Splitting a single yeast vial - possible? - Home Brew Forums
Home Brew Forums > Home Brewing Beer > Fermentation & Yeast > Splitting a single yeast vial - possible?

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old 01-28-2013, 12:14 AM   #1
Brulosopher
Recipes 
 
Jun 2011
Fresno, CA
Posts: 2,931
Liked 357 Times on 261 Posts



I want to brew 2 beers with WLP810 San Francisco Lager yeast... and I have a single vial. Here's what I'm thinking, please let me know if you think this will work or not.

First off, I used YeastCalc.com to determine all of my numbers. I will be making a 1.052 Cal Common and a 1.050 Honey Blonde(ish), requiring 267 and 257 cells, respectively. My plan...

1. Initially make a single 3 liter starter in a 5 L, chill the wort and pitch the entire vial of yeast; place it on stir plate for about an hour or so; pour 1.5 L of the beer into the 2 L flask and leave both on stir plates until they finish fermenting.

2. Whenever they're done fermenting, probably 3 days or so, cold crash over night, decant, and pour another 1 L of fresh (chilled) wort into each flask, then let them both ferment out completely again, another 3 days I suppose.

3. Cold crash, decant, pitch into respective brews.

According to YeastCalc, this "should" leave me with about 292 cells per flask, just more than necessary. I do plan to ferment both beers rather cool, around 56F.

Thanks for any help! Cheers.


__________________
Brulosophy is a place to experiment with home brews. If you've had a crazy idea or wondered how something worked please visit us at Brulosophy.com!

List of exBEERiments

How To Easily Harvest Clean Yeast from Starters

Make Good Lager in Less Time!

Marshall "Brulosopher" Schott

 
Reply With Quote
Old 01-28-2013, 12:32 AM   #2
ResumeMan
HBT_SUPPORTER.png
 
ResumeMan's Avatar
Recipes 
 
Nov 2011
Oakland, CA
Posts: 482
Liked 28 Times on 27 Posts


Yeah I can't see why that won't work (I didn't check your numbers on YeastCalc).

What I've taken to doing is, when I buy a new White Labs vial, I just put 1/2 of it into my starter (accounting for the fact that there's only half the yeast to begin with), and save the rest, rather than either washing yeast or building up an extra-big starter the way described in your sig.

So this should work just fine.


__________________
I am not drunk! I am by nature a loud, friendly, clumsy person!

 
Reply With Quote
Old 01-28-2013, 12:47 AM   #3
helibrewer
HBT_SUPPORTER.png
 
helibrewer's Avatar
Recipes 
 
Nov 2011
Santa Rosa, CA
Posts: 3,707
Liked 299 Times on 254 Posts


I have two stirplates and two 2L flasks so I usually use the entire vial on a single 1.5L starter. When that completes, I chill, decant and split that into the two 2L flasks and do another 1.5L starter in each.

There's no problem with splitting the vials and/or starters for subsequent steps.
__________________
Something is always fermenting....
"It's Bahl Hornin'"

Primary:
Brite Tank/Lagering:
Kegged: Sour Saison, Pale Ale, Aggie Ale, Firestone DBA, De Koninck Blonde
Bottled: Belgian Quad (Grand Reserve), Derangement (Belgian Dark Strong)
On Deck: Pliny the Younger

 
Reply With Quote
Old 01-28-2013, 03:21 AM   #4
Brulosopher
Recipes 
 
Jun 2011
Fresno, CA
Posts: 2,931
Liked 357 Times on 261 Posts


Quote:
Originally Posted by helibrewer View Post
I have two stirplates and two 2L flasks so I usually use the entire vial on a single 1.5L starter. When that completes, I chill, decant and split that into the two 2L flasks and do another 1.5L starter in each.

There's no problem with splitting the vials and/or starters for subsequent steps.
This is my option B... if people think option A is sh!t...
__________________
Brulosophy is a place to experiment with home brews. If you've had a crazy idea or wondered how something worked please visit us at Brulosophy.com!

List of exBEERiments

How To Easily Harvest Clean Yeast from Starters

Make Good Lager in Less Time!

Marshall "Brulosopher" Schott

 
Reply With Quote
Old 01-28-2013, 03:40 AM   #5
Stauffbier
HBT_SUPPORTER.png
 
Stauffbier's Avatar
Recipes 
 
Nov 2011
El Paso, TX
Posts: 5,122
Liked 1048 Times on 641 Posts


Quote:
Originally Posted by Brulosopher View Post
I want to brew 2 beers with WLP810 San Francisco Lager yeast... and I have a single vial. Here's what I'm thinking, please let me know if you think this will work or not.

First off, I used YeastCalc.com to determine all of my numbers. I will be making a 1.052 Cal Common and a 1.050 Honey Blonde(ish), requiring 267 and 257 cells, respectively. My plan...

1. Initially make a single 3 liter starter in a 5 L, chill the wort and pitch the entire vial of yeast; place it on stir plate for about an hour or so; pour 1.5 L of the beer into the 2 L flask and leave both on stir plates until they finish fermenting.

