The cider I got has yeast killers... any hope? - Home Brew Forums

Register Now!
Home Brew Forums > Wine, Mead, Cider, Sake & Soda > Cider Forum > The cider I got has yeast killers... any hope?

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old 09-27-2012, 09:37 PM   #1
jamesnsw
Recipes 
 
Mar 2009
, Indiana
Posts: 843
Liked 10 Times on 4 Posts



I was excited about the local orchard's cider, saw on the website it was pasteurized, and they go into detail about the heat treatment. I was like, cool, I won't have to worry about killing the wild buggers, they took care of it for me.

So I bought 4 gallons (at $8/each), and made some graff on Saturday. I put it on the yeast cake left behind by a mild made with Nottingham. I expected a big blow off.

Nothing.

So I looked at the jug, and it says it may have up to 1/10th of 1% of Sodium Benzoate and Potassium Sorbate. Grr...

I'm a bit confused on my gravities. My OG was measured at 1.051. 4 days later, it was 1.062 (I stirred it up, I'm thinking this explains the increase). Yesterday and today, it was steady at 1.058, so I'm thinking that's what it actually is, and that it hasn't fermented at all.

I have two courses of action-
1- It still tastes good. Add a bottle of whiskey, and keg it, and just don't worry about fermenting it.
2- Keep trying things to get it to ferment.

So if I do the 2nd, what is my best shot? I have fresh yeast, a stir plate, and patience. Any suggestions?
__________________
Some stuff I've made: Odell's 90 Shilling Clone, Abbey Weiss Pottsville Common, Simple Mead, Dry Dock Apricot Blonde Clone, Rye IPA, Maibock, Scrapper's Quaffable Irish Red, Short Sleep Blueberry Ale, Lazy Magnolia Pecan Nut Brown Ale Clone, Graff, Apfelwein, Cascades Orange Pale, Orfy's Mild Ale, Vagabond Gingered Ale
What to Brew for iOS (free)

 
Reply With Quote
Old 09-28-2012, 09:32 PM   #2
jamesnsw
Recipes 
 
Mar 2009
, Indiana
Posts: 843
Liked 10 Times on 4 Posts


Anyone have any experience resurrecting yeast in a situation like this?
__________________
Some stuff I've made: Odell's 90 Shilling Clone, Abbey Weiss Pottsville Common, Simple Mead, Dry Dock Apricot Blonde Clone, Rye IPA, Maibock, Scrapper's Quaffable Irish Red, Short Sleep Blueberry Ale, Lazy Magnolia Pecan Nut Brown Ale Clone, Graff, Apfelwein, Cascades Orange Pale, Orfy's Mild Ale, Vagabond Gingered Ale
What to Brew for iOS (free)

 
Reply With Quote
Old 09-28-2012, 10:20 PM   #3
sonofgrok
n00basaurus
HBT_LIFETIMESUPPORTER.png
 
sonofgrok's Avatar
Recipes 
 
Sep 2012
Waco, TX
Posts: 1,145
Liked 313 Times on 223 Posts


Good news: Potassium sorbate won't kill your yeast, only keep it from multiplying.

Bad news: Sodium benzoate will go all jack the ripper on your fermentation.
__________________
"Always do sober what you said you'd do drunk. That will teach you to keep your mouth shut." ~Ernest Hemingway

 
Reply With Quote
Old 09-29-2012, 12:18 AM   #4
david_42
 
david_42's Avatar
Recipes 
 
Oct 2005
Willamina & Oak Grove, Oregon, USA
Posts: 25,593
Liked 151 Times on 142 Posts


I'd say this batch is plain, old juice. It really bites when you get told one thing and the producer is doing something else.
__________________
Remember one unassailable statistic, as explained by the late, great George Carlin: "Just think of how stupid the average person is, and then realize half of them are even stupider!"

"I would like to die on Mars, just not on impact." Elon Musk

 
Reply With Quote
Old 09-29-2012, 03:14 AM   #5
jamesnsw
Recipes 
 
Mar 2009
, Indiana
Posts: 843
Liked 10 Times on 4 Posts


I'm thinking I may make a big old yeast starter with fresh, untreated juice, and dump that in. Maybe that will help. It can't really hurt, right?
__________________
Some stuff I've made: Odell's 90 Shilling Clone, Abbey Weiss Pottsville Common, Simple Mead, Dry Dock Apricot Blonde Clone, Rye IPA, Maibock, Scrapper's Quaffable Irish Red, Short Sleep Blueberry Ale, Lazy Magnolia Pecan Nut Brown Ale Clone, Graff, Apfelwein, Cascades Orange Pale, Orfy's Mild Ale, Vagabond Gingered Ale
What to Brew for iOS (free)

