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Old 12-03-2012, 03:50 PM   #11
Chugmaster
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Thanks for the input Kal. This whole concept seems to be a bit of a stumper. I haven't been able to find anything on the web regarding this in any electrical/diy forums.

The reasoning behind my whole idea to use two power sources is to be able to brew back-to-back batches like your 50a setup, though I'm limited by my 30a dryer plug. By essentially running two systems within one panel, I hope to use the 120v 15a source to heat my HLT and the 240v 30a source to run the rest of the control panel.

I notice with your theatre amplifier example that both plugs look as if they're 15a service. Therefore, any fault would not exceed 15a and would run out either 14AWG ground wire.

The dilemma that we're wrestling with for a two power source panel is a short on the 30a side of the panel travelling down the 15a (14AWG) ground.

 
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Old 12-03-2012, 06:01 PM   #12
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Old 12-03-2012, 06:05 PM   #13
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Correct. Using proper wire size is fundamental. I'd probably use 10ga for both grounds.

Kal

 
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Old 12-03-2012, 06:23 PM   #14
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I have three feeds in conduit from my loadcenter to my control panel. Technically the metal conduit is sufficient for equipment ground but I chose to run an additional equipment ground which is sized for the largest overcurrent device or 50A = #10ga. This one equipment ground covers all the feeds per NEC 250.122(C). If you are running individual cables like romex for example, each cable must have it's own equipment ground. They all get tied together in your control panel and you essentially have several parallel equipment grounds which when added will end up exceeding the minimum requirement for a conduit.

 
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Old 12-03-2012, 06:29 PM   #15
Chugmaster
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What are the three feeds that you have coming into your control panel?

 
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Old 12-03-2012, 06:30 PM   #16
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Hmmm...interesting.

So even though the hot wires originate at separate breakers the grounding wires within these cables can be considered parallel connections, or do you just consider the individual cables as separate entities (which ends up being the same net result)?
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Old 12-03-2012, 06:35 PM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chugmaster View Post
What are the three feeds that you have coming into your control panel?
50A/240V - HLT - 11kW
30A/240V - BK - 4.5kW
20A/120V - CONTROL POWER AND PUMPS, LIGHTED BEER SIGN AND DECORATIVE BREWERY LIGHTING

 
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Old 12-04-2012, 12:51 AM   #18
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If doing it of course you must keep neutrals separate and use the incoming hot with the corresponding neutral. If doing it in conduit I would run each circuit in its own conduit lest you get into deratings for more than three current carrying conductors in the same conduit.

 
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Old 12-04-2012, 01:42 AM   #19
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Originally Posted by whoaru99 View Post
Hmmm...interesting.

So even though the hot wires originate at separate breakers the grounding wires within these cables can be considered parallel connections, or do you just consider the individual cables as separate entities (which ends up being the same net result)?
Yes, I think...The ground per cable is most likely required for some guy accidentally cutting through it with a sawzall. It's grounding overkill to run separate cables.

 
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Old 12-04-2012, 01:48 AM   #20
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Originally Posted by porcupine73 View Post
If doing it of course you must keep neutrals separate and use the incoming hot with the corresponding neutral. If doing it in conduit I would run each circuit in its own conduit lest you get into deratings for more than three current carrying conductors in the same conduit.
Derating has to be considered but unless you are getting over 10 current carrying conductors is easily met. We always fill 1-in conduit home runs from the panel. It is most cost effective for conduit and copper.

 
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