food poisoning scare

Over the weeked I served some of my brew to my dad and a few friends. Now I have not checked with my friends but me and my dad both get sick. But so did my wife and kid, they didn't have any of it. Should I dump it or did I just get some bug somewhere.

 

If your wife and kid got the same thing, it's not your beer. Supposedly, nothing that can hurt you can grow in beer.

 

Ok good. I couldnt ever look at my pale ale I have in my carby without feeling like yaking.

 

I get sick when I drink my homebrew too, but that's usually because I drink too much

There is a stomach bug that's been going around the past month or so. I had it 2 weeks ago and my son got it this weekend.

 

The yeast content of homebrew really messes with me, but this doesn't sound like the same thing. Wife and kid shouldn't be sick if it was your brew. I wouldn't worry.

 

http://www.cdc.gov/ncidod/dvrd/revb/gastro/norovirus-keyfacts.htm

 

Damn it now im freaked out again

 

I wouldn't be too freaked out. At least it's not the beer.

 

Look elsewhere for your issues, NOT your beer.

Nothing pathogenic can grow in beer, so nothing in homebrew can make you sick. You can't get food poisoning or anything like that. In fact beer was brewed and used in place of water just becasue it was safer usually than the water.

I wrote this awhile ago and it's been posted all through here. It was written for an old thread. But the information is something you all need to know.

However people can have allergies/ or an intolerence to beer ingredients, someone could have an allergy to hops, or yeast, or the gluten in the grain, someone could be lactose in tolerant and have gastric issues from a sweet stout.

There's going to be two kinds of reactions, things like hives and respiratory, like a peanut allergy, and someone can get cramps and the runs-which is more like a lactose issue.

But they are going to be pretty immediate, the hives and resp are going to happen within minutes, if not sooner, and the GI would still more than likely happen within an hour maybe 2.

True food allergies are your body's immune (IgE) response to food proteins, and only food proteins. The most common are milk, egg, peanuts, tree nuts and shellfish. Food intolerance (Gluten/Lactose) causes strictly GI issues, although food allergens will cause vomiting, but along with the other symptoms, such as hives, swelling, etc.

And the thing is, if someone is allergic to most of the beer ingredients then a) then they will be allergic to all beers, even commercial, unless it is yeast, then it would be with SOME commercial beers, that are unfiltered. BUT they would also then be allergic to bread as well. Since the same yeast is used in baking.

The hardest one to figure would be a hop allergy, since except for beer, hops don't really appear in other things. BUT then also, the person would be allergic to other beers as well.

When people post asking about this, I usually caution them to look to other things in their environment rather than homebrew, since those allergies are rare and manifest with similar ingredients (like bread) or happen with commercial beers as well.

Look eleswhere for your problems NOT in you beer.

 

Ok thanks I was ganna dump it all tonight if I thought it was toxic. Its was not the best beer I made but a shame to waste it.

 

You know you're not using any sense, common or otherwise, you said in the initial post "But so did my wife and kid, they didn't have any of it." So how the HELL would you blame your homebrew for making you all sick if they didn't have any? The "food poisoning germs" somehow flew out of your beer and ended up in them? I know this homebrewing is scary stuff because it is new to you, but in the end it's food, actually it's safer than food, because you CAN'T get sick from it, so you don't need to throw common sense out the window.

 

If you got sick about 4-6 hours after the meal, I would guess that the meal involved milk, chicken, or raw eggs some how. Not being a stranger to this malady it usually is poultry or milk products which are the culprits, as certain bacteria can really cause some grief by cross contamination of foods and cutting boards used in food prep. As stated before home brew beer is not the source of the problem so don't toss it out.

 

I've repeatedly heard the claim that no known pathogen can survive in beer, but I am not at all convinced this is absolutely true and especially so when it comes from those who just parrot stuff they hear or read without having any scientific background on the subject. Any pathologists out there that might shed some light on this?

 

We've been over this a fafillion times on this forum.....

 

While I am sure there is probably some supervirus/mold/bacteria that can survive in beer, the fact that fermented beverages have been used since ancient times as a safe, potable liquid in preference to water indicates to me that it's pretty damn hard to get sick from it.

 

If you don't want to believe it that's your idiocy, not the truth...As I've said a million times on here, I've work in medical education for nearly 25 years, and have researched this thoroughly.... You can do it yourself even on the internet without Access to Pubmend, or Medline, or the biochemists, pathologists, and other doctors and researches I have access to...

You can start with This

(I think Charles Bamforth should be an authority enough for you. I've documented most of this online in the every several months threads that pop up...most of the same info is already here. Like here. This whole thread has a lot of the info, even about the "dreaded" fusarium mycotoxin.)

Just because you don't believe something doesn't mean YOU'RE right....I mean I still believe that those 20something strippers that used send me friend requests on myspace, really did want my old ass and weren't scammers in nigera or 50 year old naked fat guys.

