Keggle weld prices really vary in Baltimore

I figured finding a welder for the keggles would be quick and easy. This has not been the case. Just getting a welder to return my calls has been difficult. Obviously these guys are busy. My recent price quotes, from those that have called, range for 100.00/keg to 385/2 kegs. I will get the tops cut off, holes drilled and 3 nipples(I supply the nipples) TIG welded. The 100/keg guy seems to know his stuff. BUT even this seems a bit too high for me. I can drill and cut but they threw that into the deal. I was thinking 100-125 for all 6 welds. Am I wrong? My buddy does MIG and am thinking of going that way. What do y'all think? Thanks Charlie

 

No brainer to me. I'd get my buddy to MIG weld it if he's halfway decent at it.

 

1+ for the Buddy

 

you don't want a MIG weld on stainless... you need a back gassed TIG weld if you want it clean... Talk to Yuri on this subject...

 

A good welder will charge you at least $50/hr. If you ask, most will take cash for a reduced price (~$35 around me) especially if they are a smaller shop that caters to custom jobs. I think that is a pretty fair price, especially with all the cutting and prep work. I would say go for the pro instead of having your friend massacre that thing with a MIG. It comes down to a question of quality vs. cost... do you want nice kettles for a little more, or usable kettles (if your friend is good) for cheap?

I think $100/kettle is pretty cheap if he actually knows what he is doing and backgases or fluxes the welds.

 

I got similar quotes over the phone. You really have to drive around to all the shops and your best bet is to find one that is open on a Saturday when the bosses are away. The welders are likely to take a quick job for pocket cash.

You'll find some that don't want the small job because their working on I-beams for a $2B contruction account. They'll quote you ridiculous prices as a nice way of telling you no.

I paid $130 for 9 couplings and it was one of the better quotes I got.

Talk to custom motorcycle shops and railing fabricators.

 

WOW...For that price, I'd go get a Tig, learn to weld with it, and go to town making keggles to sell on the internet....wait...I could do that!

MMMMMM

My Buddy charges $5 an inch for TIG welding Stainless or Aluminum. That'd be $15 to weld in a bung, and to cut the top with a plazma cutter...maybe $20

 

I saw this old post about MIG and figured that it migth be the way to go
http://www.homebrewtalk.com/f11/mig-welding-keggles-65029/
When people say MIG is not clean what do they mean? Is a good MIG job as good as a poor TIG job?
I also read (somewhere) that a TIG weld is not as strong as a MIG job. True??

 

NOT TRUE!
NHRA (drag racing governing body for those of you in Rio Linda) specifies that any car frame and or cage that is made of mild steel may be welded with either MiG or TiG, But any car going faster than 9.000 second 1/4 mile must have a frame constructed of Chrome Molly steel and must be TiG welded.

The acronyms:
TIG (Tungsten Inert Gas) creates a weld by passing electricity between a tungsten tip and the work surface, this creates a puddle of molten metal and allows you to feed a third bit of metal (rod) into the puddle to create the weld. This process is slow, and thus allows impurities to surface and eliminates porosity in the weld.
MIG (Metal Inert Gas) The process generates heat from an electric arc maintained between a consumable wire feed electrode and the part being welded. This process produces spatter making it difficult for the operator to see the weld and causing damage to nearby surfaces and objects from the hot particles thrown off.

 

BK is right. A TIG weld is superior to a MIG weld if properly applied.

 

Yeah, but for a fitting on a keggle? I soldered some fittings on my HLT with no issues.

 

Ok, so TIG is superior BUT what is bad w/ MIG? Is it just a 'rough' finish?

 

I am not an experienced welder by any means so I hope someone like Yuri or one of the other fabricators out there will step in but......

In my experience, MIG welding on thin stock (such as a keg) is very difficult and often results in blowthrough, uneven heat, cracking. All of these things are bad for a brewing environment. Maybe some people could do it and have an acceptable outcome, but I think that the whole welding a coupler into a keg thing is much more difficult than most people believe. The metals may be different material, the thicknesses are widely varied, back gassing is a pain in the neck, and welding round couplers to begin with on mild steel is a challenge for a novice. If you friend is professional welder who says it can be done with his MIG machine and he does good work, and you are comfortable with it... then go for it, I won't be changing your mind. But if it is a buddy who likes to work on cars and has a wall plug welder... I would expect to be looking to buy a new keg after he is done with it, and very happy if I came away with something usable.

Not to be a downer, but properly placed expectations are part of why I am a carefree happy go lucky person. A build up for a big failure is no fun for anyone, and at the end of the day, if your friend skews up your new keg that you just bought, that will be awkward.

Good luck!

 

Yeah he's one of these guys...to a T Thanks, Charlie

 

I mig welded my keggles. It is definitely not as nice as tig, but it gets the job done. These fittings are not exactly holding much pressure, so structurally it is no big deal, as long as they don't leak. My mig welds definitely don't look as nice as what you get with a tig weld, but I spend $45 on a spool of 304 mig wire, and used my regular Ar CO2 mix for gas. I didn't back gas either, so the back sides dont look beautiful, but this is a keggle, so it doesn't need to be sanitary like a fermenter. (I definitely would NOT mig a fermenter).

