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Old 12-13-2008, 11:48 PM   #21
BlindLemonLars
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bobby_M View Post
For some reason the refrigeration stuff goes by OD.
Well, it's for the reason the invisible gnome pointed out...standardized fittings that mate with the outside of the tubing. Otherwise, we weekend warrior handymen couldn't go to Home Depot and get what we need off the shelf!

Nice treatise on heat transfer, Scotty_g!

 
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Old 12-13-2008, 11:52 PM   #22
hammacks
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bobby_M View Post
Copper tubing is sold both by OD and ID. For some reason the refrigeration stuff goes by OD. Then it gets more confusing that rigid copper tube is rated by nominal ID (1/2" nominal is 5/8" OD).
OK that's what it was. I was just working with rigid copper for tower cooling.

 
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Old 02-24-2009, 06:59 PM   #23
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hammacks View Post
OK, I've got to do it now.

Sometime this weekend I'll do the calculations for convection on the inside and outside of a chiller and set up the resistance network to show how minimal the higher conductivity of copper matters. It's all about the convection guys.

BTW, this is ALL I thought about through my entire heat transfer course I just finished up.
So I was feeling guilty that I was a dead beat on this. The main PIA is getting a decent calculation for the convective heat transfer.

I have a heat transfer LAB course now and wouldn't you know it, this week I will experimenting with counterflow heat exchangers. I should be able to get a decent h value from that. I'm pretty sure I'll be doing a resistance model of the system that will illustrate the whole idea well. And now I have to do it (or I get bad grades :-) ). My prof used to live in Portland and would take her students to microbreweries to see their industrial plate heat exchangers.

In the mean time, lookie what I found. Coefficient of entire heat exchange system (convection -> conduction -> convection)

Fluid-----Material-----Fluid------Transfer Coefficient ((Btu/ft2 hr F) and (W/m2 K)
Water---Mild Steel---Water----60 - 70----340 - 400
Water---Copper------Water----60 - 80----340 - 455

Very rough, but based on the same velocity and flow characteristics for both so comparison between the two is valid. SS is similar to the mild. Point is, massive difference in conductive coefficients between steel and copper = very little impact on system.

Found it at a great reference site here:
Overall Heat Transfer Coefficients for some common Fluids and Heat Exchanger Surfaces
Look at how much better steam to water through copper than water to water (and that's not even considering the larger temp difference).


 
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Old 02-26-2009, 04:54 AM   #24
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Heat transfer in a film of condensing vapor is very high as long as the condensate can get away. IIRC it's got to do with the thin film of condensate (relatively little insulation from a stationary liquid layer) and rapid transport of material from the bulk vapor to the cooling surface--as one volume of gas condenses to form 1/1000 a volume of liquid, 999/1000 volumes of gas are sucked in.

This doesn't have much to do with wort chillers anymore, but it's nice to find another thermo nerd out there (BS ChE from Wisconsin in '98).
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