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Old 03-23-2013, 08:18 PM   #21
Jon73
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I find as a homebrewer I've spent the majority of my time brewing ales and ipa's, which I enjoy, but they are now kind of a routine and the brewing of them has become rather boring. I just brewed my first milk stout yesterday and I'm excited to see how it turns out. Not that it was a more difficult recipe, just different. I think that will be the way of things, just like the pendulum analogy. You can only drink hop bombs for so long before you just get tired of it and want something different.

And if I can preach just a minute longer, it is kind of the American way to do things. Something new comes along and we jam it down our throats as much, and as often, as we can until we are sick of it. Then 10/20 years later, we revive it and start all over. And in the interim those that remain hop-heads will become the purists and mock the newcomers saying that they've stayed true all along and get pissy over others drinking "their" beer. Just my observation on the American culture. Not knocking it, just keeping it "real".



 
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Old 03-23-2013, 08:28 PM   #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by EyePeeA View Post
Disagree 1000%. I'm sorry you had a single bad experience with Pliny. But a fresh to death bottle, or a draft run from clean lines, is like sipping on Angel's tears. It sounds like you 1) dislike IPAs or 2) dislike hops... perhaps both? IPAs are not supposed to be balanced. Their unique offering of unbalance, held against a huge array of balanced beer styles, is what makes them special.

Pliny is one of the few extremely well made IIPAs on par with the likes of Heady Topper. Both have a lot of that dank marijuana goodness that so many other IIPAs fail to harness.
+1

I like most styles of beer but I have to say that the IPA and IIPA are my favorite styles. I'm looking forward to when Russian River starts distributing to Texas.


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Old 03-23-2013, 08:43 PM   #23
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I can't believe someone said a few years ago you could not find hoppy beers ... UNTRUE. I do believe that extra hoppy beers are a fad a beer drinker goes through however. Too much hops is too much hops, just like too much of anything else is unbalanced. Put one of those POS beers on my table and I'll judge it a dismal failure as quickly as an infected beer.

I neither love or hate hops - they are a part of beer, just a part. All things in balance.
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Old 03-23-2013, 08:50 PM   #24
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Call it a trend...say it's here to say. I say it doesn't matter cause I will drink that and other beer varietals all day long...although I must say,...I would never wait in line hours for beer! There are jut too damn many beautiful beers out there!

So,...pour a damn glass, hold it up and drink my friends!

 
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Old 03-23-2013, 08:57 PM   #25
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My biggest problem is that most IPAs I've had have the same exact character. C hops, maybe a little crystal, that's about it. I truly love an ipa that it's different like Sumthin' Sumthin' or SN Celebration. I hate how when I go to my grocery store my selection is this: ipa, apa, light lager, dry stout. Gimme some malt bombs, barleywines, dubbels, tripels, bocks, something! I like variety, if I wanted the same thing no matter what brand I went with, I'd consider going with light lager. At least those are made consistently.

I love a good ipa but how am I supposed to turn people on to good beer by punching them with a pine cone citrus bomb? The next trend I'm seeing is Belgian style beers and the more delicate approach is welcome here.

The thing I do like about ipas is that most craft beer styles are doing more than a nod to the hops for bittering. Hops are a great ingredient and there is so much unexplored territory there. I can't wait for craft brewers to use new hops you produce more than your standard ipa.

 
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Old 03-23-2013, 11:52 PM   #26
EyePeeA
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LBussy View Post
I do believe that extra hoppy beers are a fad a beer drinker goes through however. Too much hops is too much hops, just like too much of anything else is unbalanced. Put one of those POS beers on my table and I'll judge it a dismal failure as quickly as an infected beer.

I neither love or hate hops - they are a part of beer, just a part. All things in balance.
Disagreed again. I think most people learn that hoppy dry bitter beers are an acquired taste. Like Coffee or Scotch, you don't normally love IIPAs immediately. But when they grow on you, they stay with you, and you yearn for more.

I also don't agree with the whole balance descriptor for this style. IIPas are supposed to be bitter and all about the hops. That's the whole point. I make an IIPA that uses 16 oz. total hops and everyone who appreciates IIPAs seems to go crazy for it. It's the most unbalanced thing ever, but it's sexy.

 
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Old 03-24-2013, 12:18 AM   #27
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Quote:
Originally Posted by EyePeeA View Post
Disagreed again. I think most people learn that hoppy dry bitter beers are an acquired taste. Like Coffee or Scotch, you don't normally love IIPAs immediately. But when they grow on you, they stay with you, and you yearn for more.

I also don't agree with the whole balance descriptor for this style. IIPas are supposed to be bitter and all about the hops. That's the whole point. I make an IIPA that uses 16 oz. total hops and everyone who appreciates IIPAs seems to go crazy for it. It's the most unbalanced thing ever, but it's sexy.
I appreciate you sharing your opinion. It's better when adults can exchange beliefs without running out of facts and resorting to name calling.

I am not wrong that these beers are incorrect for the style. Whether or not you agree that the style is described correctly, I think you need to agree that these beers do not meet them as they are currently documented.

Also, it is improbable that the historic IPA had such a hoppy nose when enjoyed at its destination. I'm also going to go way out on a limb and say that Cascades were not in those beers. Their hops were not stored in hermetically sealed, light proof packages, nor did they pelletize. There's nearly no way that they could ever have consistently enjoyed what passes for an IPA today.

When I started brewing many moons ago we had the same trend. The only difference now is that when we had to use Compuserve and communicate with each other, it cost a lot of money so we did not pontificate or brag about our excesses. Now due to sheer volume enough hop-heads can gather and reach critical mass and convince themselves that as a style this makes sense. I believe some people prefer it, that's fine. It is not however true to any style except perhaps a new one not yet documented.

You mention acquired taste. I wonder (not trying to pick a fight) if it's just not desensitizing yourself?
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Old 03-24-2013, 12:20 AM   #28
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You mention acquired taste. I wonder (not trying to pick a fight) if it's just not desensitizing yourself?
I think that you should know better than that... being a beer judge and all, and tasting a variety of styles and takes on styles. It's kind of like being a Scotch judge. The newb might only taste disgusting harsh oak, just as an IIPA newb may only sense a rough blanket bitterness full of lawn clippings. However, the trained palate can sense much more than that. If anything, I think my palate has grown due to IPA appreciation. I can detect subtle nuances that I was never able to in the past.

I feel that IPA haters just fall back on the "desensitizing" excuse to support their own opinion about the style. If you try to appreciate a nice balanced English brown ale right after you had a highly bitter American IIPA, well then there is a problem. But hoppy bitter beers do not cause permanent palate densensitation.

 
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Old 03-24-2013, 01:38 AM   #29
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You misunderstand me -I have a taste for a real IPA. I think that overpowering a beer with a single ingredient, any ingredient, is a flaw. It is no different than an over-oaked Chardonay, or Scotch malt which is over-done with peat smoke. Too much sugar coffee is too much sugar, it does not enhance it.

To me it is no different than drowning food in salt. Some salt enhances and balances. To much is just salty.
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Old 03-24-2013, 03:03 AM   #30
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Interestingly enough, unlike spiciness which we do grow tolerant of the more we consume, bitterness stays just as bitter no matter how much we consume, other than normal palette cleansing type tolerance.

I thought of a couple more examples of ipa derivations that I'd like to see more of since the market is saturated with the same type of one note IPAs: Cascadian Dark Ales and Fuggle ipa by Shipyard.



 
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