my newbness.