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Old 09-30-2008, 02:47 AM   #1
Mitch529
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Default New brewer, Full Boil + Other Misc. Questions

Warning: This will be somewhat long & detailed, cliff notes at end!

So n00b here long time lurker, new poster/brewer. I brewed my first batches a couple weeks ago after tons of research. (Phat tyre clone & Apfelwein) Just racked the Phat tyre to secondary and got a taste it was pretty good! After my first experience brewing in a 20qt pot partial boil on the stove in our apartment SWMBO did not enjoy the smell of boiling wort. So I have been banished to outdoors, I just ordered a burner, 40quart pot & chiller to start full boils. Now I am pretty excited to be doing the full boil as the partial boil in our smallish kitchen and trying to do an ice bath sucked!

So I just ordered the Three Hearted Ale from northern brewer, per their directions it states to add 25% less hops which just seems too much of a rough estimate for me. I am a huge nerd and love to get into all of the specifics of everything and homebrewing is my next pet project. I downloaded the trial of Beersmith and have been toying with inputting the recipe to convert to full boil vs partial but I am wondering if someone can give me assistance with that.

Here is the NorthernBrewer ingredients schedule:
Code:
O.G: 1064 / Ready: 6 weeks

Specialty Grains
    * 1 lbs. Briess Caramel 40

Fermentables
    * 9.15 lbs. Gold Malt Syrup

Boil Additions
    * 1 oz. Centennial (60 min)
    * 1 oz. Centennial (20 min)
    * 2 oz. Centennial (5 min)

Special Ingredients
    * 1 oz. Centennial Hops (dry hop)

If you choose liquid yeast
    * Wyeast #1084 Irish Ale Yeast. Optimum temperature: 62-72 F.
Beersmith conversion:
Code:
Type: Extract
Batch Size: 5.00 gal
Boil Size: 5.80 gal
Boil Time: 60 min  

Ingredients
 
Amount     Item                                     Type         % or IBU 
9.15 lb    Lyle's Golden Syrup (0.0 SRM)            Extract      90.15 % 
1.00 lb    Caramel/Crystal Malt - 40L (40.0 SRM)    Grain        9.85 % 
1.00 oz    Centennial [10.00 %] (60 min)            Hops         32.1 IBU 
1.00 oz    Centennial [10.00 %] (20 min)            Hops         19.4 IBU 
2.00 oz    Centennial [10.00 %] (5 min)             Hops         12.8 IBU 
1.00 oz    Centennial [10.00 %] (Dry Hop )          Hops         -  

1 Pkgs Irish Ale (Wyeast Labs #1084) [Starter 125 ml] Yeast-Ale  

  
Beer Profile
 
Est Original Gravity: 1.067 SG
Measured Original Gravity: 1.010 SG 
Est Final Gravity: 1.017 SG 
Measured Final Gravity: 1.005 SG 
Estimated Alcohol by Vol: 6.49 %  
Actual Alcohol by Vol: 0.65 % 
Bitterness: 64.3 IBU 
Calories: 43 cal/pint 
Est Color: 6.2 SRM
Now as I understand it the IBU's will be out of wack as the full boil provides better efficiency. Now I am not quite sure how to correct this, I tried putting the boil volume to 2.5gal and batch size to 5gal and it gives me an IBU of 32.5 so is that what the IBU of this batch should really be, and how do I correct for this? (does beersmith have some auto method for this?)

Okay, with that long winded question out of the way I come to my next concern. Boil volume... Since my new pot is aluminum I plan on boiling once before brewing in it to first build up the oxide layer but also so I can estimate my hourly boil off percentage. Now obviously this will not always be exactly the same so this is where my concern comes in. Using a set kit like the one I have just ordered, what happens if after 60mins I end up with more volume than I expected this will cause my OG to be off right? Can I just boil a little bit longer to correct (will this cause any problems?)... Or should I have extra DME/LME on hand to add and correct the OG (if this is the right answer how would I calculate this)? On the flip side, what if I am coming up shy of 5gal near the end of the boil, is it okay to add some water? I plan on taking some CPVC and creating a marker stick to gauge the volume in the pot to assist with gauging where I am at during the boil.

