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Old 02-19-2013, 11:31 AM   #1
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Default Off-Taste on Two Hearted Ale Clone

I brewed Eschatz's Two Hearted Ale clone on 1/12 and kegged it on 2/3. I've brewed it before with great results but made a couple minor changes.

Recipe:
11# 2-row
2# Vienna
1/2# Carapils
1/2# C60
1oz centennial FWH
1.25 oz centennial at 15, 5, 1 min
1.25 oz centennial dry hop in keg

The biggest difference this time was replacing the 60 min hop addition with FWH. I also fermented the batch very low (58-60). I did warm it up a bit at the end (65).
OG = 1.053, FG=1.008

The beer has great aroma, great head/retention/lacing and great mouthfeel. It tastes great for the most part, but I get a harshness at the back of the tongue that lingers after each sip. It's holding this beer back from being great and I can't figure out the problem.

Could it be related to the FWH or the low ferm temp? I appreciate any feedback you all can provide.
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Old 02-19-2013, 01:07 PM   #2
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If you hadn't kegged it 2 weeks ago, I would say that sounds like carbonic bite which happened to me once, and tasted just like that. But assuming you did not recently shake the crap out of the keg, then it shouldn't be that. I can't see how a low FWH or a low ferm temp would lead to that, though.. I'm stumped.
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Old 02-19-2013, 01:21 PM   #3
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Which yeast strain did you use? I notice that I get "peachy" esters with S05 at under 65 degrees or so.
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Old 02-19-2013, 01:23 PM   #4
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Is it husky, grainy, possibly astringent?


This would be associated with tannin extraction and could possibly be what you are experiencing.

FWH would produce a more mellow bitterness and the cooler temps would produce a cleaner beer so I would rule those out.

Tannin extraction comes from a high mash PH coupled with sparging at too high a temp.
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Old 02-19-2013, 01:24 PM   #5
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Wyeast 1056. I use this a lot and usually get a clean taste.

I made a 1.25L starter. Initially thought I may have slightly under pitched, but it brought it all the way down to 1.008
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Old 02-19-2013, 01:31 PM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by duboman
Is it husky, grainy, possibly astringent?

This would be associated with tannin extraction and could possibly be what you are experiencing.

FWH would produce a more mellow bitterness and the cooler temps would produce a cleaner beer so I would rule those out.

Tannin extraction comes from a high mash PH coupled with sparging at too high a temp.
Astringency may be a good description, but it is really just an after taste.

I batch sparged with 3.5gal of 180F water. I don't test the ph level of my mash, so that may/may not be an issue.
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Old 02-19-2013, 02:16 PM   #7
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While 180F is not that high, if the PH was high, over 5.8 or into the 6's then that could be a tannin extraction issue so you might want to pick up some test strips and take some samples. You can also read through this:

http://www.kroc.org/Links/TroubleshootingGuide.htm
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Old 03-15-2013, 06:27 PM   #8
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I just received some feedback on this beer by way of the Drunk Monk Challenge.

It scored a 27 and got knocked for diacetyl in the aroma, a bittering lingerness in the flavor (just how I had described my concern), and a slight astringency in the mouthfeel (as duboman guessed).

Second judge also knocked it for diacetyl and "some astringency in finish with grainy husk flavor"

Overall comments:
Well balanced. Slightly leaning toward bitter. Very drinkable, no major flaws. Lacking hop aroma (try dry-hopping) or late additions. With some tweaking this beer will score much higher. Keep brewing.

My thoughts:
I assume that the diacetyl is due to the low ferm temps even though I did raise it 65 for the last day or so. Perhaps I waited too long to raise the temp?
Based on duboman's comments I need test my mash pH to see if it is too high.

Any other thoughts/comments?
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Old 03-15-2013, 10:04 PM   #9
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You may not have allowed enough time for the yeast to clean up the diacetyl and the astringency I mentioned previously.

Diacetyl is a normal by product of fermentation but with proper temps and enough time the yeast will naturally clean it up on its own
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Old 03-15-2013, 10:55 PM   #10
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It was in the fermenter long enough (three weeks) but I think I should've given it a little longer at the higher temp, or fermented a little Warner the whole time.
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