 

if the keggle is being used for boiling, you don't worry about when your beer gets below sanitization temperatures while you are chilling it?

 

NO. The boil kills any bugs that might be hiding....

 

Charlie,

There is a guy in Frederick that is pretty reasonable from what I hear. If you are still interested I can find out more.

Erik

 

For those folks that do not want to back gas the welds you can use "Solar Flux" weld backup flux applied to weld area to prevent weld area from turning black. An alternate product is "Superior #9" welding flux, these can be obtained from the welding supply companies as a dry powder that you mix with alcohol or water to make a slurry that you paint on the backside of the weld area.

 

I read a few post and think MIG is fine, then I read another I think TIG for sure....then MIG then TIG. So I am going to try to get TIG BUT if i can't get a decent price I will go MIG.

Another possible way to do this. A friend had a coupling(maybe nipple) welded(MIG or TIG) onto the outside of the keg THEN the keg was drilled out. If this method is used I don't think back gassing will be needed??? Does this sound like a smart way to go. Charlie
PS He's been brewing w/ his keggle for 15 years, no leaks.

 

The only problem is that you won't be able to thread anything in from the back side.

 

No.
Back gassing is the process of flooding the inside of the keg with inert gas to prevent the rapid ozidation of the molten metal. When you weld someting, you use electricity to get it molten hot, and the 2 pools of liquid metal flow together and bond. If you don't back gas, the back side of the metal will turn black and bubble from oxygen reacting with the liquid metal...weather you've drilled the hole or not.

 

+1 on TIG over MIG. If you insist on having them welded (vs. weldless), then spend the cash to have someone do it right. TIG will turn out much better.

PM me. I might have someone in Linthicum who can do it. No clue at all what he'd charge.

 

I thought that might be a problem. Good I guess if you want to add sight glass and therm, not so good for a valve.

 

But the method I described has no back to be gassed. A coupling is "held" against a non-drilled keg. These are welded together THEN the keg drilled thus no back area for gas. It's all on one side. Bobby pointed out the negs of this in a previous post.

 

I recently got 1 coupling each welded into my 2 keggles. I shopped around got quotes of 100-150 to weld them in. Keep in mind I already had the couplings, holes drilled for coupling and tops cut off and finished. I then found a guy who quoted me 25 per weld. He assured me he'd back gas and do sanitary weld. When I got them back he had not back gassed because he said he could figure out a way short of flipping it upside down and flooding (which I thought yeah so why didn't you do that). They came back looking rough and black on the inside with the threads warped. I called him and wasn't very polite. He came and picked it up that night, cleaned up the insides, we tapped the threads and cleaned it all up nicely, and brought it back the next day. All throughout this process he drove to my house for pickups and deliveries. I probably wouldn't use him again for this type of application, but for basic welding I will. I was very impressed with his service and support after he had my money.

If doing it again, I would pay the extra. You get what you pay for. In a couple months you will have forgotten about that money you spent, but you won't forget about the rusty welds you now have in your ruined keggle if you don't do it right.

 

Good point. I have thought about that but I hear of so many folks with good welds for a lot cheaper. I am going to check out a few motorcycle shops near me and get a few more quotes then make my mind up. I just thought this part would be quick and easy.
I was also wondering if the top was not opened initially, keg filled w/ argon through the small opening (original diptube), cover that and weld...does this sound feasible?

 

You are still welding to the side of the keg....and the inside WILL need to be shielded...even if you haven't drilled it yet. And yes...Bobby is also right.

 

I guess you are protecting the actual SS of the keggle. I was thinking the co2 was for the ss solder not everything. Thanks for the info.

 

It's not a big enough job for a welder to do commercially.

I just turn up with a six pack of beer and a pre drilled keg.
They supply a 1/2inch nipple and weld it in 5 minutes. I have offered them a 20 as well but they are happy with the beer.

They only weld one side but it penetrates to the back.

I would no let a mig welder near a kettle in fear of a bad job.

 

That's more a matter of not knowing a competent mig welder, not a matter that it can't be done correctly.

 

I inspect welds for a living. Almost all of our work is stainless pipe and tube and we only use TIG for stainless hand welds, or an orbital machine on tubing. We install the tanks, tubing, valves, ect. in pharmaceutical plants. TIG is a superior process for stainless. MIG and stick welding are used in other industries because they are much faster (more weld feet per hour) and generally easier (less training time/less skill required on average) to perform.
I luckily haven't had to travel alot for my job but my experience is when I do have to go north from Philly up welders make 45-50 bucks an hour. So those prices are not really high for the Baltimore area.

 

Anyone who got estimates please PM or post,
Thanks Charlie

 

im confused about what u actually need welded.. just 3 bungs per keg??how big are the bungs??? im assuming the kegs are aluminum. or are they stainless.. because aluminum can be mig and tig welded fine as long as the welder is experienced.,( i.e both would be good looking welds done properly)
if it is stainless the same applies as above

 

I actually found a guy in Baltimore who is doing all 3 kegs for $85 with me cutting the tops and making the holes for the fittings. He is a professional welder and this is just something he does on the side. I'll provide his contact info if anybody wants it.

 

Narco thread.

Is he sanitary welding them?

 

Mine aren't sanitary because I don't need it but he is a skilled welder so he could probably do it.