Cider Yeast Selection

[RPh_Guy]

The general thing to do is try different yeasts and see which one(s) you like and work well with your process.

Which yeasts are "must try"? Is there a repository of information somewhere I'm missing that explains different flavors and other characteristics?
https://byo.com/stories/issue/item/3479-yeast-selection-for-cider - this article is great but pretty limited. The yeast I use isn't even mentioned. Think we can do better?

Kevin has an extreme wealth of info up in the sticky but 1. it's not exactly organized (sorry Kevin) and 2. he's specifically looking for yeasts that fit his process (not too fast, cold crash easily, sweet cider only).

Currently I fully ferment my juice and then bottle carb. Is that what most people do?

 

[RPh_Guy]

Yeasts mentioned on this thread as of Nov 8 2017

WLP775 - English Cider Yeast
"My favorite so far is WLP775.... left it with more body and apple flavor. It does have a stronger sulfur smell when it's fermenting, but it's not overwhelming." - ericbw
"excellent dry cider, drops out for a brilliantly clear beverage." - DaleP
"not a fan" - MarkKF

Wyeast 4766 - Cider
"excellent dry cider, drops out for a brilliantly clear beverage." - DaleP

Red Star Premier Cuvee
Leaves abundant apple flavor fermented at 68F. Finishes dry to semi-dry and very clean and neutral. Very well-behaved -- starter and/or blowoff unnecessary - RPh_Guy

Red Star Cotes de Blanc
"My favorite so far is Côte des Blancs." - z-bob
"Not only did it finish below 1.000, the apple goodness was basically gone." - Morrey
"strips out the apple character and doesn't impart any fruit character itself" - Albionwood
"I've tried nearly a dozen yeasts. Cote des Blancs is the best there is. It ferments slowly and preserves the apple character and some residual sweetness around 0.998, as opposed to many other yeasts that ferment fast and bone-dry down to 0.992." - dmtaylor

Vintner's Harvest - AW4
"It has a lot of banana-ish character that's not very good in the still cider but might be okay when it's fizzy." - z-bob

Lalvin DV10

Lalvin R-HST (for ice cider)

Lalvin D47
"preserves the natural apple fruit character. fermented cold (<60F)" - Albionwood
"retains apple flavor, ferments well cold (48-52F) and produces a very high level of glycerol (for mouthfeel) compared to other wine yeasts. A good yeast for extended aging on lees, imparts complexity without off-flavors when aged cold." - ten80

WLP Scottish Cider Yeast Blend
"The best yeast I have used to date is White Labs Scottish Cider yeast." - Drewed

Danstar Nottingham
"good" - MarkKF

EC-1118
"too dry" - MarkKF
"too dry (sub 0.999 FG) and strips some apple flavor" - ten80

S-04
"good" - MarkKF
"good for quick-finishing ciders that retain a clean, crisp, if perhaps tart flavor. Doesn't impart any beneficial fruity esters like D47. Ferments juice nicely at 50-55F once it gets started. May take 2-3 days to start in juice with a pH below 3.5." - ten80

71B
"pretty good" - MarkKF
"Stronger fermentor than D47, will ferment as cold as 46 F. Good for cysers and ciders with added sugars. Retains apple flavor maybe as well as D47. Attenuates to 1.000 or slightly below with most ciders." - ten80

Safcider
"very good results" - MarkKF

Brewer&#8217;s Best Cider House select
"very good results" - MarkKF

S-33 Saflager
"my favorite has been S-33 Saflager yeast m very apple forward off dry cider" - wuyi_wulf

WLP720 Sweet Mead
"a great semi-sweet cider yeast. very clean cider with tons of apple character and enough residual sweetness (0.998 FG) to where my wife (who prefers sweet-sweet cider) loves it -- she drinks it more than I do, actually . Not nearly as active as [WLP002], but with some patience it will produce a wonderful (and clear!) cider." - jacobelong

WLP002 (English Ale)
"very dry and left a strong yeast-bread flavor which I found quite unpleasant. I prefer my cider on the off-dry / semi-sweet side, though." - jacobelong

Red Star Montrachet
"strips out the apple character and doesn't impart any fruit character itself" - Albionwood

Red Star Premier Blanc (Champagne Yeast)
"I've only done a few batches with premier blanc but have to give the thumbs down so far." - johnnyseko

Safale T-58
"Made a horribly sulfurous cider which a year later I am still trying to save. I fermented it around 65f which may have been too warm." - ten80

 

[RPh_Guy]

Reserved

 

[DaleP]

I really like the liquid cider yeasts from either White Labs or Wyeast. Both make an excellent dry cider, drop out for a brilliantly clear beverage.

