bigbopper
Well-Known Member
subscribed
Coffin cooling and other lessons I learned while building a keezer
- Thread starter shroomzofdoom
- Start date
Help Support Homebrew Talk:
SmokingDog
Well-Known Member
Thinking about how a freezer cools (from the floor and walls), I would think that ducting the cold air supply from the bottom of the keezer (room permitting) would be optimal. A small section of drier exhaust hose.
From an air movement standpoint, which would be more efficient, attaching the fan to the low end (pushing the cold air) or at the base of the coffin (pulling the air)?
From an air movement standpoint, which would be more efficient, attaching the fan to the low end (pushing the cold air) or at the base of the coffin (pulling the air)?
OP
OP
shroomzofdoom
Well-Known Member
The bottom is where the coldest air is, no doubt. My experience was that I just couldn't move/direct enough air to keep all of the shanks at the right temp. The one nearest the cold output would be quite cold, but further along the row, the temps varied. I tried using wyes to aim and direct it and wound up with something analogous to a 'tubing octopus'
I think that 'room permitting' is the most important aspect. A hose when cold is very brittle and hard to position and move. Plus, the box wastes real estate that could be put to better use.
By simply placing a high volume fan where the coffin meets the lid, I was able to do away with hose, box, and octopus and fit another keg. To me, this just seemed easier than dealing with the alternatives.
If you are able to get it working, please record your temps and post back here. I wouldn't want to dissuade anyone from trying things, the original post was about showing the shortest (and hopefully, cheapest) route to solving this problem.
SmokingDog
Well-Known Member
My thought was a center hole design with a "Y" into the coffin. The main fan would be an in-line duct fan as one of the posts mentioned earlier. Two return holes to either side (with or without fans) creating sort of a rams horn or turbo-charger effect.
All this packed in and routed as you any number of the other builders have done in closed cell foam. I will post the design as I build and complete it.
All this packed in and routed as you any number of the other builders have done in closed cell foam. I will post the design as I build and complete it.
divi2323
Well-Known Member
shroomzofdoom said:
To an extent this isn't an undesireable effect if you ask me. Different beers and other beverages serve better at different temperatures. I don't have the link handy but I believe light ales serve best really cold, while lagers and stouts are best served 10-15 degrees warmer. If you were so inclined you could take advantage of different shank temperatures in your design by serving the beers progressively darker etc.
Keep the thread going, I'm about to embark on my keezer build soon with a coffin in the basement and a chilled line to the kitchen taps I plan on mounting a floor above.
OP
OP
shroomzofdoom
Well-Known Member
If there are no stratification or dead zones in a keezer, all the kegs will serve at roughly the same temp. Generally, the temp that's on the floor +/- a few degrees.
The issue with coffins is that the warm air rises, making the coffin the warmest spot--sometimes a 20-25 degree difference from the floor. If the shanks are not cold enough or the beer in the lines is warm, the first pour of every beer will be mostly foam as the gas comes out of solution at the warmer temps.
A fan breaks up this stratification, and also allows the shanks and lines to remain consistently close to the temperature of the beer in the kegs--this will result in less foamy pours--whether it's the first or last beer of the day.
![Craft A Brew - Safale S-04 Dry Yeast - Fermentis - English Ale Dry Yeast - For English and American Ales and Hard Apple Ciders - Ingredients for Home Brewing - Beer Making Supplies - [1 Pack]](https://m.media-amazon.com/images/I/41fVGNh6JfL._SL500_.jpg)
- Joined
- Mar 2, 2011
- Messages
- 414
- Reaction score
- 57
I got a lot of helpful info from this thread, thanks shroomzofdoom.
If your going with a coffin and a collar I would think that a fan would be mandatory to get rid of that warm area at the collar. Then insulating the heck out of your coffin, leaving just enough room for the lines should give you respectable temps. There is very little beer in a foot of 3/16" line.
I almost went with a fan in the keezer to eliminate any cold spots but my temps were good enough for me.
If your going with a coffin and a collar I would think that a fan would be mandatory to get rid of that warm area at the collar. Then insulating the heck out of your coffin, leaving just enough room for the lines should give you respectable temps. There is very little beer in a foot of 3/16" line.
I almost went with a fan in the keezer to eliminate any cold spots but my temps were good enough for me.
techbrewie
Well-Known Member
Something I'd like to add, if you want to edit it into the OP it would be worth pointing out. Be careful of the bearing in the case fan you decide to go with. Sleeve bearings are not meant for a horizontal position. If used horizontally, the will be much louder, and last generally only a month or two. For Horizontal use, make sure your bearing is a ball or fdb bearing.
mmmooretx
HopHead
I have started a 3 ring binder from various builds basically from Jester369 design. However I want to scale up to a 25 CF freezer and I have a 2X8 collar, basically because I wanted to use the original hinge attach holes (7" apart). I would like to get my hands on the Google Sketchup plans so I can scale it up to fit my size, plus an area on the side for my gas tanks (outside freezer but inside coffin base). Parts are not too hard to figure out but the base/frame is where I get lost. Any design plans that can help me would be appreciated.
