Sanke now what

I have been able to collect a German 50l keg in good shape. I also have co2 tank tap and fridge it will fit into. Right now I am limited to 5 gallon batches on brew day. Which direction would y'all suggest. Modifications to metal would not be an issue, I have welding and cutting equip.

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Wait. What?

What are you asking?

 

I would fill it with your homebrew, force carb and tap it. You could perhaps put two batches in it at once. Or you could put only 5 gallons in it and purge the head space w/ CO2.

 

This. I use 1/6 barrel sankeys for my beer. There are plenty of threads on how to remove the retaining ring and spear for cleaning/filling.

 

With only5 gallons and purging will be OK?

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It will be OK, you'll just waste a whole lot of CO2. Especially if you burst carb.

 

Converting it to a brew kettle is crazy and should I even consider converting to a fermenter.

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Is 10 gallons of Co2 at 10 psi really that much to be considered wasteful? Even 10 gallons at 20-30 psi is not really that much C02, by weight of course?

 

It's a lot more than that, I generally purge my corny kegs 3-5 times to get out as much of the air as possible, and that's with a tiny bit of headspace. With a huge volume like that there's going to be a ton of air, it's going to take lots of purging to minimize it.

Just look at the math real quick, I'll use 15 psi to keep the numbers clean:
Since an atmosphere is about 15 psi, if you pressurize to 15 psi above that you're basically doubling the amount of gas in the headspace. Then when you vent it, you cut it in half again. This means that each time you pressurize and purge at 15 psi, you're only reducing the amount of air by a factor of 2. If you purge that 10 gallons 3 times, there's still 12.5% of the air remaining, which means over a gallon at atmospheric pressure. So there's still a bunch of air that's going to stay in the keg and potentially oxidize the beer.

So OP would want to purge the crap out of the thing, which would use lots of CO2.

 

You analysis is off.
First, there is no way (at least not easily) of knowing how much Co2 (in weight) 10 gallons at 30 psi is. You would need to factor in temperature, altitude, etc.
Second, if you fill slowly from the bottom up, you don't need to waste a bunch of Co2. This can be demonstrated easily with a match. When the match goes out, it's full of Co2.
I would guess not more that 1/2 lb of Co2 is used to purge a large keg. At $2 per lb. is it really that much?

Personally I would convert it to a boil kettle and keep your eyes open for Corny's.

 

Sorry, but I don't think my analysis is off.

If you double the pressure in a fixed volume with a fixed temperature, which is exactly the case here, you're going to double the amount of gas in that volume. Go from 15psia to 30 psia in a 10 gallon space, and you now have twice the mass of gas. I used 15 psi as a nice number because it's close to the amount of one atmosphere at sea level. Of course altitude is going to change things a bit, but my argument is still very valid.

If you apply CO2 to a vessel containing 15 psia air and stop when you hit 30 psia you will now have a mixture of 50% air and 50% CO2. Vent it back to 15 psia, and you'll still have 50% air and 50% CO2. Pressurize again to 30 psia with CO2 and you'll now have 25% air and 75% CO2. Vent and purge again and you have 12.5% air. Etc.

I never stated any amount in weight, but I don't think that's a difficult matter at all if I wanted to calculate it. Why don't you think that's easy? Yes, you would need to know the absolute pressure and the temperature, but these are fairly standard assumptions to make. Let's assume you're near sea level, and at 70 degrees F. That means the atmospheric pressure is 14.7 psia, and one gallon of CO2 at this pressure and temperature is 0.157 moles = 6.9 grams = .015 lbs.

In that case, pressurizing the 10 gallons of headspace to 14.7 psig then venting it would use .15 lbs of CO2. Purge it 3 times and you'll use about half a pound of CO2, like you estimated (nice one by the way!). But like I said above, I wouldn't want 1.25 gallons of air still in my keg. If a full corny keg has 1/2 gallon of headspace (just a guess) you'd be down to 1/16 of a gallon (4 fl oz) of air after 3 purges. To get to that same level in the Sanke you'd need to purge about 10 times, which would use 1.5 lbs of CO2. That's a whole lot of CO2, especially considering you haven't carbonated yet.

It's not the cost as much as it being a PITA. Even if you only use half a pound extra each time you fill a keg, that's basically doubling your CO2 usage. CO2 may be relatively cheap, but it's annoying to remove the cylinder, bring it into a shop, pick it up again when it's full, etc. At least in my area my best bet is a fire extinguisher place that does fills with a next-day turnaround time. Obviously having an extra cylinder would make things easier and negate my argument somewhat.

I agree that this would be a much better method. Though a Sankey isn't set up for such a thing, so you'd have to drop a gas tube to the bottom with the spear removed and then very slowly purge that way. Is that what you were picturing?

Agree again. CO2 issue aside, 1/2 bbls Sankes are big and won't fit in a 7 cu foot keezer. I don't really see any advantage.

 

I did not mean to start a rumble. I am so stumbling into strange things this week. $30 so far and reading this forum a lot. I guess as a welder metal happens once the word is out.

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Not all of it use full or working at this time but I will look into rebuilding or repairing.

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Nice score!
You have a TIG?
You are in for a ride.

 

In the midst of making my keggle right now from a 1/2 bbl stainless keg. Cut the top with an angle grinder and putting the valve in. Not particularly challenging but interesting.


Making beer and hard cider in Southern Virginia since 2011.

 

Ah, but just wait until you get into tangial struff... whirlpool port, bottom draining port, really thin welded to really thick...ah, let the fun begin.
I'm running a Dynasty DX200. Just upgraded a bunch of stuff today. The fun just never ends.
Do you do 10 gal batches? I do 5 gal, and ferment in 1/4 bbl (7.75 gal tall skinnys) but pour from 5 gal. Corny's.
Being in the business, I suggest keeping your eyes open of some 1/4 bbl's. I can get two in my gatorade display fridge fermentation chamber (it's similar to yours), which is nice.
You gonna use that fridge for pouring or fermenting?

 

I ha the DX 200 as well sometimes I do good other times not so. The setup must be my issue. Been brewing for 1 yr and brewing 5 gallon batches I started the thread fishing for ideas. Being in Texas I realise last summer my ferment temps were high, so fridge might be for fermentation. Skipping all the bottling has its own allure though.

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