Steeping grains for a full boil-extract

Is it ok to steep the specialty grains in a seperate pot on my kitchen stove(in ~1-1.5gal), and then when finished just pour it into my brew pot (which would be outside with the rest of the water being heated on my propane burner)? My stove would take awhile to boil 4-5gal of water so it wouldn't be very beneficial to try and heat up the rest of the water inside. Is there anything to be cautious about, such as keeping the water in the brew pot ~155 so when pouring in the water the grains were steeped in they are about the same temperature?

Also, if that is ok, am I also correct in assuming i wouldn't need to sanitise the steeping pot, just clean it, because what is in it will be boiled after it is transfered to the brew pot?

Thanks for your help!

 

Removing my post and placing this matter in more experienced hands.

Cheers!

 

Absolutely, in fact, this is what most people do. Be sure to pay attention to how much water you have in your brew pot before adding the steep water so you don't overshoot your boil volume.

Also, 155*F is a great temperature to maintain while steeping grains. This helps minimize undesirable tannin extraction.

How many pounds of grain will you be steeping? A general rule of no more than 1/2 gal. steep water per 1lb. of grain is a good guideline. This keeps the PH below 5.4, minimizing tannin extraction. There's a good article in BYO regarding these ratios. I'd post the link but I'm at work right now and it's saved on my home comp...

 

1 1/2 lb. Even with the pot i'm using, 16 qt stockpot, even a gallon didn't seem like it would be deep enough to keep the grain suspended above the bottom while still being all in the water. Or is it ok for the muslin bag to sit on the bottom of the pot. I've only brewed once before and i used a rack stick to tie the bag to so it was suspended in the water.

 

Then your plan of ~1 gal. should be ok. Try not to go over that volume too much and keep the temp in check.

It's ok for the bag to touch the bottom as long as the burner isn't on. I've noticed that if the flame is on with the bag touching the bottom, it tends to trap heat and overheats the grains. Keep the flame on until you get to 155* then turn it off and add your grains. You can even put the lid on to help maintain the temp. Slosh the grains around every so often and check up on the temp. If it drops below 155*, just lift the grains up while keeping them submerged as you turn the stove back on to reach the desired temp, then turn it back off and drop them back down.

Or... get a different pot that will allow you to keep them suspended.

 

Yeah the smaller pot would be the ticket. I always do my steeps on the stove. I can dial in to 155 and hold it very closely for the duration. As mentioned earlier, don't forget to include this water into the preboil volume so you don't accidentally overershoot your kettle content.

 

That makes sense. The lid on won't cause the off-flavors like it can when boiling? If i remember what i read it was because esters or something were being boiled off, and needed to escape, not be trapped by the lid. Just checking. Thanks!

 

I can see doing this so you can steep while the big pot is coming to a full boil... however, these are flavoring grains and not a partial mash correct? So temperature is important, but volume of water is not as important as in a mash. You are not mashing, you are merely brewing some grain tea for flavoring. You are not trying to abtain an enzyme conversion where mash ph is critical.

 

When my wife did her summer ale with steeping grains,I put a cake cooling rack in the bottom of my 5G BK. Worked great at keeping the grain bag off the bottom.

 

Correct. DMS development is not a concern during the steep.

 

Awesome. Thanks everyone for your help, time to brew!

 

Interesting...

Well I can't find the link I'm talking about, but here's another reference to it from "Brewing Classic Styles" by Jamil and John Palmer for further affirmation:

"For best flavor results, the ratio of steeping water to grain should be less than 1 gallon per pound. This will help keep the PH below 6 and minimize tannin extraction in alkaline water."

Both temperature and volume are definitely important. The other article I was referring to recommends even less steeping water, closer to the 1/2gal. per 1lb. grain I was talking about. Maybe slightly off with my 5.4 PH recommendation, but you get idea. Kinda mad I can't find the other article right now...

BTW, when mashing, maintaining PH is not only for enzyme conversion but also to curb tannin extraction as described above.

 

Id like it if you could, im always ready to learn something... I really only thought tannin extraction was an issue when temperatures rose above 170.

 

So, then, just another example of how kit instructions suck. They always tell you, even if your doing a full boil, to just toss the flavoring grains into your 5 gallons of water

 

This still isn't what I was referring to, but it also references the direct effect steep volume has in relation to PH and tannin extraction. This chart states steep volume should be no more than 3 quarts per 1lb. grain, even less than JZ and Palmer. It can be referrenced in the astringency problem row.

lol Kind of annoying I can't find the article I was referencing because it even goes into the correct sparge volume since a thin sparge results in a higher PH as well. But, as you can see, other sources describe the issue. Perhaps it wasn't from BYO after all. It wasn't just a chart, it was an entire article. Thought I had it saved; evidently not.

Still looking when I have time.

 

Last post unless I find the exact article.

It turns out it definitely was from BYO and I found an article referencing it here.

Scroll down to "Got grains?"

This is a direct reference to the article I was talking about, but not the article itself. In a nutshell, it talks about how PH is directly related to steep volume:

larger steep volume = higher PH = tannin extraction if PH is ~5.4 (just a ballpark, again, I need the article) and above.

While the steep volume is not important in relation to enzymatic activity or starch conversion (this is extract brewing, not all grain,) it is directly related to PH and a higher PH results in tannin extraction. Therefore, steep with no more than 1 - 3 quarts water per 1lb. grain for optimum results.

This also holds true for sparging and even less water is recommended for this: 0.5 - 1 quart per 1lb. grain.

I remember when I first started brewing, I constantly had a strange taste I later learned to be astringency due to excessive tannin extraction. Ever since, I steep/sparge in much less water with excellent results.

Try your luck at searching for the entire article. If you find it, a PM would be greatly appreciated since I have no clue where it went.

Thanks!

 

Aha, I stumbled upon a copy of the article! Here it is:

http://www.homebrewtalk.com/f39/steeping-grains-33868/index2.html

 

I made this mistake just three nights ago. I was brewing BM's centennial and I was planning on just using 1 gallon to steep the grains in. However, I used my 5 gallon pot to do this. Needless to say, there wasn't enough water to keep the grains suspended so I had to add 1 more gallon. Next time, I'll steep in one gallon using a much smaller pot. Hopefully it still turns out good though.