Mr. Malty Calculator confusion - Home Brew Forums

Register Now!
Home Brew Forums > Home Brewing Beer > General Techniques > Mr. Malty Calculator confusion

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old 04-29-2008, 05:06 PM   #1
dstar26t
If it's worth doing, it's worth overdoing
HBT_SUPPORTER.png
Recipes 
 
Jan 2008
Ridley Park, PA
Posts: 1,151
Liked 57 Times on 42 Posts



So up till now, I've only used dry yeast and re-hydrated prior to pitching. Mr. Malty would always show about 1 packet of dry yeast should work. For my next batch, the LHBS was out of dry so I got a smack pack of 1056. The Calculator tells me I need a 3 LITER starter for a 5 gallon batch of 1.070 OG wort. What am I doing wrong? That amount seems laughable.

Mr. Malty
__________________
Next: ?
Fermenting: Azacca Oat Pilsner, Egregious-ish, Barrel Fermented Dreg DelcoLambic, Sacch Trois Helles
Drinking: RIS v7, Doppelbock, RIS v6, Carrot Blossom Cedar Mead, Sauerkraut Fermented Gose, Gueuze, Brett Blonde, Kriek, Saison, Sour Blonde
Barrel aged: Rye Barleywine, Tripel, Wee-Heavy

 
Reply With Quote
Old 04-29-2008, 05:32 PM   #2
maltMonkey
Recipes 
 
Jan 2008
Kansas
Posts: 823
Liked 5 Times on 4 Posts


That sounds about right. You have to remember that dry yeast packets have a lot more cells than liquid yeasts typically. If you use a stirplate you can use a smaller starter, but for a big beer like that you'll need a big starter.

 
Reply With Quote
Old 04-29-2008, 05:38 PM   #3
Yooper
Ale's What Cures You!
HBT_ADMIN.png
 
Yooper's Avatar
Recipes 
 
Jun 2006
UP of Michigan, Winter Texan
Posts: 69,415
Liked 7842 Times on 5495 Posts


Yes, liquid yeast really needs a starter even for a small beer. A bigger beer like yours would require more yeast. I think, though, for a 1.070 beer, even with dry yeast, two packages are recommended.
__________________
Broken Leg Brewery
Giving beer a leg to stand on since 2006

 
Reply With Quote
Old 04-29-2008, 05:47 PM   #4
dstar26t
If it's worth doing, it's worth overdoing
HBT_SUPPORTER.png
Recipes 
 
Jan 2008
Ridley Park, PA
Posts: 1,151
Liked 57 Times on 42 Posts


Yeah, I used 2 packages for that pliny clone. 3 liters just seems like a lot of liquid to have to throw in there...won't that effect the FG?
__________________
Next: ?
Fermenting: Azacca Oat Pilsner, Egregious-ish, Barrel Fermented Dreg DelcoLambic, Sacch Trois Helles
Drinking: RIS v7, Doppelbock, RIS v6, Carrot Blossom Cedar Mead, Sauerkraut Fermented Gose, Gueuze, Brett Blonde, Kriek, Saison, Sour Blonde
Barrel aged: Rye Barleywine, Tripel, Wee-Heavy

 
Reply With Quote
Old 04-29-2008, 05:48 PM   #5
maltMonkey
Recipes 
 
Jan 2008
Kansas
Posts: 823
Liked 5 Times on 4 Posts


Quote:
Originally Posted by dstar26t
Yeah, I used 2 packages for that pliny clone. 3 liters just seems like a lot of liquid to have to throw in there...won't that effect the FG?
Yep. Decant it

 
Reply With Quote
Old 04-29-2008, 06:11 PM   #6
TexLaw
Here's Lookin' Atcha!
HBT_LIFETIMESUPPORTER.png
 
TexLaw's Avatar
Recipes 
 
Sep 2007
Houston, Texas
Posts: 3,670
Liked 28 Times on 26 Posts


Yep, that sounds about right. It means to make a starter with three liters of wort, not three liters of slurry.

I bet you can get by just fine with far less, though. The three liters is just the optimal pitching rate.


TL
__________________
Beer is good for anything from hot dogs to heartache.

Drinking Frog Brewery, est. 1993

 
Reply With Quote
Old 04-29-2008, 06:13 PM   #7
Chad
 
Chad's Avatar
Recipes 
 
Sep 2007
Apex, NC
Posts: 1,028
Liked 11 Times on 10 Posts


There are two schools of thought about liquid starters. The first school says to pitch the starter at peak activity, usually 18 to 24 hours into fermentation. The yeast is still in suspension, so you have to pitch the whole thing, possibly adding some off flavors from the starter beer. The second school says to let the starter complete fermentation and rebuild its reserves of trehalose, glycogen and other nutrients. You let the starter ferment for a couple of days then refrigerate. The yeast will settle out in a day or so, and you can pour off the starter beer, leaving just enough to swirl up the yeast.

