Running hot wort through an immersion coil in cold water to cool ? - Home Brew Forums

Register Now!
Home Brew Forums > Home Brewing Beer > DIY Projects > Chillers & Stir Plates > Running hot wort through an immersion coil in cold water to cool ?

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old 10-17-2013, 09:51 PM   #1
LoloMT7
Recipes 
 
Jan 2012
Missoula, Montana
Posts: 1,913
Liked 1268 Times on 679 Posts



So I've been thinking I want to build a tiered stand to put my equipment on for brew day. I don't have a HLT and don't have any desire to use one. I would rather batch sparge or just ladle in Hot water (my fly sparge method)

At any rate I would like to get away from using my immersion wort chiller and would like to try another method. I have a counter flow chiller but was wondering if I would be able to get away without using it. Would something like the following chill the wort enough? I'm curious if anyone has tried something like this. That is using the immersion chiller coil in reverse in a sense. By submerging it in ice water and letting hot wort run through it slowly to chill. Any thoughts on why or why not this setup will work? Maybe a small pump to circulate the cold water in the bucket would be needed? Thanks all.
Click image for larger version

Name:	tiered idea.jpg
Views:	532
Size:	20.5 KB
ID:	154511  

 
Reply With Quote
Old 10-17-2013, 09:56 PM   #2
Aceandover
Recipes 
 
Aug 2013
Kingston, Ma
Posts: 35
Liked 4 Times on 4 Posts


i made one this weekend and tried it. 25' of 3/8" copper dropped temp by 50 with one pass so i think it was just to short so i think im gonna make it into an immersion or a counterflow chiller

 
Reply With Quote
Old 10-17-2013, 10:05 PM   #3
jbaysurfer
Former future HOF Brewer
HBT_LIFETIMESUPPORTER.png
Recipes 
 
Nov 2011
Santa Barbara, CA
Posts: 2,937
Liked 590 Times on 429 Posts


You can do that and I have, and it works well, but cleaning the inside of a coil is going to be a job you don't want to half ass...ever.... Also, one pass isn't going to cool your wort to pitching temp in the drawing you have shown.

You'll have to use your pump to recirculate the wort through the bucket. It also use a metric ton of ice if you try to cool the wort with ice in the bucket before the wort gets down to a manageable temperature...like 100F or so.

The way I cooled using the method you're asking about is to chill the wort with the IC down to 100F, then recirculate in through the ice water bucket til it got to pitching temp...agitating the ice and replenishing it when necessary.

I have tried them all (including CFC). I use IC and a pond pump in an ice water bucket to recirculate the cold water through the IC until I'm at pitch temp. I also whirlpool the wort with my brew pump to promote faster cooling in the brew kettle.
__________________
Batch counter: 123 batches (11/29/11-7/22/15).

 
Reply With Quote
Old 10-17-2013, 10:07 PM   #4
day_trippr
Recipes 
 
May 2011
Stow, MA
Posts: 17,168
Liked 2925 Times on 2184 Posts


You definitely want to keep the cooling water moving, for the same reason you want to keep hot wort moving in a kettle with an IC. In the absence of movement a very pronounced high temperature region develops around the tubing that will cut the cooling efficiency in a huge way. You can test the effect with an IC by holding the outflow end while leaving hot wort sitting, then giving the wort a stir.

As for cleaning it'd likely be no worse than cleaning a CFC, and probably easier than cleaning a plate chiller...

Cheers!

 
Reply With Quote
Old 10-17-2013, 10:09 PM   #5
MuddyCreek
HBT_SUPPORTER.png
 
MuddyCreek's Avatar
Recipes 
 
Aug 2012
Butte, MT
Posts: 770
Liked 410 Times on 215 Posts


Lots of folks use a setup more or less like this one. There are two problems with it (which are really just symptoms of one problem.)

First, you probably have to make a few passes with the wort to get it totally down to pitching temperature and you may find you need to add ice and cold water to the Cold Liquor Tank now and then to keep it cool.

Second, if you are recirculating your wort through the chiller, you need to be certain that you've done a good job of sterilizing.

And there's a third problem... any time you start pumping your wort through a chilling conduit you need to be prepared for some additional wort loss. It's just really hard to recover ALL your wort from the pump, chiller line etc.

I used to have one of these "reverse chiller coils" and it's sitting on a shelf in my garage. Ultimately, you're going to probably be happier with a standard immersion chiller that you can hook up to your kitchen sink. You boil the chiller IN the wort for the last few minutes of the boil so it is sterilized. If you're really really paranoid about cleanliness and "clean flavor" you can boil the chiller in another pot of clean water instead of in the wort. (After you've finished, and cleaned everything up you should boil it AGAIN in clean water to clean and sterilize it for your next dunking boiling wort.)

This way you can dunk the chiller into your brew kettle, crank up the cold water in your sink and watch as the chiller happily drops your wort temp down to somewhere in the zone of 65 degrees or so. (Depends on how cold your tap water gets, really.)