 

[Morrey]

I am no expert on cider making or cider yeasts for that matter, but the wrong yeast can potentially strip the apple flavor out if not careful. I previously used Cotes de Blanc, and not only did it finish below 1.000, the apple goodness was basically gone. I had to use FAJC to try and salvage the hard cider.

This time around I'm using WLP775 English Cider yeast. Even if the FG is way low, it is said not to strip the apple goodness like some other yeast strains. I can always adjust the sweetness on the back end, but to lose all your apple flavor is hard to deal with.

 

[ericbw]

My favorite so far is WLP775. We've used wine, champagne, Coopers, Nottingham, and I think US-05. I thought 775 left it with more body and apple flavor. It does have a stronger sulfur smell when it's fermenting, but it's not overwhelming.

Our ideal situation is to ferment dry, then backsweeten and dilute it with about 2/3 fermented and 1/3 fresh cider. We have filtered the fermented cider before mixing in the fresh. It also makes sense to kill off any wild yeast in the fresh cider if it comes from an orchard. And use pectic enzyme to clear it.

Then we keg it.

I know this is a more complicated process than most use, but getting sweet, bubbly cider that won't keep fermenting is tricky! The only other (reasonable) practice would be to backsweeten and bottle pasteurize.

 

[Pappers_]

I use Nottingham FWIW

 

[ericbw]

That's a good article in BYO. I might try Safcider just to see. Some people also say that S-04 leaves some sweetness.

What is the yeast you use, OP?

 

[z-bob]

My favorite so far is Côte des Blancs.

I have a batch bottle-conditioning right now that was fermented with AW4; not sure if I like it or not. It has a lot of banana-ish character that's not very good in the still cider but might be okay when it's fizzy.

And i have a one gallon experiment using S-33 beer yeast that fermented very nicely and is clearing. I haven't sampled it yet.

I did not like the "apple wine" I made with Premier Cuvee and lots of sugar at all.

Currently I fully ferment my juice and then bottle carb. Is that what most people do?

That's what I do.

 

[mwilcox]

DV10 mostly for me, HST for Ice Cider. I occasionally will make a fruit cider with 3711. Most beer yeasts aren't clean enough for me; I just find them "yeasty"...but I've been fooled by a couple other peoples' Cal Ale efforts. I've used the majority of what he recommends. I sometimes feel that some yeasts are getting a bad rap for stripping out character. I believe uninteresting apples and excessively warm and fast fermentations do more harm in many cases. Probably my top thing at this point is ability to work at a low nutrient level without tending towards H2S production.

 

[Drewed]

The best yeast I have used to date is White Labs Scottish Cider yeast. It is a vault yeast, so hoard it! Lol
Nottingham works well. And I have had good luck with &#8220;monistary&#8221; or &#8220;abby&#8221; ales.
I find most &#8220;wine&#8221; yeasts strip too much of the apple flavor for my tastes, and I like a little yeast in my cider. Champagne yeast is a definite no-go for me.
What your going to have to do is find what works best for your tastes and your apples.

 

[Albionwood]

Best would be a yeast that preserves the natural apple fruit character. There are very few of these; the best I've tried is D47 wine yeast, fermented cold (<60F). WLP775 is good too, but I like the mouthfeel D47 imparts.

Next best is a yeast that imparts fruitiness, like Belgian or English ale yeasts. These also work with the cold-crashing technique.

Worst is aggressive yeast that strips out the apple character and doesn't impart any fruit character itself, such as Epernay (champagne), Montrachet, etc. Oddly, these are widely recommended for cidermaking.

 

[RPh_Guy]

What is the yeast you use, OP?

I've made 4 batches with Red Star Premier Cuvee. Fermented at 66-68F for a few weeks I find it leaves abundant apple flavor and very light sweetness (semi-dry). Very fast, extremely clean, and neutral. It does take a few months to clear on its own (in pasteurized juice) but I drink it before then.
It is a strain of S. bayanus, like many of the other popular cider yeasts.
Don't bother making a starter for this little guy. It starts fermenting immediately just after sprinkling it right onto the must.

This is literally the only yeast I've used for cider so far and I have a 5th batch fermenting right now. I've been mainly experimenting with different juice sources and recipes.