I also plan on trying to make a starter, what size should be good to pitch for this batch? I was planning on making a 1L starter using some DME and making it two days ahead of time on a stirplate, cool crash the night before brewing then decant the beer and pitch the slurry after it has warmed up to the same temp as the wort.

Cliff notes:

1. How do I calculate for the difference in hops using an extract kit tailored towards partial boils when doing a full boil.

2. When doing a full boil using an extract kit what do I do if my boiled wort volume ends up being more/less than 5gal.

3. What size starter is a good bet for the Three Hearted Ale?

Thanks in advance for any help!
Mitch


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Old 09-30-2008, 05:17 PM   #2
Boerderij_Kabouter
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Hi Mitch!

It is great to have such details nailed down at such an early stage in your brewing career! I am sure you will be making fantastic beer in no time.

When I have questions such as this, I flip through my hard copy of "How to Brew" by John Palmer. I highly suggest you pick one up. However, from a computer, his book can be accessed online at howtobrew.com for free!

Here is the link to answer question 1: How to Brew - By John Palmer - Hop Bittering Calculations

if you have any more questions just post again and someone will walk you throung the calculations.

2. It will be helpful for you to calibrate your boil kettle some-how... either by making markings on your stir stick (1, 1.5, 2...gallons) or by installing a sight glass (much better but more expensive). If you have to much wort, you can continue boiling, however you should be aware that you will be increasing hop bitterness (IBUs) so you should be careful doing this. If you are close to the right gravity call it close enough and note how much you were over by so you can adjust for your next batch. If you are under your volume, just top up with preboiled water. That couldn't be easier.

3. I probably wouldn't make a starter for that batch, because I like fruity IPAs and working the yeast a little harder would produce more ester profile. If you are unsure of your yeast source or want to make a starter, I would make a 1 quart starter. Here is Palmer's section on starters:
How to Brew - By John Palmer - Preparing Yeast and Yeast Starters

and here is a great tool for starter calculations and yeast in general:
Mr Malty Pitching Rate Calculator

If you have any other questions post away!!!


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Old 09-30-2008, 07:31 PM   #3
Mitch529
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Thanks for the info! I will have to pickup a copy of How to Brew.

Do you have any recommendations for a sight glass that would be compatible with an aluminum pot? I plan on adding a spigot in the near future so I could just add a sight glass at the same time.
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Old 09-30-2008, 07:36 PM   #4
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Most of the homebrew supply stores stock them. Also, do a search for sightglass and many threads will pop up with DIY solutions including part numbers and good advice.
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Old 09-30-2008, 08:56 PM   #5
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Hi mitch, I am in the same boat as you - making the transition from stove top to outdoors after a couple batches. I was thinking about just doing partial boils still even though I have the capacity to do full boils. This would provide solutions to your questions 1 and 2. Thoughts?

TH
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Old 09-30-2008, 09:16 PM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wheeliechicken View Post
Hi mitch, I am in the same boat as you - making the transition from stove top to outdoors after a couple batches. I was thinking about just doing partial boils still even though I have the capacity to do full boils. This would provide solutions to your questions 1 and 2. Thoughts?

TH
I considered doing a partial boil... But I like the idea of a full boil, boiling a second pot chilling & keeping it sanitized for the partial is much more of a PITA than just adjusting some calculations.

My biggest concern is the boil volume but I am going to calibrate the pot before hand. I have done some research on a sight glass, I really like the idea and will probably add one in the near future. In the mean time I'm just going to mark up some CPVC and take a reading every 15 minutes.

Worst case scenario is I end up with too much wort. If this happens I am prepared to calculate and make adjustments to the final 5min hop addition to still hit around my target IBU if necessary. I am fairly confident I can hit pretty head on for my target boil volume.

Mitch


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