Yeast Suggestions for a Tropical Stout?

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NoIguanaForZ

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So, I'm looking ahead to brewing a Tropical Stout (2015 BJCP Style 16C, per the quoted style description below), sometimes in the next few months. In the mean time, my next brew is going to be a Baltic Porter recipe kit, which comes with three "default" yeast options, all lager strains. I'm not equipped to maintain lager temps, and was planning to pitch two packets of US-05 I have lying around for that beer instead. Tropical Stout A) is traditionally/typically brewed with a warm-fermented lager yeast and B) is *supposed* to have a fruity ester character. So, instead of asking for the Baltic Porter kit without yeast, which potentially complicates things, I was thinking I'd use the lager yeast from it to brew my tropical stout.

The web-order-form selection options are as follows:
-Fermentis SafLager 34/70
-WLP920 Old Bavarian Lager
-Wyeast 2124 Bohemian Lager

Any input on which of these, if any, is most likely to give me a good blend of esters if fermented warm, without any gross off flavors? Googling indicates that 2124 and 34/70 were found to maintain low-ester lager character by some homebrewers at least into the mid 60s (I'm thinking fermenting around 72 or so).

16C. Tropical Stout
Overall Impression: A very dark, sweet, fruity, moderately strong ale with smooth roasty flavors without a burnt harshness.
Aroma: Sweetness evident, moderate to high intensity. Roasted grain aromas moderate to high, and can have coffee or chocolate notes. Fruitiness medium to high. May have a molasses, licorice, dried fruit, and/or vinous aromatics. Stronger versions can have a subtle clean aroma of alcohol Hop aroma low to none. Diacetyl low to none.
Appearance: Very deep brown to black in color. Clarity usually obscured by deep color (if not opaque, should be clear). Large tan to brown head with good retention.
Flavor: Quite sweet with a smooth dark grain flavors, and restrained bitterness. Roasted grain and malt character can be moderate to high with a smooth coffee or chocolate flavor, although the roast character is moderated in the balance by the sweet finish. Moderate to high fruity esters. Can have a sweet, dark rum-like quality. Little to no hop flavor. Medium-low to no diacetyl.
Mouthfeel: Medium-full to full body, often with a smooth, creamy character. May give a warming (but never hot) impression from alcohol presence. Moderate to moderately-high carbonation.
Comments: Sweetness levels can vary significantly. Surprisingly refreshing in a hot climate.
History: Originally high-gravity stouts brewed for tropical markets, became popular and imitated by local brewers often using local sugars and ingredients.
Characteristic Ingredients: Similar to a sweet stout, but with more gravity. Pale and dark roasted malts and grains. Hops mostly for bitterness. May use adjuncts and sugar to boost gravity. Typically made with warm-fermented lager yeast.
Style Comparison: Tastes like a scaled-up sweet stout with higher fruitiness. Similar to some Imperial Stouts without the high bitterness, strong/burnt roastiness, and late hops, and with lower alcohol. Much more sweet and less hoppy than American Stouts. Much sweeter and less bitter than the similar-gravity Export Stouts.
Vital Statistics:
OG: 1.056–1.075
IBUs:30–50
FG: 1.010–1.018
SRM:30–40
ABV:5.5–8.0%
 
...on the other hand, I suppose if these strains are prone to giving you a "lager character" in the low to mid 60s I could just use one in the Baltic Porter and forego lagering-per-se.

Meanwhile, S-23 is looking promising for the Tropical Stout. Anyone have any experience with this one at warmer temps?

I might consider US-05 for the tropical stout, too; I'm pretty sure my first-ever beer (American Stout recipe, extract, brewed to a slightly higher gravity creating an ABV around 7%, fermented at an ambient temperature of between 68 and 72 with no water bath, and left on the yeast for a solid three weeks, creating some very well appreciated, noticeably "belgian" fruity-spicey flavors) was perfectly in-style as a Tropical Stout. (I'll have to remember to have the description handy when I open one of the last three bottles...which, come to think of it, it's around the 1-year mark...)
 
2124 and 34/70 are the same strain. and probably the best choice. People say you can get a clean lager-y beer with 34/70 in the low 60s, but i found it to be mildly fruity. I think thats what you are looking for.

920 has a faint vanilla/oak ester even at 50 degrees, id be afraid of what that strain would do in the 60s.
 
So, a new wrinkle: some of what I've read is that S-23 actually tends to be cleaner at higher temperatures and produce more esters at low, in contrast to most other yeast strains. Can anyone confirm this?
 
So, I'm looking ahead to brewing a Tropical Stout (2015 BJCP Style 16C, per the quoted style description below), sometimes in the next few months....

I was thinking I'd use the lager yeast from it to brew my tropical stout.

The web-order-form selection options are as follows:
-Fermentis SafLager 34/70
-WLP920 Old Bavarian Lager
-Wyeast 2124 Bohemian Lager

Any input on which of these, if any, is most likely to give me a good blend of esters if fermented warm, without any gross off flavors? Googling indicates that 2124 and 34/70 were found to maintain low-ester lager character by some homebrewers at least into the mid 60s (I'm thinking fermenting around 72 or so).