I did not like the "apple wine" I made with Premier Cuvee and lots of sugar at all.

Adding extra sugar and then fermenting dry is a no-no for almost any yeast from what I see on this forum. The flavor will be gone.

 

[dmtaylor]

I've tried nearly a dozen yeasts. Cote des Blancs is the best there is. It ferments slowly and preserves the apple character and some residual sweetness around 0.998, as opposed to many other yeasts that ferment fast and bone-dry down to 0.992.

The slower the ferment, the more control you have, and the better the finished product too IMO. Then if you want to cut fermentation short around 1.010 or wherever to retain sweetness, you can add gelatin to knock the yeast out of suspension, then add sorbate to hurt the remaining yeast. You can do this with any yeast, but when gravity is changing by 5+ points per day, not as easy to do.

 

[johnnyseko]

I visited Angry Orchard yesterday, after the tour I asked what yeast they use - it's a secret...

I'm fermenting to the end and bottle carbing as well. Will soon be trying bottle pasteurizing to retain some sweet as well.

I've only done a few batches with premier blanc but have to give the thumbs down so far.

 

[RPh_Guy]

Any other suggestions for good dry cider yeasts? (and any related tips, comments, or potential problems?)

I've been structuring them into a rough list you can see at the beginning of the thread with the hopes that it will help someone. I know it will help me when I decide to experiment.

Cheers

 

[MarkKF]

I’ve used EC-1118, too dry
S-04 & Notty Ale, good
White Labs 775, not a fan
71b-1122, pretty good
Safcider & Brewer’s Best Cider House select - very good results

 

[ten80]

In my experience:

EC-1118: too dry (sub 0.999 FG) and strips some apple flavor

D47: retains apple flavor, ferments well cold (48-52F) and produces a very high level of glycerol (for mouthfeel) compared to other wine yeasts. A good yeast for extended aging on lees, imparts complexity without off-flavors when aged cold.

71B: Stronger fermentor than D47, will ferment as cold as 46 F. Good for cysers and ciders with added sugars. Retains apple flavor maybe as well as D47. Attenuates to 1.000 or slightly below with most ciders.

S-04: good for quick-finishing ciders that retain a clean, crisp, if perhaps tart flavor. Doesn't impart any beneficial fruity esters like D47. Ferments juice nicely at 50-55F once it gets started. May take 2-3 days to start in juice with a pH below 3.5.

Safale T-58: Made a horribly sulfurous cider which a year later I am still trying to save. I fermented it around 65f which may have been too warm.

I have batches going with the following that I will update in a few months:
Q23 wine which supposedly releases flavorful compounds from fruit and ferments on the cold side
Rhone R4600 which imparts fruity esters, has low nutrient requirements, and can ferment quite cold.

 

[Northern_Brewer]

Just out of interest, has anyone tried making cider with only a conditioning yeast like CBC-1 or F-2? In theory they should be quite neutral, only eat simple sugars and drop out nicely.

 

[wuyi_wulf]

my favorite has been S-33 Saflager yeast m very apple forward off dry cider m give it a shot sometime !

 

[z-bob]

my favorite has been S-33 Saflager yeast m very apple forward off dry cider m give it a shot sometime !

The gallon cider I started with S-33 about 3 weeks ago is probably ready to bottle -- it looks clear in the jug. I will give it a couple of more days just so I have less yeast settle out in the bottles.

I don't know how it tastes yet, but it has been the best-behaved yeast I have ever used in cider. Never foamed up, but kinda looked like orange juice with a little milk in it for the first week there was so much yeast in suspension. It's acting totally different than the same yeast did in the beer I bottled last night.

 

[jacobelong]

I'll throw WLP720 Sweet Mead into the mix as a great semi-sweet cider yeast.

My first attempt at cider used WLP002 (English Ale) at the recommendation of my LHBS, which was very dry and left a strong yeast-bread flavor which I found quite unpleasant. I prefer my cider on the off-dry / semi-sweet side, though.

Batch 2 used WLP720 and resulted in a very clean cider with tons of apple character and enough residual sweetness (0.998 FG) to where my wife (who prefers sweet-sweet cider) loves it -- she drinks it more than I do, actually . Not nearly as active as the ale yeast, but with some patience it will produce a wonderful (and clear!) cider.

 

[RPh_Guy]

The gallon cider I started with S-33 about 3 weeks ago is probably ready to bottle -- it looks clear in the jug. I will give it a couple of more days just so I have less yeast settle out in the bottles.

