Winter Warmer Help

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Ryat66

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Location
Hershey, PA
I am starting to think about brewing a winter warmer so that I can get it in some bottles for extended aging before the holiday season. I have this recipe in mind but having never brewed this style, I need a little guidance on the grain bill. I am looking to make something that has a smooth, almost silky mouthfeel. I am trying to decide if I want to mash at 152F and use the oats or skip the oats and mash a little high, like 158F. Any advice?


6 Gals. - 80%
OG: 1.085
FG: 1.024
ABV: 8.1%

14 lbs 8.0 oz Pale Malt, Maris Otter (3.0 SRM)
1 lbs Oats, Flaked (1.0 SRM)
11.0 oz Caramel/Crystal Malt -120L (120.0 SRM)
8.0 oz Caramel/Crystal Malt - 40L (40.0 SRM)
4.0 oz Black (Patent) Malt (500.0 SRM)
4.0 oz Chocolate Malt (350.0 SRM)
0.85 oz German Magnum [12.40 %] - 44.8 IBUs
0.55 tsp Cinnamon (Ground) (Boil 1.0 mins)
0.55 tsp Ginger (Ground) (Boil 1.0 mins)
0.14 tsp Cardamom (Boil 1.0 mins)
0.13 tsp Nutmeg (Ground) (Boil 1.0 mins)
1.0 pkg British Ale (White Labs #WLP005)
 
Alot of the typical flavor of a winter warmer comes from the alcohols and aging, which gives a sherry like flavor which works well with the spices. It doesnt need much; A good basemalt, some dark malt for aging stability/color, and a splash of dark crystal or dark invert. The pretty much what you have. Personally, id drop the oats and mash at 152, a 1.080 beer is still going to have plenty of mouthfeel. But I tend to want a beer I can have a few of. The rest of the grainbill looks good. If you can get the english 120L (english extra dark crystal) it has a more complex fruitcake plummy flavor than domestic 120L.

Have you used the wlp005 before? Its a good tasting yeast, but i find it to be finicky in a high grav beer, and need to be roused often to finish up. Oxygenate well, and dont under pitch. You may want a more foolproof yeast like wlp007 if you dont have the ability to make good starters/etc.
 
Agree with giraffe! I'd lower the roast malts as well (maybe just 4oz chocolate malt?). When brewing old ales or similar I use only a dash of roast malt for colour and stability. There should be little roast flavour, though. Dark crystal and dark invert are good stuff. I'd also add some late hops around the 15-20m mark. Like 1-1.5oz of something floral or earthy.

Also, the OG is very high if you are aiming at the usual stuff. You could skip the spices, add Brett and call it an old ale.
 
Alot of the typical flavor of a winter warmer comes from the alcohols and aging, which gives a sherry like flavor which works well with the spices. It doesnt need much; A good basemalt, some dark malt for aging stability/color, and a splash of dark crystal or dark invert. The pretty much what you have. Personally, id drop the oats and mash at 152, a 1.080 beer is still going to have plenty of mouthfeel. But I tend to want a beer I can have a few of. The rest of the grainbill looks good. If you can get the english 120L (english extra dark crystal) it has a more complex fruitcake plummy flavor than domestic 120L.

Have you used the wlp005 before? Its a good tasting yeast, but i find it to be finicky in a high grav beer, and need to be roused often to finish up. Oxygenate well, and dont under pitch. You may want a more foolproof yeast like wlp007 if you dont have the ability to make good starters/etc.

Thanks for the reply!

I will check with LHBS for the English dark crystal.

As for the yeast...I use a stir plate and I ran it through the yeast calculator at a pitching rate of .75 (million cells/mL/degree Plato) and I'm seeing 290 billion cells which sounds about right. Do you agree? As for this yeast floccing too early, I'm planning to set the chamber to 65F (wort temp) and then diacetyl rest at 72F towards the end. If I swirl the carboy a few times per day will that be sufficient?
 
Thanks for the reply!

I will check with LHBS for the English dark crystal.

As for the yeast...I use a stir plate and I ran it through the yeast calculator at a pitching rate of .75 (million cells/mL/degree Plato) and I'm seeing 290 billion cells which sounds about right. Do you agree? As for this yeast floccing too early, I'm planning to set the chamber to 65F (wort temp) and then diacetyl rest at 72F towards the end. If I swirl the carboy a few times per day will that be sufficient?

That sounds about what i would expect yeast wise. Just keep an eye on it, no need to go crazy with the swirling. When it starts to floc out give it a little swirl and start nudging the temp up slowly.
 
Yeah, an oz of EKG or Styrians, or Fuggles, or even something like Perle or Saaz. Something bright but noble to lift it up a bit.
 
Thanks guys! I will let you know how the brew day goes, I'm shooting for next weekend (8/8 or 8/9).
 
Just a quick update...

I brewed this beer on 8/7 and last night was the first chance I had to pull a sample. The gravity checks out fine and a quick swig of the sample revealed an overall nice brew. It still has that green, burnt rubber character from the roast malt but usually seems to age out in the bottle.

Anyway, so far, so good!
 
How long in advance should I start brewing? Im aiming for having one around late Dec/Jan timeframe. Do I need to start now and what does the lagering sched look like? What do you use?
 
im pretty sure most winter warmers are not lagered or made with lager yeast. They are just one of many styles of ale that benefit from a few months of aging. Id say if you even made it as late at october itd be near its prime by the new year
 
How long in advance should I start brewing? Im aiming for having one around late Dec/Jan timeframe. Do I need to start now and what does the lagering sched look like? What do you use?

Start it now... I did one in November of 2011. no spices though. I wanted it for maybe February of 2012. It did not age to my liking until July of 2012. Feel it didn't peak until sometime in the middle of 2013. I finished the last couple of bottles in February of this year. Somehow it was a little overcarbonated but when I set it for a few minutes for the head to subside it was very good.

I don't know what you mean by "lagering sched"? It is an ale so mine fermented at about 68 degrees for 3 weeks then bottle conditioned for nine months to 3 1/2 years......
 
How long in advance should I start brewing? Im aiming for having one around late Dec/Jan timeframe. Do I need to start now and what does the lagering sched look like? What do you use?

It depends on several factors but that main factor for me was the high ABV and giving that plenty of time to mellow out. Plus, I did use some roast malt which to me doesn't taste right without some aging. Just my $0.02. Anyway, my plan is to break this out for Christmas so it will have had a solid 4 months in the bottle.

I brewed this as an ale so no lagering on this brew. I used my preferred English style strain, WLP005 and fermented at 66F (liquid temp) and bumped it 2F per day up to 72F to help it finish out. I usually let my primaries sit on the cake for 2-3 weeks to let them clean up, plus, I'm not in a huge hurry with this brew.

For full disclosure, this is my first stab at this style so I can't really vouch for the recipe just yet but I will keep this thread updated as I go along.
 
This brew has now been in the bottles since 10/2015 and stored in my basement in the 58F-62F range, I cracked one last night and it's really quite nice. I do perceive the sherry-like notes that have been mentioned throughout this thread and I feel like this turned out to be a nice example of the style. I will probably give out several of these at Christmas this year as it will probably be received quite nicely. The remainder will stay in my basement and I will probably just let them go to see how it might change over time.
 
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