Nottingham vs Safale S04 vs Coopers Yeast (Which is best to prevent yeast bite)

I have never used Safale S04 or Nottingham, but I have had yeast bite in my beer using Coopers. I know Nottingham and S04 is meant to be really good. Therefore, which is the best at reducing the yeast taste in my beer?

I have a very prolonged after-taste in my beer. It is not infected, but I can tell it has that 'home-brew' taste. Would Nottingham or S04 have the potential to reduce this?

Also, does bottle conditioning improve on yeast bite compared to just the flavour of the beer? This after-taste is overpowering the taste of the beer.

Cheers.

 

What temperature is your beer during fermentation?

 

I fermented in my kitchen which is constantly at 20 Celsius. I know that it never got more than that. There is no fruity tones (like banana), just a very bitter taste that is not in commercial beers (not good bitter).

 

20 C is a bit warm, fermentation produces some heat by itself. Something closer to 16 C ambient would be better.
Another thing to look at would be your water, if you have excessive sulfate or magnesium it can lead to more perceived bitterness.
There's also the issue of time, if you haven't let your beer age enough you could have excessive yeast in suspension. Is the beer clear?

 

Rob, just for the sake of asking, are you sure that you're tasting yeast bite? I've found that bitter aftertaste is often due to hard water. What is your water source? What style beers are you brewing? (I assume they are extract kits?)

BTW, I've never used Coopers yeast but I have had good success with Nottingham, S-04 and S-05.

 

What is best to eliminate the yeast bite is more time in the fermenter. 3 weeks minimum, 4 or more for a dark beer. Give that yeast time to finish the ferment, time to clean up the side effects of the ferment, and time to mature and settle out.

 

I completely agree. When I was just getting started, the best I could do for temp control was about 75* and I made two batches with Nottingham that were less than pleasant. US05 under the same conditions produced a better beer (but still not great by any means).

 

I used my tap water and it is quite hard water. Yes, I am doing extract kits. I guess the only thing I can do is to experiment with different yeasts, use bottled water that is not hard and use lower temperatures in order to find the cause of the problem.

 

Yes, the best bet is to do everything possible to give your beer the best chance of success. Since you specifically said it has a bitter aftertaste, my bet is still on the water. However, I'd still go with one of the other yeasts, and better temp control will absolutely produce a better beer.

Are you able to get a water report from your water company? If so, you can compare your water profile with the typical water profile for the style. Beers typically brewed in regions with hard water (Stout for example), will taste better with hard water. Beers brewed in regions with soft water (Pilsners) will taste better with soft water. If you brew a pilsner or amber ale with hard water, it will taste bitter. If you have your water's profile, you can blend it with bottled water to achieve a more appropriate amount of mineral content. That said, you could get away with just using bottled water and not worrying about blending.

Since your kitchen stays at about 20*C/68*F you'll probably want to bring your fermentation down a few degrees depending on the yeast strain. You could probably manage this easy enough with the swamp cooler method. This basically entails putting your fermentor in a tub with some shallow water, draping a cloth over it which hangs into the water, and blowing on it with a fan.

My last question for you is "How long do you let your beer ferment and bottle condition before drinking it?" Could it also be that your beer is just green?

 

20*C = 68F. That's a pretty good ale temperature. I wonder if the "yeast bite taste" is really the "extract twang" instead.

 

That's a good temperature for the inside of the fermenter, I'd imagine it's actually ~72+ during active fermentation if that's the ambient temperature.

 

That's what I was going to say from the beginning of this thread...

So you said this was an extract kit, did it come with LME in cans? When in the boil did you add the LME?

 

Does it taste like classic "extract twang"? Burnt sugars are unfermenatable and can cause undesireable flavors. This problem may be due to over-cooking DME/LME, which has already been processed with a full boil i.e. you're double cooking your wort... like baking a loaf of bread a second time... burnt!

 

Are there any tips to keep your temp down in warmer conditions? On all the extract packs i have bought they state that the temp needs to sit between 20c-30c. Most of my brews have sat consistantly at 28c. Based on the other posts in this thread that is way too high. It's consistantly about 35 degrees c outdoors atm and had just had my beer sat in the garage. I'm considering moving it into my bathtub with it half filled with water and some frozen water bottles to keep the temperature down. Most of my brews have had an unpleasant bitter after taste (not good hoppy bitterness) I'm guessing this could be from the temperatures being too high?

 

I floated a beer thermometer in my fermenter to take an actual reading (I love floating thermometers) and it was about 20 Celsius during fermentation (actual wort temperature), so the ambient temperature did not affect it in this instance.

This was even when at prime fermentation. I also had an LCD thermometer on the side that did not get above 20 Celsius.

I let it sit in primary for 9 days (I realise now that 2-3 weeks is better). Also, I let it bottle condition to carbonate for two weeks.

I heated some water and added the DME and small amount of dextrose I was using to dissolve it. I then emptied this into the fermenter. I topped it up with cool water to the right temperature for pitching, then lastly added the hopped malt extract to the fermenter.

May I add that when tasting the beer prior to bottling, i.e. just after primary fermentation has finished (about 7 days), it tastes OK. The strong, undesirable bitterness (that is not with commercial beers) comes after bottling (I drink it after a hydrometer test). I bottle in coopers dark, plastic bottles that say oxygen baring, so I don't think it is an oxygen problem.

So, to get a beer that is OK at my temperature range, without trying to control it with a swamp cooler, is Safale S05? If so, I will try that and see if I get any better results.

 

YBC, how long did you let yours sit after bottling, and do you have hard or soft water? What yeast did you use?

 

I left one for about 3 months and the other for 2. I've used tap water (hard?) each time. After reading through here i'm going to move on to spring water. I've used Saflager w3470 and I think Saflager S23.

 

You may be getting that home brew taste from under pitching your yeast. I just read an article in BYO about home brew that doesn't have the correct yeast pitch rate. According to that article under pitching will cause that home brew tang. BYO March-April (pg 55 Major league Pitching)

 

Rob, hopefully you still have some of that beer bottled, because I'd like you to give it a try after about 8 weeks in the bottle and let me know what you think. Nine days in the fermentor and two weeks in the bottle is not enough time. The bitter taste will mellow quite a bit over time, and it could very well be that your beer is just green.

The bad flavor you descibe is "bitter aftertaste" (not woody, fruity, alcoholic or vinegary - which I would attribute to yeast and temp). The primary causes of bitter aftertaste are water and hops (I'm also eliminating astringency from tannins usually caused by overheating grains). Making your next batch with S-05 and bottled water will absolutely make a better beer, but I wouldn't rule out that the flavor may just be in the kit itself.

 

I also use extract (Mr Beer (Coopers) mostly) I have medium hard water, I cut it with distilled to get a softer profile and you can taste the difference.
For temp control I use a Coleman's cooler with freezer picnic ice packs. I can monitor the temp using a digital reptile thermometer taped onto the fermenter. I feed the sensor cable in through the drain hole. Changing ice packs 2x per day will give me low 50's for lager, and less often for the higher ranges.