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Old 03-20-2013, 02:10 PM   #11
-MG-
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Dec 2011
Cedar Rapids, IA
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Here you go:

http://www.midwestsupplies.com/biomat-dar.html

Same product as Maturex and does the same thing. Note this comes in an incredibly small bottle. Might be good for 3-4 batches.

 
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Old 03-20-2013, 08:37 PM   #12
ajdelange
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Aug 2010
McLean/Ogden, Virginia/Quebec
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Guess I'll bookmark it this time. Thanks.

 
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Old 03-20-2013, 09:29 PM   #13
coffutt
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Jan 2012
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ajdelange View Post
If you pitch lager at cold temp (close to 40 F) and let it warm itself to about 48 F and let it ferment there to within 1P of terminal, then lower the temperature gradually to around freezing and transfer the the beer, with yeast, to a lagering tank there will be no diacetyl.
Are people having any luck performing this method in a single, conical fermentor? Would dumping alot of the old yeast prior to dropping temperatures leave enough in suspension to help eliminate diacetyl?

 
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Old 03-20-2013, 09:42 PM   #14
ajdelange
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Aug 2010
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That is how I do it. I think whether it works or not depends on the configuration of the fermenter. Mine have chill bands on the bodies but not the cones. Therefore, I must run the body bands whenever I want cooling. Cool beer cascades down the sides and warmer beer rises up in the middle thus keeping lots of yeast in suspension. At first I thought this was a curse. Now I look at it as a blessing (not much I can do about it even if I go back to considering it a curse.)

 
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Old 03-21-2013, 06:53 PM   #15
Beergazzi
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Feb 2013
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At which point in the process is this added? is this OK for bottle carbing (I have no clue how this affects yeast)? At about a buck a batch (5g), it may be worth experimenting.

 
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Old 03-22-2013, 06:27 PM   #16
ajdelange
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I think the best answer here is, as is so often the case, to follow the manufacturer's instructions. But common sense should give us some idea. Acetolactate is oxidized non enzymatically to diacetyl in the package. If yeast are present then they will reduce the diacetyl back to acetoin and butane diol. Thus clearly you want to put the enzyme into the beer before the yeast are removed or very shortly afterwards in order to prevent that oxidation step from taking place. IOW you want to be rid of the acetolactate by the time the yeast are gone. Once the yeast are gone even this product will not remove diacetyl. It works by preventing it from forming.

 
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Old 09-09-2014, 07:07 PM   #17
biertourist
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Oct 2012
Woodinville, WA
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SpecialtyEnzymes View Post
Sorry if this is a Necro, but I was cruising around for some info on this enzyme being used in wine and found this thread.

This enzyme exists and has been used by some of the larger brewers to achieve shorter rests etc. Not for as long as you might think though, the enzyme was only isolated in the mid to late 1980's.

The problem in getting it into homebrew supply shops is literally cost. This enzyme is incredibly expensive, and has very small dosing, usually 10-20ppm. As hog2up calculated, less than half a gram per 5 gallon batch. Problem with that is that a distributor has to buy 10-25kg minimum from an enzyme provider. So that means they have enough for 20,000-50,000 5 gallon batches that they have about 1-2 years to sell (enzymes have a shelf-life).

Also take note as was mentioned before, this enzyme prevents the actual formation of diacetyl by altering the precursor to it. If there is already diacetyl in solution, this enzyme will do nothing to said diacetyl. Preemptive strike or bust, more or less.

Hope this helps!

SpecZyme
Came across this thread; glad someone found and posted a link to BioMat DAR which is available to HomeBrewers. Also wanted to point out that the quoted poster (Speciality Enzymes) is a manufacturer of this enzyme (alpha acetolactate decarboxylase) and their product is called "SEBrew Mature L"; obviously they don't have a home-brew sized offering currently.

This statement "Sorry if this is a Necro, but I was cruising around for some info on this enzyme being used in wine and found this thread." just seemed a bit misleading, so I wanted to specifically call out that the poster is a commercial entity who makes this enzyme for big breweries. Obviously they've done nothing sketchy and have posted some great details, but I'm a big fan of full disclosure, so I'm providing it for them.
;-)


Adam

 
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