Here's a great article on brewing tropical stouts with a section about the yeasts used in various online recipes; looks like most recipes suggest an ale yeast with the highest number using Irish Ale yeast. Good Luck!!!

http://brewershub.com/recipes/foreign-extra-stout/style
 
Well, I made a roughly half-volume batch of my tentative recipe, then divided it among three 1 gallon jugs, which I am fermenting with S-23 at ~50, ~65, and ambient apartment temperature with a water bath for stability, for comparison purposes. ^.^
 
Yeah, I'm not getting "fruity" from S-23, at any temperature. Maybe a hint of fruit peel, and a hint of...mushroom, almost.

Wound up going with warm-fermented US-05 for the next phase, which I'll write up in a future post, because it didn't turn out the way I wanted either. :(
 
Yeah, I'm not getting "fruity" from S-23, at any temperature. Maybe a hint of fruit peel, and a hint of...mushroom, almost.

Wound up going with warm-fermented US-05 for the next phase, which I'll write up in a future post, because it didn't turn out the way I wanted either. :(

Pursuing an uncommon (but intriguing) style, please do write it up. I'm definitely interested. My temp control is a bit underpowered for summer brewing in my apartment so I'm always interested in styles and techniques that will take the summer heat and turn it into an advantage.
 
Yeah, I'm not getting "fruity" from S-23, at any temperature. Maybe a hint of fruit peel, and a hint of...mushroom, almost.

Wound up going with warm-fermented US-05 for the next phase, which I'll write up in a future post, because it didn't turn out the way I wanted either. :(


Have you thought of using the traditional California common yeast?(San Francisco Lager I think?) that seems like it would be exactly what you want/made for this application.
 
By the description of its origin it seems parallel with cal common. The natives trying to replicate an imported style in a far too warm climate. Maybe it has that different fizziness and mouthfeel that lagers can have? I don't know if that is a product of the cold or the bottom fermentation, but I have experienced that in cal commons too.
 
The BJCP style guidelines have fruity esters ranging from moderate to high is aroma and flavor, which I would assume is the opposite of clean. Granted I have not looked into this style at all, just going off the guidelines you posted.
 
Oh...kay. So, resampling my test batch(/es), with a couple more weeks on it...

I'm still not getting "fruity." I wouldn't say it has much of the flavor description from the "tropical stout" entry in it. However...

What I'm getting, between the yeast character, malt selection, and hops (all-Willamette) is a profoundly, and actually rather pleasantly *earthy* character, with some general but strong dark-malt undertones. "Volcanic soil," maybe. *tilled* volcanic soil. The flavor has a few of the aroma notes that come with just-peeled potatoes and potato peels. "Rustic" overall. Hints of coffee maybe, not really chocolate to speak of, and the various crystal-type malts have been subsumed into the overall flavor rather than standing out. Definitely no overt impression of sweetness. Just the barest suggestion of smokiness. Well, it has a sort of "debittered stout" character...in spades...

Mild hint of mushroom-umami flavor, more so on the yeastier end of the bottle. That could be relevant to my future endeavors. Would go well with anything with shiitakes [edit: Uh, I guess I have to use the two-i variant. Grow up. Seriously.] or portabellos in it. AKA, "proper food." :p

It wasn't what I was trying to do at all. But it's definitely worth doing again. I suppose I should post a recipe at some point...

Also, mildly annoyingly, I like both the cold-fermented and the counter-fermented (...in March...mostly) versions better than the one fermented at 65 F, which is really most convenient for my process...
 
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For the full tropical stout first batch (well, imperial tropical) the recipe wound up as follows:

5.5 gallons, 80% assumed efficiency, mashed at 152 F

12lb Maris otter
1.5lb Chocolate malt (US, 350L)
12oz C60
12oz C120 (Simpsons DRC)
8oz Carafa Special III
4oz Special B
12oz Blackstrap Molasses

OG 1.091, FG 1.027
8.5% calculated ABV, 32.7 calculated IBU, 56.4 calculated SRM

.18 oz Apollo 18.5% boiled 45 min (9.5)
.5 oz Galaxy 13.7% boiled 20 min (12.9)
.5 oz Mosaic 11% boiled 20 min (10.3)
.5 oz each Galaxy and Mosaic at flameout

2 packs US-05, though the recipe still says S-23.

Fermented on my countertop in April in Sacramento, so 70-75 ambient with the fermenter placed inside an 8 gallon bucket and the intervening space filled with water and replenished twice daily.

I think the sampler batch with the "fruit peel and mushroom" comment was...

2.25 gallons, 80% assumed efficiency, mashed at 152 F

5 lb Maris Otter
8oz Chocolate Malt
3oz C60
3oz C120/DRC
2oz Special B
1oz Carafa III Special

.85oz Willamette (5.1%) boiled 30 min (29.6 IBU)
.85oz Willamette (5.1%) boiled 5 min (7.7 IBU)

Apparently did not record OG and FG in Beersmith.

1 pack S-23, batch divided into three gallon jugs, fermented as described in previous posts.
 
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