Am I doing it all wrong ?

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sakariss

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Hi.

I've only brewed with the bag method, since I moved away from extract brewing. (about one year ago)

In the start I used different kinds of fabric. It was very makeshift-and-basic. But then I bought a bag made out of synthetic fibres from Australia. And have been using it ever since.
There is no such thing as an LHBS for me, and don't have room for a proper mashing system. (Even if I would love to) And since ingredients are very very hard to get hold of, and my space is restricted, I have been making 9-10l (2.5 gallon) batches from the start. It's a nice size, and it allows me to experiment more, or more frequent with less quantity to mess up when I fail :)
I have brewed around 20 batches using the BIAB method. And I have been very happy with the mashing part, most of the times.
I recently learnt to measure the approx. efficiency, and I must say that it's a bit lower, then I had hoped for. Even if I have nailed the recipe's OG many times.
For me, homebrewing is all about experimenting, discovering and enjoying. So I have tried many types of beer. I even have my own method of doing a turbid mash. But I still use my lovely brew-bag. (I should name that bag <3 )

However. I am slowly starting to realize that I have done the whole process wrong all the time.
Maby it's because I use a too small boiling pot (it has close to none headspace when doing a rolling boild)
But my BIAB process is :

1. Put the empty bag in the boiling pot. secure it around the rim of the pot.
2. Fill it up with the right amount of mashing water and adjust it to the calculated striking temperature.
3. Pour the grain into the bag/pot and stir through it, to avoid any clumping.
4. Stir a bit more, do check temperature and PH and add salts/gypsum etc.
5. Put the lid on, and wrap a blanket around the pot. leave it for half of the mashing time (I usually calculate an extra 10 mins. to the mashing time)
6. stir it again. and check the temperature. Adjust temperature if needed. Put the lid back on, and wrap a blanket around the pot. Leave it for the rest of the mashing time
7. Lift the bag out of the pot. and hold it until it's mostly drained
8. Move the bag to a plastic container or pot, and leave the bag open
9. wash it with the right amount of sparging water at the right temperatur
10. lift the bag out of the container and pour the collected sparge water into the boiling pot. (I usally repeat this step twice)
11. Boil the wort and give the spent grains to the hens or make bread out of it. Rinse the bag and hang it to dry for your next batch.

Now, where I might have gotten the whole thing wrong, is when I do the "sparging". I don't have a big enough pot, to hold the full volume + the grains
I'm not sure if it's making the efficiency worse. Or if it's just over-complicating the process.
But I recon that the method should not give me a worse efficiancy than the no-sparge-BIAB-method.

Is anyone doing it the same way?
Am I doing it all wrong? and what's the consequence of doing it wrong ?

Hugs.
 
Define Dunk Sparge :)

With BIAB there is the pour-over sparge and the dunk sparge. Pour over seems to be self explanatory. For a dunk sparge you would have the water in a bucket (or a pot) and set the bag of grains in there, then lift the bag to let some of the wort drain out, then dunk it again. The dunk sparge may get a slight bit more of the sugar out but probably not enough to matter.
 
If you want higher efficiency biab, there are two key tricks. The more obvious is a finer grain crush, if available. The second, still pretty obvious, is to squeeze that bad boy until you can squeeze no more---then squeeze more! I always hit 80%+ efficiency with a nice squeeze sparge.
 
Hi.



Now, where I might have gotten the whole thing wrong, is when I do the "sparging". I don't have a big enough pot, to hold the full volume + the grains
I'm not sure if it's making the efficiency worse. Or if it's just over-complicating the process.
But I recon that the method should not give me a worse efficiancy than the no-sparge-BIAB-method.

Is anyone doing it the same way?
Am I doing it all wrong? and what's the consequence of doing it wrong ?

Hugs.

A poorly done fly sparge (applies to pour over sparges) COULD be worse than no sparge, as channeling, too quickly draining, and/or uneven pouring can cause it to be ineffective.

I usually recommend a BIAB style batch sparge. Pull the grain bag after the mash, squeeze/drain, dunk into a pot/bucket of known water volume, move up and down a couple times to dunk it, then open the bag up, and dough in again. Stir the crap out of that mash for at least 5 minutes. Then pull the bag again, squeeze/drain as you desire, and combine first (after mash) and second runnings (after sparge) to hit your pre-boil volume.
 
A poorly done fly sparge (applies to pour over sparges) COULD be worse than no sparge, as channeling, too quickly draining, and/or uneven pouring can cause it to be ineffective.

I usually recommend a BIAB style batch sparge. Pull the grain bag after the mash, squeeze/drain, dunk into a pot/bucket of known water volume, move up and down a couple times to dunk it, then open the bag up, and dough in again. Stir the crap out of that mash for at least 5 minutes. Then pull the bag again, squeeze/drain as you desire, and combine first (after mash) and second runnings (after sparge) to hit your pre-boil volume.