2. Whenever they're done fermenting, probably 3 days or so, cold crash over night, decant, and pour another 1 L of fresh (chilled) wort into each flask, then let them both ferment out completely again, another 3 days I suppose.

3. Cold crash, decant, pitch into respective brews.

According to YeastCalc, this "should" leave me with about 292 cells per flask, just more than necessary. I do plan to ferment both beers rather cool, around 56F.

Thanks for any help! Cheers.
It will work just fine. If you're using stir plates it will only take about 36 hours for each 1.5L starter to ferment. IME. Then maybe 24 hrs for the second 1L step-up.
__________________
Bier war sein letztes wort dann trugen ihn die Englein fort...


 
Reply With Quote
Old 01-28-2013, 06:49 AM   #6
Brulosopher
Recipes 
 
Jun 2011
Fresno, CA
Posts: 2,931
Liked 357 Times on 261 Posts


Quote:
Originally Posted by Stauffbier

It will work just fine. If you're using stir plates it will only take about 36 hours for each 1.5L starter to ferment. IME. Then maybe 24 hrs for the second 1L step-up.
Rad. I'll be making the first starter tomorrow, cold crashing Wednesday, decanting and stepping it up Thursday, cold crashing Sunday, then decanting and pitching on Monday.
__________________
Brulosophy is a place to experiment with home brews. If you've had a crazy idea or wondered how something worked please visit us at Brulosophy.com!

List of exBEERiments

How To Easily Harvest Clean Yeast from Starters

Make Good Lager in Less Time!

Marshall "Brulosopher" Schott

 
Reply With Quote
Old 01-28-2013, 01:23 PM   #7
patthebrewer
Recipes 
 
Sep 2012
, allenwood, nj
Posts: 688
Liked 56 Times on 49 Posts


Yup it'll work just make to starters.
__________________
Manasquan River Brewing LLC

 
Reply With Quote
Old 01-28-2013, 01:46 PM   #8
WoodlandBrew
HBT_SUPPORTER.png
 
WoodlandBrew's Avatar
Recipes 
 
Oct 2012
Malden, MA
Posts: 2,191
Liked 244 Times on 199 Posts


It should work just fine. You aren't going to know how many cells you really have without a cell count, but with clean yeast from a starter 1.5 million cells per ml of thick cold crashed cake should get you in the ball park. I've seen about the same number of cells produced with intermittent shaking as with a stir plate. The stir plate might get you to completion faster. Inoculation rate doesn't seem to be as big a factor as the calculators make it look. Doing one 5 litter in an ale pail over three days will give you about the same cell count as the stepping you are planning.

See here for details:
http://woodlandbrew.blogspot.com/201...ll-growth.html
__________________
The 2nd edition is now available: Brewing Engineering
Woodland Brewing Research Blog Applied Science for Better Beer.

 
Reply With Quote
Old 01-28-2013, 07:20 PM   #9
TTB
Recipes 
 
Nov 2012
Posts: 44
Liked 6 Times on 3 Posts


Quote:
Originally Posted by WoodlandBrew View Post
It should work just fine. You aren't going to know how many cells you really have without a cell count, but with clean yeast from a starter 1.5 million cells per ml of thick cold crashed cake should get you in the ball park. I've seen about the same number of cells produced with intermittent shaking as with a stir plate. The stir plate might get you to completion faster. Inoculation rate doesn't seem to be as big a factor as the calculators make it look. Doing one 5 litter in an ale pail over three days will give you about the same cell count as the stepping you are planning.

See here for details:
http://woodlandbrew.blogspot.com/201...ll-growth.html
Do you see any problem with putting a vial directly into a 5L starter vs stepping up to 5L? Is there an affect on the yeast for the beer fermentation and/or for following generations?

 
Reply With Quote
Old 01-28-2013, 07:31 PM   #10
WoodlandBrew
HBT_SUPPORTER.png
 
WoodlandBrew's Avatar
Recipes 
 
Oct 2012
Malden, MA
Posts: 2,191
Liked 244 Times on 199 Posts


That's fine. It will take longer to finish, but will probably be shorter than doing two steps.
100 billion cells in 5 litters is 20 billion cells per liter. A 1.040 ale would be pitched at typically 7 billion cells per liter.


__________________
The 2nd edition is now available: Brewing Engineering
Woodland Brewing Research Blog Applied Science for Better Beer.

 
Reply With Quote
Reply
Thread Tools


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Single WL vial for a 2L starter? Phunhog Fermentation & Yeast 7 06-06-2011 03:24 PM
Splitting yeast vial TheMan Fermentation & Yeast 7 04-27-2010 05:43 AM
Lager start from a single WL vial ramey70 Fermentation & Yeast 1 02-23-2010 05:16 PM
Splitting White Labs vial between batches womencantsail Fermentation & Yeast 10 01-26-2010 04:21 AM
Splitting a single pack s-05 jmp138 Fermentation & Yeast 3 10-08-2009 04:11 AM


Forum Jump