I don't know how it tastes yet, but it has been the best-behaved yeast I have ever used in cider. Never foamed up, but kinda looked like orange juice with a little milk in it for the first week there was so much yeast in suspension. It's acting totally different than the same yeast did in the beer I bottled last night.

Thanks, keep us updated on this and the AW4

 

[Morrey]

Using WLP775 in cider that was 1.058 OG. Kept temps down as cool as White Labs suggested on the low side, and fermentation seems like it is wrapping up on day 5 at 0.996. Surprisingly great apple flavor remains and nice mouthfeel.

Maybe this yeast is what I have been looking for. Is 0.996 consistent with what others are getting?

 

[AzOr]

I&#8217;ve had great luck with Mangrove Jack&#8217;s cider yeast. Great apple flavor and a touch of sweetness remains. I rarely backsweeten with fajc. I will sometimes add a touch of honey to backsweeten.
I&#8217;ve tried several dry wine yeasts and Notty and was not pleased with results (I&#8217;ll have to check my notes to see which). Last time I used Notty, the flavor and color were stripped away. It took a lot of fajc to tast decent.

 

[johnnyseko]

Using WLP775 in cider that was 1.058 OG. Kept temps down as cool as White Labs suggested on the low side, and fermentation seems like it is wrapping up on day 5 at 0.996. Surprisingly great apple flavor remains and nice mouthfeel.

Maybe this yeast is what I have been looking for. Is 0.996 consistent with what others are getting?

I just had to go check on my first 2 gallons w/ 775 after seeing this.

Started 11/3, OG 1.042. Temps 68-70F. I just tested now - day 6 - 0.996. Cider from the orchard, clearing out nicely already. Sweet apple taste - I am amazed. What a difference from champagne yeast! I'm going to let it stay for another week and bottle some straight out of primary and put some away for aging in secondary.

Starting another 2 gallons tonight!!

 

[RPh_Guy]

Cider from the orchard, clearing out nicely already. Sweet apple taste - I am amazed. What a difference from champagne yeast! I'm going to let it stay for another week and bottle some straight out of primary and put some away for aging in secondary.

Nice! If the juice is not pasteurized, you should consider adding preservatives. Otherwise wild bugs (e.g. Acetobacter) will probably eventually metabolize the alcohol into acetic acid (vinegar).

 

[Morrey]

I just had to go check on my first 2 gallons w/ 775 after seeing this.

Started 11/3, OG 1.042. Temps 68-70F. I just tested now - day 6 - 0.996. Cider from the orchard, clearing out nicely already. Sweet apple taste - I am amazed. What a difference from champagne yeast! I'm going to let it stay for another week and bottle some straight out of primary and put some away for aging in secondary.

Starting another 2 gallons tonight!!

Last year I used Cotes de Blanc and was terribly disappointed that almost no apple essence remained. This WLP775 is finishing low but the apple goodness is remaining. I am onboard with this strain for sure....glad I did 12 gallons.

 

[johnnyseko]

Nice! If the juice is not pasteurized, you should consider adding preservatives. Otherwise wild bugs (e.g. Acetobacter) will probably eventually metabolize the alcohol into acetic acid (vinegar).

UV pasteurized. But I had one go wild on me last month from a different orchard that was UV pasteurized so I'm not sure I trust it. Will have to look into this.

 

[Albionwood]

Nice! If the juice is not pasteurized, you should consider adding preservatives. Otherwise wild bugs (e.g. Acetobacter) will probably eventually metabolize the alcohol into acetic acid (vinegar).

Acetification requires oxygen, so you can prevent it by avoiding any aeration after fermentation finishes. (You should also always avoid alliteration.)
Cider is very susceptible to oxidation, even if it doesn't go acetic it will quickly lose the fruit character and go stale, so you should always be very careful to keep air away from it. Purging carboys and kegs with CO2 before racking is good practice, and I bottle with zero headspace.

 

[RPh_Guy]

Acetification requires oxygen, so you can prevent it by avoiding any aeration after fermentation finishes. (You should also always avoid alliteration.)
Cider is very susceptible to oxidation, even if it doesn't go acetic it will quickly lose the fruit character and go stale, so you should always be very careful to keep air away from it. Purging carboys and kegs with CO2 before racking is good practice, and I bottle with zero headspace.

Good tips! Personally I do one gallon batches and it doesn't last long enough to turn bad in any way.