^ +1 ^ What @pricelessbrewing said. You can also put the bag in the bucket first, and then add the sparge water (skip the multiple dunks in the empty bucket for this option :D.) Stirring aggressively is key to getting the maximum sugar extraction in either case.

Brew on :mug:
 
Thank you guys! :)

Dunk Sparge it is then. Even if it sounds like something Kane would pull off on Stone Cold Steve Austin.

One of the things, that I keep reading about BIAB, is that squeezing the bag should be avoided, as it is supposed to extract tannins from the grain hulls.
I've squeezed the bag moderately everytime I've mashed, without getting any tannin off-flavors. Maby the tannin extraction is just a myth.

Now I'm looking forward to chokeslam that grain-bag in some sparge water :) :rockin:
 
One of the things, that I keep reading about BIAB, is that squeezing the bag should be avoided, as it is supposed to extract tannins from the grain hulls.

Lies, I tell you. All lies! Squeeze to your heart's content.

You need a pH issue and elevated temp to extract those tannins. Squeezing impacts neither of those.
 
Lies, I tell you. All lies! Squeeze to your heart's content.

You need a pH issue and elevated temp to extract those tannins. Squeezing impacts neither of those.
^ +1 ^ @TexasWine is correct about requiring high pH and high temp to extract tannins. Some commercial breweries use industrial filter presses to squeeze the mashed grain much harder than we can. They wouldn't do this if it extracted tannins.

Brew on :mug:
 
A poorly done fly sparge (applies to pour over sparges) COULD be worse than no sparge, as channeling, too quickly draining, and/or uneven pouring can cause it to be ineffective.

I usually recommend a BIAB style batch sparge. Pull the grain bag after the mash, squeeze/drain, dunk into a pot/bucket of known water volume, move up and down a couple times to dunk it, then open the bag up, and dough in again. Stir the crap out of that mash for at least 5 minutes. Then pull the bag again, squeeze/drain as you desire, and combine first (after mash) and second runnings (after sparge) to hit your pre-boil volume.

If you are using enough water to be close to full volume your efficiency will be pretty high to start with assuming you milled the grain finely to take advantage of the bag in BIAB. Any sparge then will gain more efficiency as you can rinse out a few more sugars. It's just icing on the cake. You can't lose any efficiency with a poor sparge but you might not maximize the sugar extraction.
 
All depends on your perspective. A very poorly done fly sparge has the possibIlity, albeit small, of having worse Lauter efficiency than a full volume volume.
 
Wow, I guess my self-invented BIAB "sparge" method is ok to do? My pot came with a steaming rack. I put the rack over a bucket and place the grain bag on it. Then I use a large plate to put on top of the grain bag and push down as hard as I can (without breaking the plate).
PS...I also give the spent grains to my hens!
 
Lies, I tell you. All lies! Squeeze to your heart's content.

You need a pH issue and elevated temp to extract those tannins. Squeezing impacts neither of those.

Agree with @TexasWine - squeeze away. Also, I was using my Barley Crusher with the factory settings. As soon as I went with a finer crush (credit card thickness), my efficiency jumped 5 pts.
 
I sometimes heat a second pot of my sparge water to the right temp and then dunk my grains in that. Then squeeze the heck out of the bag, combine the contents of the sparge into the main pot and boil away.
 
I sometimes heat a second pot of my sparge water to the right temp and then dunk my grains in that. Then squeeze the heck out of the bag, combine the contents of the sparge into the main pot and boil away.

It will be cooler for squeezing the bag if you use cool water and you will lose a minimal amount of efficiency with that. The downside is that it will take a little longer to bring the wort to a boil but you avoided using the second pot.:rockin:
 
It will be cooler for squeezing the bag if you use cool water and you will lose a minimal amount of efficiency with that. The downside is that it will take a little longer to bring the wort to a boil but you avoided using the second pot.:rockin:

If your conversion is complete prior to sparging, you will not lose any efficiency by batch sparging with cold water (ref: http://braukaiser.com/blog/blog/2009/05/12/cold-water-sparging/.)

Brew on :mug:
 
I just like to scald my hands to prove my manliness. The ladies all swoon at how blistered my hands are.

That's great that you can attract the ladies with your blistered hands but after 40 years of marriage, I prefer to have my hands to use. Blistering them to impress ladies seems to be a waste.:rockin:
 
You need pretty high mashing temperatures to blister your hands by BIAB :)
I once tried a hot-pot in Iceland, which was at a (low) mashing temperature. I didn't get any blisters. Only a mild saccharification rest
 
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