Thanks in advance,
Mike
Thanks in advance,
Mike
- Joined
- Mar 2, 2011
- Messages
- 414
- Reaction score
- 57
With a 25 cf freezer I would think that there is enough room for plenty of kegs without a need for a collar.
As far a the base goes I don't have plans but its just some 2x4's screwed together. If I can find a photo I will post it.
As far a the base goes I don't have plans but its just some 2x4's screwed together. If I can find a photo I will post it.
mmmooretx
HopHead
The collar is not for keg volume, but to let holes to be drilled for gas lines and beer taps (started as a regular keezer and want to kick up the coffin keezer). I do not want my gas bottles inside the keezer.
- Joined
- Mar 2, 2011
- Messages
- 414
- Reaction score
- 57
I run my co2 bottle outside and just drilled through the lid behind the coffin
Sent from my SCH-I200 using Home Brew mobile app
Sent from my SCH-I200 using Home Brew mobile app
BritBrewer
Member
So I'm finally getting around to dolling up my chest freezer & taps combo into something more presentable. After doing some reading I think I will be heading towards a copper heat sink or even a hard drive liquid cooling system in the long run. However in the short term I have drawn up the following concept. The idea being to minimise the transfer of heat into the beer lines by keeping a small clear air pathway. I hope the single fan in the design not to be necessary.
To refer back to the hard drive liquid cooling system; mounting the heat sink to the underside of the top of the freezer. This will utilise the low profile of the heat sink by allowing as much room for kegs as possible. This setup will also men that the fan will be located in the pvc pipe beside the taps; further encouraging air flow between the coffin and the freezer. The liquid cooling system will also be wired in conjunction with the heat controller and independently. This will allow me to turn the liquid cooling system on only when serving; conserving energy.
To refer back to the hard drive liquid cooling system; mounting the heat sink to the underside of the top of the freezer. This will utilise the low profile of the heat sink by allowing as much room for kegs as possible. This setup will also men that the fan will be located in the pvc pipe beside the taps; further encouraging air flow between the coffin and the freezer. The liquid cooling system will also be wired in conjunction with the heat controller and independently. This will allow me to turn the liquid cooling system on only when serving; conserving energy.
I'm getting ready to start my keezer build but I'm a little shaky on wiring and electrical work. Has anyone had any experience or have any advice on the use of a single power supply with multiple fans. I was looking at this power supply with one of these to allow for multiple fan connections. Just trying to cut down on the number of plugs being gobbled up by fans/power supplies.
Last edited by a moderator:
I'm still searching for answers on this but haven't found them yet... Has anyone tried liquid cooling for the coffin?
I had a hare-brained idea to run a loop of hose around the base of the freezer and up into the coffin, wrapped around the shanks and delivery tubing and then back down. All driven by a 12v pump (because I have some that are really quiet, small, and efficient). Should be almost totally silent.
I'm still in the "Honey, everyone else is kegging..." phase of discussions and probably won't start on a project of my own until Spring 2016 at the soonest, but I want to figure it out and plan before I start. Ideas? Feedback? Links to articles I have found with my weak Google-Fu?
I had a hare-brained idea to run a loop of hose around the base of the freezer and up into the coffin, wrapped around the shanks and delivery tubing and then back down. All driven by a 12v pump (because I have some that are really quiet, small, and efficient). Should be almost totally silent.
I'm still in the "Honey, everyone else is kegging..." phase of discussions and probably won't start on a project of my own until Spring 2016 at the soonest, but I want to figure it out and plan before I start. Ideas? Feedback? Links to articles I have found with my weak Google-Fu?
So yeah, the Google-Fu improved right after I asked the previous question. I found PurpleHaze's threads about using the glycol cooled copper tubing to create passive cooling for the beer lines. I think I will incorporate that into my plans. Passive is even better than low powered pumps.
- Joined
- Mar 2, 2011
- Messages
- 414
- Reaction score
- 57
GreyRaven, the cooling I use has gone through some changes since the first keezer I made. If you have any questions post or pm me I'd be happy to answer them.
Some have used a cheap aquarium pump to move the glycol but that is for long runs, say from the basement to the first floor.
If you are going to have a collar on your kezzer than you will need a small computer fan to help circulate the cool air over the copper pipe.
Some have used a cheap aquarium pump to move the glycol but that is for long runs, say from the basement to the first floor.
If you are going to have a collar on your kezzer than you will need a small computer fan to help circulate the cool air over the copper pipe.