BTW actual zero headspace in bottles can be dangerous because of thermal expansion building immense pressure. A quarter inch or so is adequate to avoid explosions ...the worst case scenario.

 

[wuyi_wulf]

The main issue i have with wyeast is they start their yeasts in a gluten mix that makes them no longer safe for those with celiac

 

[johnnyseko]

Last year I used Cotes de Blanc and was terribly disappointed that almost no apple essence remained. This WLP775 is finishing low but the apple goodness is remaining. I am onboard with this strain for sure....glad I did 12 gallons.

I just bottled a gallon 'turbo' batch WL775 - 4 weeks to carb, can't wait to try it chilled. Quick taste - it was still sweet, slight apple flavor but what else? Banana?? Pear?? Where did that come from?

Good tips! Personally I do one gallon batches and it doesn't last long enough to turn bad in any way.

BTW actual zero headspace in bottles can be dangerous because of thermal expansion building immense pressure. A quarter inch or so is adequate to avoid explosions ...the worst case scenario.

I haven't treated with preservatives - yet. I'm topping my carboys up with more cider right up into the neck with a finger width under the stopper, airlock installed. I figure (hope) the added sugar will kick in a little ferment so will produce CO2 to keep the bad stuff out.

 

[johnnyseko]

WHITE LABS EDINBURGH ALE YEAST WLP028

I haven't seen this yeast mentioned yet. Anyone use it for cider? It seems to have some high marks in the yeast comparisons that American Homebrewers did. So far, I'm having great results with 775 but still seems like somethings missing. Although that could be my fault. Each batch does get a little better though.

If the 773 doesn't ship from the vault soon, I may have to grab the wlp028 instead.

 

[dmtaylor]

WHITE LABS EDINBURGH ALE YEAST WLP028

I haven't seen this yeast mentioned yet. Anyone use it for cider? It seems to have some high marks in the yeast comparisons that American Homebrewers did. So far, I'm having great results with 775 but still seems like somethings missing. Although that could be my fault. Each batch does get a little better though.

If the 773 doesn't ship from the vault soon, I may have to grab the wlp028 instead.

Yes, I have tried the Scottish yeast. I thought it was good, but not as good as Cote des Blancs.

 

[z-bob]

Cote des Blanc and AW4 have been my favorite. The AW4 tasted and smelled like banana juice at bottling time, but that went away after a few weeks in the bottle; left a nice spicy apple flavor with just a little residual banana esters.

My S-33 gallon batch tastes good, but the bottles aren't carbing. Maybe I let it clear *too* much. I bottled one 1 liter bottle and it seems to be carbonated (that bottle has some sediment, and the bottle is hard) I may open it on Christmas. Or New Years. I don't want to rush it since I just have one bottle.

I have started another 4 gallon batch with S-33. I pitched half a cup of beer yeast slurry, and the next day it foamed out the top of the airlock even tho' I had left a half gallon of headspace (I've never had cider do that) I topped it up with apple juice when it settled down, and will bottle this batch when it is clear but not *sparkling* clear like last time.

 

[johnnyseko]

I just looked up the Cotes de Blanc, the description even sounds impressive! Not sure how this went under my radar for so long. I'm going to be starting 4 or 5 single gallon batches soon - all with different yeast. Starting all at the same time, under the same temps and see how they work out. I may have to get this one to add to the mix. So far I have Nottingham, S-04, & S-33 on hand. Thinking about getting Safcider and one other but still not sure.

 

[dmtaylor]

I just looked up the Cotes de Blanc, the description even sounds impressive! Not sure how this went under my radar for so long. I'm going to be starting 4 or 5 single gallon batches soon - all with different yeast. Starting all at the same time, under the same temps and see how they work out. I may have to get this one to add to the mix. So far I have Nottingham, S-04, & S-33 on hand. Thinking about getting Safcider and one other but still not sure.

Try US-05. It is quite good.

 

[johnnyseko]

US-05 was already in my 'cart' - I forgot! Added Cotes de Blanc. You'd go with US-05 out of these? I'll probably end up with both...haha

 

[bmd2k1]

Using Wyeast 1272 - American Ale II -- for my very first batch of cider-5gals. (based on early research I did...with goal of an appley, semi-sweet end-game). (No additions upfront to primary.)

About 2.5weeks into primary fermentation & it's still chugging along...

Digging all the great info being shared on this forum...Many Thanks to all

Cheers & Merry Christmas