Where this doesn't work is places like S. Nevada and Arizona where the tap water never gets below 80. (Why those crazy people live there, I don't know...) You however live in cool Montana, not too far from me, btw (Butte).

Lolo, if you DO want to go forward with your heat-exchange chiller (that's what it really is...) it does give you some pretty cool options going forward. But THAT's a whole nother thread and starts to talk about HERM style brewing.
__________________
Muddy Creek Brewery
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
2 E. Galena Street
Butte, MT 59701

http://www.muddycreekbrewery.com


 
Reply With Quote
Old 10-17-2013, 10:10 PM   #6
jbaysurfer
Former future HOF Brewer
HBT_LIFETIMESUPPORTER.png
Recipes 
 
Nov 2011
Santa Barbara, CA
Posts: 2,937
Liked 590 Times on 429 Posts


Quote:
Originally Posted by day_trippr View Post

As for cleaning it'd likely be no worse than cleaning a CFC, and probably easier than cleaning a plate chiller...

Cheers!
Very true. I think I'm just a K.I.S.S. kinda guy and the ease of cleaning/sanitizing my IC trumps all the other cleaning regimens.
__________________
Batch counter: 123 batches (11/29/11-7/22/15).

 
Reply With Quote
Old 10-17-2013, 10:15 PM   #7
MuddyCreek
HBT_SUPPORTER.png
 
MuddyCreek's Avatar
Recipes 
 
Aug 2012
Butte, MT
Posts: 770
Liked 410 Times on 215 Posts


Above = True.

I use a CFC and there's some serious love-hate going on there.
__________________
Muddy Creek Brewery
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
2 E. Galena Street
Butte, MT 59701

http://www.muddycreekbrewery.com


 
Reply With Quote
Old 10-17-2013, 10:17 PM   #8
jbaysurfer
Former future HOF Brewer
HBT_LIFETIMESUPPORTER.png
Recipes 
 
Nov 2011
Santa Barbara, CA
Posts: 2,937
Liked 590 Times on 429 Posts


Quote:
Originally Posted by MuddyCreek View Post
First, you probably have to make a few passes with the wort to get it totally down to pitching temperature and you WILL find you need to add ice and cold water to the Cold Liquor Tank now and then to keep it cool.
I agree with everything in your post, but I would change this one little word.

For a typical 5 G batch of ale though, you could accomplish it with 2 water changes (in the cool liquor tank)...the first should just be straight tap water, don't waste your ice. recirc to cool it down to 120-130. Then do it again with fresh tap water and ice. Agitate. It may take a 3rd water change depending on how fast you lose your ice in 120-130 temps.
__________________
Batch counter: 123 batches (11/29/11-7/22/15).

 
Reply With Quote
Old 10-17-2013, 10:20 PM   #9
Yooper
Ale's What Cures You!
HBT_ADMIN.png
 
Yooper's Avatar
Recipes 
 
Jun 2006
UP of Michigan, Winter Texan
Posts: 69,229
Liked 7721 Times on 5424 Posts


Quote:
Originally Posted by jbaysurfer View Post
I agree with everything in your post, but I would change this one little word.

For a typical 5 G batch of ale though, you could accomplish it with 2 water changes (in the cool liquor tank)...the first should just be straight tap water, don't waste your ice. recirc to cool it down to 120-130. Then do it again with fresh tap water and ice. Agitate. It may take a 3rd water change depending on how fast you lose your ice in 120-130 temps.
I tried this once.

Once.

It took 42 pounds of ice to chill 5 gallons of wort from boiling to 70 degrees this way.

I wouldn't recommend it. A wort chiller is a great pre-chiller for a CFC, though!
__________________
Broken Leg Brewery
Giving beer a leg to stand on since 2006

 
Reply With Quote
Old 10-17-2013, 10:22 PM   #10
chocotaco
HBT_SUPPORTER.png
Recipes 
 
Oct 2012
San Clemente
Posts: 1,428
Liked 159 Times on 102 Posts


Just curious - how is this easier to clean than a counterflow chiller? Isn't it essentially the same thing? Instead of an outer hose you have a bucket of ice, but you still have the inside of the coil to clean. No?

 
Reply With Quote


Reply
Thread Tools


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Can't I cool wort by adding cold water? linusstick Extract Brewing 48 09-18-2012 06:59 PM
Why cool wort before adding to cold water?? rmcdermo General Techniques 6 03-18-2012 09:44 PM
running wort through immersion chiller cwilliamsccn Beginners Beer Brewing Forum 47 01-08-2012 02:24 AM
Is it OK to use cold bottled water to top off and cool my wort made from extract? Pixalated Beginners Beer Brewing Forum 28 05-27-2011 10:26 PM
Immersion Chillers - why does cold water feed the bottom of coil? Jknapp Equipment/Sanitation 20 02-17-2010 05:11 AM


Forum Jump