tweaked scottish ale

Hello there I had to take a break from brewing beer and havent been on here for a while.
I am planning on starting back up and wanted to make a Scottish type ale mini mash beer. I would like to get your guys and girls opinions before i get all the ingredients together n pull the trigger. I believe it would work and produce a really good beer but want to ask first and get ideas. The batch size is going to be 6 gallons.

The grain bill would be 4 pounds of base grains and 13 ounces of specialty grains.
Base would be 3 lbs of golden promise, half a pound of crystal 120l, 4 ounces of Vienna malt and 4 ounces of German pilsen malt.
Specialty grains would be 4 oz honey malt, 3 oz victory malt, 2 oz caramunich, and a ounce of mesquite smoked 2-row, acid sour, black patent, and black roasted barley.

Hops I havent decided on yet of either using just heather tips or using cascade pellet hops. Yes i know heather isnt a hop but can be used like hops. If i used cascade it would be 2 ounce at 60 minutes of boil and another ounce at the last 15 minute of the boil.
If i used heather tips it would be 4 ounces at beginning of boil, and maybe another 4 ounces at end of the boil. Or a mix of the two not completely decided on that route yet.
Only other thing i would add to the batch is a can of black treacle. Also maybe 3 pounds of extra pale liquid extract as well.

The yeast would be two vials of white labs Scottish ale strain. I have no clue what type of abv this would create but I'm thinking somewhere between 6 and 9 abv.
What do you people think about this recipe? To crazy, not enough? Let me know Thx.

 

Wow! That's a hell of a grain bill for what should be a simple beer. If I were making a Scottish Ale I'd go with the Golden Promise, some Crystal and a touch of roasted barley for color and then boil down the first gallon or so of the first runnings to achieve some kettle caramelization. But that's just me.

 

+1 that's the traditional way to do it

 

Thanks for the responses. I wasn't sure about the hops since I couldn't get a clear answer about which type are used for Scottish type beers. I know heather tips were used back in the day before they had access to hops. I was thinking about the smoked malt because I wanted that flavor note inside the beer. But I might not use it since I wasn't 100% sure about it like the hops. I believe the grain bill was high because i was thinking about stouts and Scott ales lol. The trecle is something I usually always use for sweetness alcohol boost n color. Since i know it can overpower the beer I was thinking about half a can or replacing it w golden syrup from same company.

I did know that golden promise was a good star with grains lol. This is my first grain bill homebrew either as a mini mash, all grain or brew in bag. So right now this a experimental recipe, so I didn't know if the bill was to big or too small. But i want at least 6 abv beer since that's the lowest abv I usually make if not 7 abv.
Since I don't use yeast starters that's why I was thinking about the 2 vials of yeast instead of just one. I know what some will say about that but I like the beers I get with out the starters.

 

You don't need the starter necessarily but enough yeast is important. The problem with an experimental recipe of this grandeur is that there will be so much going on that it would be hard deciding what to change as it will all be muddled together. Is it the black patent I like, or the roasted barley? The caramunich, or the crystal 120? The Golden Promise, or the Victory? You can get a 6% beer without a bunch of ingredients, just more basemalt.

Seriously, grab a pint (or two) of your favorite beer and sit down and watch this video. 30 minutes long but very, very excellent in terms of recipe development from a very well known brewer talking about simplifying your beer.

 

For a mini mash I would go with:
3# Golden Promise
1# Munich 10
.5# crystal 120
1 oz. roast barley
and hit your OG with that new MO extract from NB.

Hops: go for fuggles at 60 and hit it with heather tips at flame out


With base malts, you're not going to taste anything under a pound (the vienna, pilsner, etc.), or 8 oz. for most specialty malts (honey, victory, acidulated, etc.). It's a different story for the darker stuff but there's not much point in using roasted barley AND acidulated malt unless you have some chalky &ss water. If you've never done so, go here: http://beercalculus.hopville.com/recipe and build a recipe that hits the numbers you want.

 

Sorry what I meant was I don't want to hit anything under 6 abv I dont mind if it hits 10 abv at all. You are right the acid malt needs to go so thats another off the list. The victory malt sounded like it would be nice added to the batch but it sounds like that one should go too. I know golden promise is a go and is staying. The speciality I would like to keep is the honey and roasted barley. Also the crystal and caramunich I think I keep too.
If it ends up being a big beer that's fine, just getting it where it doesn't taste like pure alcohol lol.

 

What's your mashing capacity? Because with enough Golden Promise you really shouldn't need the honey malt.
Or something like this:
4# Golden Promise
6 oz. Honey malt
4 oz. Caramunich
4 oz. crystal 120
1 oz. roast barley
+ LME, 8-10 pounds if you want it BIG

 

And just anecdotal advice, I'd keep smoked anything away from big beers. Smoke nearly always clashes with high FG and complex malt profiles.

 

Okay thank you. Question if I was doing brew in bag instead how much should the grain bill be. Just in case i wanted that instead if the mini mash?

 

Sorry I didn't answer about the mashing question. I have a stockpot that's about 3 or 4 gallons tall. Also I'am curious about Kent golding hops would they be good for this type of beer?

After researching and finding an app to help me out with recipes to a style of beer, I think I've come to a conclusion. Now I have two to choose from if I wish it.
The styles are an export 80 Scottish ale, and a strong Scott ale.
First I will list the Target of each of them. Then list the recipes that hit that Target or come close to it. Along with their readings

Export 80 ALE-
OG 1.040-1054
IBU 15-30
SRM 9-17
FG 1.010-1.016

STRONG SCOTT ALE-
OG 1.070-1.130
IBU 17-35
SRM 14-25
FG 1.018-1.030

Recipe based off of export 80 ale
Golden promise 2.5lb
Crystal 60L 8oz
Honey malt 8oz
Roasted barley 2oz
Amber dme 5lb

OG 1.053
IBU 23.9
SRM 14.5
FG 1.013
ABV 5.2%

Recipe off of strong Scott ale
Golden promise 3lb
Crystal 60L 8oz
Honey malt 8oz
Caramunich 4oz
Roasted barley 4oz
Amber dme 5lb
Raw sugar 2lb

OG 1.071
IBU 19.7
SRM 19.9
FG 1.018
ABV 7.1%

Both have a single addition of Kent golding hops in the recipe as of 2oz added at the 45 minute mark.
Also one tube of Scottish ale yeast will be used as well.

They both might still be a little big but I tryied to keep the grain bill as low as I could such as 3.7lbs for the first and 4.5lbs for the second recipe. Of course those figures are estimations so when either one is done they might be lower or higher than expected.

I believe this will be a mini mash batch like I said in the beginning, I just wasn't sure on the grains; but now they are within a style with most of the ingredients I wanted. I think I'm in the right direction.

I might still use the heather tips but won't know for sure till I get to that bridge. I did 2 instead of one recipes to have options of where I want to go, but I think I will head towards the export more than the strong.