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Old 06-26-2013, 02:14 AM   #1
jcaudill
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Default Noisy check valve... any ideas?

So I've built this glycol manifold pictured below (under the VT sign). It works fine, but I'm getting this weird noise out of it I don't understand.

When I first start up the chiller everything is fine. Glycol runs into through the side with the solenoids at the bottom, if the solenoids aren't open it flows up to the top and the top contains a 5psi cracking pressure check valve. That pressure the pump from the chiller can output (checked with a pressure gauge). Once that is cracked open it just goes to the return at the bottom of the left side. If a solenoid opens, there is less than 5psi of pressure at the check valve so it does not open any longer and glycol just flows out the solenoid and in one of the outlets.

But - after a random period of time the check valve starts making a crazy noise. Best I can describe it is a weird buzzing humming - and it's very loud not quiet - louder than my damn glycol chiller! But if I disconnect my return line for a second and then stick it back on, it goes away - for a bit.

The best I can come up with is barely breaking cracking pressure on the check valve but I completely don't understand why it would be ok for a while then.

Any ideas? Is there something wrong with the design of my manifold that I'm missing? Thanks for any ideas!



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Old 06-26-2013, 05:49 PM   #2
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Hmmmm, temperature change changes the spring rate in the check valve?
I don't see right off where it's located, but if you could change the orientation of it, (vertical to horizontal , etc...), that may help.........But it's doubtful, if it is temp change induced.
If it's plumbed in a "hard line", you may try to cover the line with some more pipe wrap foam.
I'm guessing if it's metal to metal on both ends, the noise will just "telegraph" when it's oscillating, ( check valve).


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Old 06-26-2013, 07:03 PM   #3
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That's interesting... I mean the glycol I'm sending through is only running about 60F so I wouldn't think it would be that significant but who knows.

In that pick, the top of the upside-down U is the check valve and it's currently wrapped in foam which is why you can't see it. It is a brass check valve. It's all hard line - all pretty much stainless fittings with exception of the check valve.

The orientation idea is interesting. Can't say I can logically understand it but anything is worth a shot.

Only other thing I can even think to try is a lower cracking pressure but lower is 1psi. So it's a gamble if that'll work or not.
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Old 06-26-2013, 08:23 PM   #4
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I was kinda' unsure about the "random period", as if it was from room temp to design temp.
Just curious , what is the check valve used for, maintaining pump prime?
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Old 06-26-2013, 09:18 PM   #5
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Ya I'm unsure about the random period too lol.

So the design is such that - when both solenoids are closed (these are the solenoids to the glycol in for the fermenters) - there is enough pressure to open the check valve and let glycol pass through to the return at the glycol unit. The reason for this is the pump uses glycol to keep cool and lubricated. If you don't return glycol the pump will burn out.

When a solenoid opens, there isn't enough pressure to open the check valve and all glycol is pushed through the solenoid(s) and then it is returned on the left side past the check valve.

Make sense? It was the best way I could think to do it.
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Old 06-26-2013, 09:55 PM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jcaudill View Post
Ya I'm unsure about the random period too lol.

So the design is such that - when both solenoids are closed (these are the solenoids to the glycol in for the fermenters) - there is enough pressure to open the check valve and let glycol pass through to the return at the glycol unit. The reason for this is the pump uses glycol to keep cool and lubricated. If you don't return glycol the pump will burn out.

When a solenoid opens, there isn't enough pressure to open the check valve and all glycol is pushed through the solenoid(s) and then it is returned on the left side past the check valve.

Make sense? It was the best way I could think to do it.
Can you watch the return flow before and during the buzzing?
Check the data sheet to find the flow rate at 5 PSI.
I have a feeling the pump can not make it.
Try setting the valve pressure to 3 PSI if adjustable.

Look at my bypass flow video, diffrent design.


The noice is a combination off condenser, two CIP pumps running.
Cheers,
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Old 06-26-2013, 10:06 PM   #7
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Hey there Cladius... ok I will take a look at that and I think you are probably right. Unfortunately it is not adjustable and I didn't have much luck finding one that was with 3/8" NPT ends. But I did order a 1PSI version thinking maybe that will help.

I took a look at the video but I couldn't quite figure it out - can you explain?
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Old 06-26-2013, 10:24 PM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jcaudill View Post
Hey there Cladius... ok I will take a look at that and I think you are probably right. Unfortunately it is not adjustable and I didn't have much luck finding one that was with 3/8" NPT ends. But I did order a 1PSI version thinking maybe that will help.

I took a look at the video but I couldn't quite figure it out - can you explain?
My video shows the glycol chiller bypass flow when all solenoids are closed.

Cheers,
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Old 06-26-2013, 10:25 PM   #9
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If the solenoids are closed, ( temperature reached, yes?), then why not turn off the pump?
Your glycol reservoir will then stabilize it's temp, and shut off it's chiller, yes?
When your product needs chillin', could you not just signal the pump to start, and solenoids to open?
Lemme' know what I'm missing, please Sir, 'cause it sounds like to this Layman there are some unneeded sequences there if only to keep the pump cool.
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Old 06-26-2013, 10:41 PM   #10
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Actually to be completely honest that option never crossed my mind!

Reason being the pump is currently being powered by an outlet provided on the chiller so it didn't cross my mind. I'll have to find out if that is stepped down or 110 and then I'd have to add another solenoid to the mix which I was hoping to avoid.


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