What is it. I had assumed unrefined table sugar but in the book it has these listed as different ingredients in the ingredients list? I had assumed they were both sucrose but now I'm confused. I'm trying to do a Brains Welsch lager recipe that calls for it?
Cane Sugar??
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Probably just mean plain old refined white sugar; beet or cane won't make any difference (you usually can't tell from the label anyway)
kind of hard to say. cane sugar just means it came from sugar cane, as opposed to sugar beets. dont know that it makes a difference in fermentation (cane vs beet). maybe slight difference in gravity points, but i'd think not.
maybe referring to turbinado sugar? its "pure" cane sugar, i.e. its not washed and rinsed and processed to be pure white. also called raw (cane) sugar. sort of a light brown color. bigger crystals than your normal processed cane sugar.
but even here the only difference is the color, the amount of fermentable is the same i'd have to think.
maybe referring to turbinado sugar? its "pure" cane sugar, i.e. its not washed and rinsed and processed to be pure white. also called raw (cane) sugar. sort of a light brown color. bigger crystals than your normal processed cane sugar.
but even here the only difference is the color, the amount of fermentable is the same i'd have to think.
tootal
Well-Known Member
Cane sugar will not add any flavor of it's own unless you are using over ten percent in you bill. Then you can get a cidery flavor that's undesirable. Using raw sugar and brown sugar will give a slight molasses flavor which is desirable for porters and stouts, not sure about your Welsh ale.
I've gone over 20% with no flavor impact.
beergolf
Well-Known Member
not true. If it was true a lot of Belgian beers would all taste like cider.
This myth must die.
Agreed, I will restate that in no circumstance will cane sugar NEVER make your beer taste like cider. THis is one of the oldest most outdated brewing myths.
I primarily brew IPAs and Belgians. I put at LEAST 1lb of cane sugar in every one of them. If there was a shred of truth to that, I wouldnt be making beer, Id be making cider
I primarily brew IPAs and Belgians. I put at LEAST 1lb of cane sugar in every one of them. If there was a shred of truth to that, I wouldnt be making beer, Id be making cider
Back to the main topic though:
pound for pound, cane sugar has slightly for fermentables than dextrose/corn sugar
the reason dextrose is used in brewing is because it is SLIGHTLY easier for saccharomyces to ferment. Hence why its usually what comes with kits for priming the beer. Theoretically, it should prime slightly faster with dextrose
pound for pound, cane sugar has slightly for fermentables than dextrose/corn sugar
the reason dextrose is used in brewing is because it is SLIGHTLY easier for saccharomyces to ferment. Hence why its usually what comes with kits for priming the beer. Theoretically, it should prime slightly faster with dextrose
Back in the bad old days, you'd buy a 3 pound can of Blue Ribbon hopped malt syrup and mix that with a can of sugar to make 5 gallons of beer. So the fermentables were over 50% cane sugar. It did indeed get a nasty "cidery" taste. Maybe all it needed was some yeast nutrient.
When I started homebrewing 20 years ago (lost interest after a few years, then picked it up again a year ago) The New Complete Joy of Homebrewing was about the only reference book, and it warned (way too much) about not using sugar. I wish I knew then how well granulated sugar works for priming.
Most testing has shown that the "cidery" flavor actually came from the old, stale extract. That's what it became popular to add DME rather than sugar. The DME covered up the off flavor and sugar, being flavorless, did not. And so the myth of sugar usage was born....
Cane sugar = beet sugar = table sugar = sucrose. Any of them will do, in the same amounts.
Some questions you didn't ask, but wth:
corn sugar = dextrose = glucose = table sugar * 109%. That is, you can always use table sugar for dextrose, just use 9% less table sugar than the amount of dextrose you were looking for.
Dextrose is a simpler form of sugar than sucrose and might ferment marginally quicker than sucrose, but they both ending up being metabolized the same by yeast.
When I bottled, I always used table sugar. In beers that needed sugar to dry out (IIPA, Belgians) I always used table sugar when the recipe called for any type of sugar.
So how much sugar can you add without screwing up the flavor? (I'm talking about adding sugar, in addition to a bunch of malt, not instead of.) Like in a Belgian Tripel brewed to the upper end of the style, just continental pilsner malt and sugar.
I've been keeping it well under 10%; was planning to add rice or corn instead of sugar to an imperial porter on my brew list. Sugar would sure be easier (and brown sugar in particular would taste good in a porter)
I've been keeping it well under 10%; was planning to add rice or corn instead of sugar to an imperial porter on my brew list. Sugar would sure be easier (and brown sugar in particular would taste good in a porter)
beergolf
Well-Known Member
My go to tripel recipe is 80% pils, 20% sugar. Hop with Saaz and the yeast of choice. Easy, great tasting brew.
I have gone higher with the sugar, up to almost 30%, with no off flavors. The key is to aerate well, make a big enough starter and control frementation temp.
I have gone higher with the sugar, up to almost 30%, with no off flavors. The key is to aerate well, make a big enough starter and control frementation temp.
tootal
Well-Known Member
It's good to see folks are able to make good beer with over ten percent sugar. Since we just brewed an Imperial Stout using ten percent brown sugar I was doing research on how much we should use. In Dave Miller's book and Ray Daniel's book it says not to use more than ten percent or you may get a cidery flavor. They were talking about refined white table sugar so I was only repeating what I read from professionals. If you're getting good results with more that ten percent that's great!
I've gone as high as 25% sugar without a problem.
You will get little to no flavor from the brown sugar.
Those are both very old books and much has been learned since then. I would bet that both of them were just parroting the "conventional wisdom" at the time, rather than speaking from their own experience. And FTR, when you post something like that, it's not a bad idea to say "this is what I've read" so people don't mistake it for your own experience.
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