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Old 03-18-2008, 10:06 PM   #21
Alemental
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Quote:
Originally Posted by drayman86
So which worked better? With or without the hop bag?
Without the hop bag was much better. With the hop bag the results were just plain wimpier. Which is a shame because of all the hop bag schemes that I have seen, that one looks the best by far. It is also, by the way, the only hop bag I have ever tried.
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Old 03-18-2008, 11:21 PM   #22
riored4v
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how much wimpier? like night and day difference?

Just curious because I've been using bags, and prefer that over just dumping the hops in. I've been using this method because pretty much everything i've read thus far says that hop utilization in the boil vs a bag is pretty much minimal and un-noticeable.


Good thread.
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Old 03-18-2008, 11:28 PM   #23
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Quote:
Originally Posted by riored4v
I've been using this method because pretty much everything i've read thus far says that hop utilization in the boil vs a bag is pretty much minimal and un-noticeable.
FWIW, I've not noticed any difference in hop utilization since building this paint strainer rig. I've used it for my past 11 batches, and the bag is finally starting to wear out. The only real difference is that I'm able to get a lot more sludge-free wort into my carboy!

I think the key is to use a very strong rolling boil, which we should be doing anyhow.


 
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Old 03-18-2008, 11:47 PM   #24
riored4v
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the strainer you built is the reason that made me ask the question. i currently have a couple small bags, but i just converted a keg and was going to build the big hop bag. After reading his posts, i wasn't reconsidering building one to save myself some potentially wasted money.

i agree with you though.. i love having the the sludge-free wort. i did a no-hop-bag brew recently and was annoyed with having to strain every 30 seconds.
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Old 03-23-2008, 12:08 PM   #25
drayman86
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We brewed last Friday, and chucked any type of hop bag, sock, filter, etc. and tossed the hops right into the boil kettle. Our copper manifold did a great job of filtering/straining out most all the hops with very little system losses. I'll post some pics of our manifold in the kettle this coming Saturday after our usual Friday brew session.

 
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Old 03-23-2008, 12:18 PM   #26
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BlindLemonLars
I think the key is to use a very strong rolling boil, which we should be doing anyhow.
I think another key factor to look at in this discussion is bags that allow for a good circulation of the wort with in the hops versus bags that are significantly restricting the wort from circulating among the hops, creating a negative effect on utilization/isomerization.

If you throw a bunch of hops into a small bag that keeps them all bunched up and prevents the wort from freely circulating though, you're utilization is going to suffer.

 
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Old 03-23-2008, 01:32 PM   #27
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Quote:
Originally Posted by surfingpl
Where do get that and how much does it cost? thanks.
My wife got them for me from an E-bay merchant. They cost around $4 each. When my wife gets back from NY, I'll have her give me the vendor's name so I can posti ti up.
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Old 03-23-2008, 04:00 PM   #28
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I do believe my utilization dropped a bit when I started using bags but now that I'm aware of it, I accept it and compensate. I use a CFC and just can't have tons of hop debris clogging up the works. I plan to experiment more with offset pickups and whirlpooling on pure pellet hop bills, and using a home made hopstopper on mixed flower/pellet bills. There's just no one size fits all that I'm happy with.
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Old 03-24-2008, 02:48 PM   #29
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Good Thread.

I have started using hop bags, but have also wondered about lower utilization. It has been difficult to tell on the recent batches I've done, as they have all been on the malty side, I haven't really noticed a loss. With the cost of hops, I definitely want to get all I can out of them... I may just just toss em in there for my next brew, a double IPA, and deal w/ the trub....

 
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Old 03-24-2008, 03:13 PM   #30
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+1 no sachels. I used them for about a year, but got paranoid about utilization as well. Now that I see how the hops act in the wort whilst boiling naked, I think they are better off. It's all about surface area, and the straining is just part of the game. I did get one of those tea cage-balls, but have not used it yet. I think its worth looking into a more efficient straining method post-boil, like the as-mentioned cheesecloth or something like that. Dual stage maybe?

 
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