 
Reply With Quote
Old 09-29-2012, 03:25 AM   #6
sonofgrok
n00basaurus
HBT_LIFETIMESUPPORTER.png
 
sonofgrok's Avatar
Recipes 
 
Sep 2012
Waco, TX
Posts: 1,145
Liked 313 Times on 223 Posts


I was doing some reading up after this (I am a biology nerd) and the benzoate can actually even destroy mitochondrial DNA (tested in yeast none the less). The only way I see it working is if you manage to dilute the concentration below some critical point. It can't hurt but I also think it can't really help. This is all aside from the fact that benzoate can be highly toxic to human cells as well (i.e. the ones inside you when you drink it) Its being phased out heavily across the board do to health concerns.
__________________
"Always do sober what you said you'd do drunk. That will teach you to keep your mouth shut." ~Ernest Hemingway

 
Reply With Quote
Old 09-29-2012, 01:05 PM   #7
jamesnsw
Recipes 
 
Mar 2009
, Indiana
Posts: 843
Liked 10 Times on 4 Posts


Quote:
Originally Posted by sonofgrok View Post
I was doing some reading up after this (I am a biology nerd) and the benzoate can actually even destroy mitochondrial DNA (tested in yeast none the less). The only way I see it working is if you manage to dilute the concentration below some critical point. It can't hurt but I also think it can't really help. This is all aside from the fact that benzoate can be highly toxic to human cells as well (i.e. the ones inside you when you drink it) Its being phased out heavily across the board do to health concerns.
Well... I guess I'll believe the biology nerd. I'll go find a handle or so of bourbon or whiskey, and keg it up. Not ideal, but not a lost cause.
__________________
Some stuff I've made: Odell's 90 Shilling Clone, Abbey Weiss Pottsville Common, Simple Mead, Dry Dock Apricot Blonde Clone, Rye IPA, Maibock, Scrapper's Quaffable Irish Red, Short Sleep Blueberry Ale, Lazy Magnolia Pecan Nut Brown Ale Clone, Graff, Apfelwein, Cascades Orange Pale, Orfy's Mild Ale, Vagabond Gingered Ale
What to Brew for iOS (free)

 
Reply With Quote
Old 09-29-2012, 09:13 PM   #8
MoonDawg
Recipes 
 
Aug 2012
Mt. Vernon, Il.
Posts: 25
Liked 2 Times on 2 Posts


James, sorry man- you got double-crossed by the orchard! However, READ MY LIPS; YOU WILL NOT SALVAGE THAT GRAFF!!!!!!! You will only sink more cash into a batch that is invariably DOOMED. Your only way out is to use it as cloudy yeasty apple juice, or as the other guy suggested-add some distilled liquor and keg it up.(Actually, in the long run that idea sounds very tasty and inebriating.) In the future my suggestion would be ( Note that i brew Hard Cider exclusively.) purchasing a few QUALITY gallons of crystal-clear super-market apple juice- The only ingredients other than juice, juice concentrate and purified water should be Ascorbic Acid (Vitamin C). Ascorbic Acid is technically considered a yeast nutrient and will enhance fermentation.

 
Reply With Quote
Old 09-30-2012, 01:44 PM   #9
jamesnsw
Recipes 
 
Mar 2009
, Indiana
Posts: 843
Liked 10 Times on 4 Posts


Thanks, Moondawg. I poured in a handle of rum and a few hundred mL of Everclear. Should have gone stronger... it still tastes like juice.

Gotta say though... I never would have bottled this... I love kegging!
__________________
Some stuff I've made: Odell's 90 Shilling Clone, Abbey Weiss Pottsville Common, Simple Mead, Dry Dock Apricot Blonde Clone, Rye IPA, Maibock, Scrapper's Quaffable Irish Red, Short Sleep Blueberry Ale, Lazy Magnolia Pecan Nut Brown Ale Clone, Graff, Apfelwein, Cascades Orange Pale, Orfy's Mild Ale, Vagabond Gingered Ale
What to Brew for iOS (free)

 
Reply With Quote


Reply
Thread Tools


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Any hope of replicating Magner's Cider? Wildbill001 Cider Forum 3 01-13-2014 02:20 PM
Cider-Yeast Starter Question - How much cider/volume? brewinginct Cider Forum 11 10-25-2013 05:25 AM
I hope my cider will be ok Fixmy59bug Cider Forum 8 12-06-2011 02:14 AM
1 week later... is there still hope for my cider? JasonOdd Cider Forum 25 09-06-2011 03:31 PM
Turbo Cider,drinkable this time i hope. ipbr21054 Cider Forum 14 03-01-2009 08:41 PM


Forum Jump