If I have time I like to do it the second way. As Yooper mentioned, that gives you a chance to build it up multiple times if you want. It also lets you pitch just yeast. If I don't have time I'll do it the first way. If I really don't have time I'll just throw money at the problem and pitch multiple packs of yeast. My last brew was a Vienna Lager. I realized too late (Sunday afternoon) that my only possible brew day was the next day. There was no way to build a starter so I just bought a couple of extra yeast packs and pitched three of the damn things. It's chugging along nicely but I don't want to do that again -- $20 worth of yeast adds up.

Chad

Yeast Starter Section of Palmer's "How to Brew"
__________________
Chad Ward
An Edge in the Kitchen
William Morrow Cookbooks
www.chadwrites.com


 
Reply With Quote
Old 04-29-2008, 06:46 PM   #8
dstar26t
If it's worth doing, it's worth overdoing
HBT_SUPPORTER.png
Recipes 
 
Jan 2008
Ridley Park, PA
Posts: 1,151
Liked 57 Times on 42 Posts


Oh, I see.

So, smack the pack...once it has swelled, boil 3 liters of 1.040 gravity DME + water. Add the smack pack once the 3 liters has cooled. Let it do it's thing for ~3 days. Throw into fridge for a day. Let it warm back up to room temp and siphon out the beer before pitching.

That's it? No yeast nutrient needed besides what's in the smack pack? Will this all fit into a 1 gallon growler?
__________________
Next: ?
Fermenting: Azacca Oat Pilsner, Egregious-ish, Barrel Fermented Dreg DelcoLambic, Sacch Trois Helles
Drinking: RIS v7, Doppelbock, RIS v6, Carrot Blossom Cedar Mead, Sauerkraut Fermented Gose, Gueuze, Brett Blonde, Kriek, Saison, Sour Blonde
Barrel aged: Rye Barleywine, Tripel, Wee-Heavy

 
Reply With Quote
Old 04-29-2008, 06:53 PM   #9
maltMonkey
Recipes 
 
Jan 2008
Kansas
Posts: 823
Liked 5 Times on 4 Posts


Quote:
Originally Posted by dstar26t
Oh, I see.

So, smack the pack...once it has swelled, boil 3 liters of 1.040 gravity DME + water. Add the smack pack once the 3 liters has cooled. Let it do it's thing for ~3 days. Throw into fridge for a day. Let it warm back up to room temp and siphon out the beer before pitching.

That's it? No yeast nutrient needed besides what's in the smack pack?
You got it. You might want to step up the starter (i.e. make a smaller starter then add some more wort after a couple days)

Quote:
Originally Posted by dstar26t
Will this all fit into a 1 gallon growler?
Growlers are typically 2L (1/2 gallon). If it were me I'd just make a 2L total starter so that it all conveniently fits into one growler. Like TexLaw said, you should be fine with that size starter.

 
Reply With Quote
Old 04-29-2008, 06:54 PM   #10
zoebisch01
 
zoebisch01's Avatar
Recipes 
 
Nov 2006
Central PA
Posts: 5,182
Liked 10 Times on 10 Posts


I never use a starter at 1.06 and below. Never had trouble having a good ferment. For Ales that is, I use dry Lager yeast anyway. The cell count is sufficient and marketed as direct pitchable for 1.05 and below on both the Wyeast smack packs and White Labs vials iirc.

"The Activator™ is designed to directly inoculate 5 gallons of standard strength ale wort (1.034-1.060 SG) with professional pitching rates. For lagers, we recommend inoculating the wort at warm temperatures (68-70°F/ 20-21°C), waiting for signs of fermentation, and then adjusting to the desired temperature. Alternatively, for pitching into cold conditions (34-58°F/ 1-14°C) or higher gravity wort, we recommend increasing this pitching rate."

"How do I make a "starter"?

A "starter" can be any volume of wort that you add yeast to before using it to make your beer. The yeast get active in this smaller volume, usually for 1-2 days, and then can be added to 5 gallons of beer, or 10 gallons, or whatever size your brewing. This can be a good way to "proof" the yeast, and also when making high gravity beers. White Labs recommends on their label to make a starter "if the gravity is over 1.070, if the yeast is past its "best before" date, or if a faster start is desired." "

So they claim even slightly higher OG's.
__________________
Event Horizon ~ A tribute to the miracle of fermentation.

Brew what you like. Do this, and you will find your inner brewer.


 
Reply With Quote
Reply
Thread Tools


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Mr Malty pitching rate calculator SMOKEU Cider Forum 1 11-03-2009 01:47 AM
Wyeast Manufacture Date and Mr. Malty Pitch Rate Calculator brewphilly18 Fermentation & Yeast 4 10-08-2009 06:46 PM
Mr. Malty Yeast Pitching Calculator question Lenny2884 General Techniques 7 03-03-2009 12:58 AM
Mr. Malty uwjester Extract Brewing 5 11-20-2007 10:35 PM
Mr Malty pitching calculator Cos General Techniques 2 09-13-2007 01:21 PM


Forum Jump