 

Or,

Abstract
The aim of this study was to investigate the factors affecting the survival and growth of four food-borne pathogens (Escherichia coli O157:H7, Salmonella Typhimurium, Listeria monocytogenes, and Staphylococcus aureus) in sweet and fermenting brewery wort. The Gram-negative pathogens (E. coli and Salm. Typhimurium) were capable of growth during the initial stages of fermentation in hopped wort, although they were quickly inactivated when added during the later stages of fermentation. When the wort was left unpitched, the two Gram-negative pathogens grew unabated. Pathogen growth and survival was enhanced as the pH was increased, and as both the ethanol and original gravity were decreased. Although having no effect on the Gram-negative pathogens, low levels of hop iso-α-acids were sufficient to inhibit L. monocytogenes, and a synergistic antimicrobial effect between iso-α-acids and pH was observed. S. aureus failed to initiate growth in all of the test worts. There appears to be no reason for concern of the safety of a “typical” wort during fermentation, however due attention should be paid when wort is stored or antimicrobial hurdles are lowered, for example in the production of reduced and alcohol-free beer, and in unpasteurised products.

 

I happen to know of a case where a beer was infected with this stuff:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Streptococcus

My point was that it is not impossible for beer to become contaminated with a pathogen as is so often claimed. That's all. Not a big deal. Relax!

 

What about pathogenic yeast?

 

Hey wait a minute I am only 43

 

Revvy, I doubt you even have a high school diploma. IOW, I disregard just about everything you post. Don't take it personally though.

 

Revvy, do you yell at anyone who asks a question? Relax man you just had surgery. It's just beer.

 

How do you know this for a fact? Are you sure the bottle wasn't contaminated? The glass? That's not the same as the beer.

I'm not going to bother debating this with you.

Why don't you ask Charles Bamforth himself if it is possible....here he is on facebook http://www.facebook.com/people/Charles-Bamforth/100000231270529#!/CharlieBamforth

Just be sure to share the answer with the rest of us.

 

He's not yelling - he's just copying & pasting from a different time.....when he did yell at someone.

 

This.

 

THere are so many people who are freaked out about this beer stuff, every day. Some folks still believe you can go blind from homebrewing. There's a lot of ignorance out here. Everytime a thread like this comes out hundreds of new brewers hang on with baited breath just really ready for their greatest fears to be confirmed. Look at the OP, despite the fact that his wife and child did NOT drink beer he believed his beer caused food poisoning in his family and was going to dump it out.

Sue me, but i think it's important where this is concerned that facts and the truth is presented where this is concerned...Not fear mongering, and ignorance. So I take this serious...That's why I put a lot of time and effort in researching this stuff. And presenting info whenever stuff like this comes up. I think it's pretty important.


*shrug*

 

Well if you want to believe that and ignore what I post that's your prerogative, my "credentials," and biography and level of schooling and pretty much everything else about me is on here. I'm pretty much an open book on hbt. Even my real name is on here, and I can be googled quite thoroughly for my non homebrewing work as well.

 

As to Strep, this article mentions that hops inhibit it in the formation of Dental Caries, http://books.google.com/books?id=Qq...zgK#v=onepage&q=Streptococcus in beer&f=false

It's google books so I can't quote the passage. But it again lends credence to the idea that Streptoccus can't exist in beer either.

Like I said, Bamforth can probably set you or us straight.

 

Those articles make special notice of unpasteurized beer as not being perfectly safe.

 

Tell me anything that is perfectly safe?

 

Nothing that can harm you can survive in beer, not just homebrew, but ALL beer. It may taste so bad that the taste may induce vomiting but I assure you it is still safe to drink. The only exception to this rule that I can think of is MGD 64 and Select 55 because the ABV% may not be high enough to sustain an indefinite shelf life.

Those studies clearly state they were studying the wort and wort during fermentation. If you leave unpitched wort exposed or inoculate the unpitched wort with a bacteria it is hardly a test. Most of those test do not even boil the samples or add hops so IMO they are a piss poor example to post the .0000000000000000000000000000000000000000000001 % chance of it happening naturally. They yeast during a normal fermentation will beat out and starve all the pathogens or KILL them from the alcohol rendering it SAFE TO DRINK.

Once upon a time the water would kill you make you sick. Early peoples knew that the fermented brews were safe to drink and everyone, including children, drank beer. Please take the fear mongering BS some place else. I have a greater chance of turning into a lycanthrope than I do of becoming sick from a beer. That chance BTW is None at all...

 

These sort of posts really are becoming funny to me, I mean how many times have you read or heard on the news that someone (responsible) has gotten sick or died from ingesting beer, EVER . . . . . . . Now try to remember how many times in the RECENT past you've read or heard on the news that someone has gotten sick or died from ingesting spinach or lettuce?

 

Plenty of college kids do every year. :cross:

 

A responsible person would have read every word of my previous post.

 

Which ones in particular? There are only a few known wild yeasts that can live in beer and they are particularly pathogenic. If you are immunocomprimised and you have a large case of beer crazy infected with Megasphaera (a strange anaerobic bacteria), then I could see you having a slight problem, but people with those kind of conditions also should not be walking in the woods. So that is not a real life example.

 

What about hepatitis!?

 

I wouldn't recomend it.

 

Infected beer in studies has also been a contributing factor in unprotected sex and unexpected pregnancies.

 

I don't think it's wise to speak in absolutes about this topic, though I can sympathize with trying to quell the "will my beer make me sick?" threads.

I don't make the assumption that everyone who asks this question has completed a successful fermentation. If the fermentation didn't complete, for any number of reasons, the end product could be susceptible to foodborne pathogens, though this would probably be a rare occurrence. Technically speaking, though, it wouldn't actually be beer that made them sick, but infected wort.

This is why I don't universally tell people theirs beers are safe to drink; though it's extremely rare that fermentations completely fail.

 

You really do live up to your name don't ya?

Jk!

Cheers!