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Old 09-19-2012, 12:21 PM   #31
ajdelange
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The Scottish Centre's comment about following GAC by ion exchange is interesting. At pH 9 72% of the ammonia appears as ammonium ion (NH4+), at pH 8 that's 96% and at pH 7 and below more than 99.6%. In the brewing context ammonium is a benefit as it is a yeast nutrient. Most of the yeast supplements one buys contain diammonium phosphate for this reason. If you are using the water for dialysis or fish that ammonium probably isn't so great though most aquaria are equipped with ammonium removing filters as fish poop contains a fair amount of it (urea). Ammonium ion is produced when Campden tablets are used too.

 
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Old 09-19-2012, 01:13 PM   #32
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I am sorry that so many users on forums like this hide behind anonymous avatars and then disparage the advice of people that have enough confidence in their advice to actually sign their name with it. I strongly recommend that anyone using any forum take any advice with a grain of salt if the poster isn't willing to stake their name and reputation behind it. I fully trust the advice that AJ deLange provides (but I don't always agree with it! ;-) ).

An important point for this thread is that boiling to remove chloramines is not very suitable as a treatment option given the slow progress and energy usage. It pales in comparison with the relatively simplistic treatment via metabisulfite addition (Campden tablet).
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Old 09-19-2012, 01:21 PM   #33
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iambeer got me thinking.

Based on reading AJs paper, maybe to save the 1.5 cents for half a Campden tablet, one could instead store 15 gallons of water in an open topped barrel for a month or two, stirring twice a day. After 60 days of moderate agitation, hopefully a fair amount of the chloramine will be gone.

If you store it outdoors, mosquitos will lay their eggs in it. So store it indoors and just carry the 10 gallons outside when ready to use it. If 60 days isn't enough, try 90-120 days.

At least you save the 1.5 cents for half a Campden tablet.

 
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Old 09-19-2012, 01:32 PM   #34
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Quote:
Originally Posted by iambeer View Post
I was very clear that I was only suggesting that there are many sources (more recent, authoritative sources) that claim chloramine can be removed in minutes. But look at these responses. It's as if I shot their mommas! Hilarious.
It's not hilarious at all. You make disparaging remarks about noted brewing water chemistry experts, and say things that aren't true. You just look like a total ass, with a penchant for trolling. If people are laughing, they are laughing AT you, not with you.

Water chemistry is an important part of brewing, but like so many things in brewing, if the brewer is happy with the results of his attempts then the area of water chemistry is ignored. That doesn't make it unimportant as a topic, it's just unimportant to the brewer. There are plenty of brewers who brew "good enough" beer.

Discussing appropriate chloramine removal techniques for those who want to do it is important, so espousing senseless made-up "facts" will be challenged.
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Old 09-19-2012, 02:22 PM   #35
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Quote:
Originally Posted by iambeer View Post
I was very clear that I was only suggesting that there are many sources (more recent, authoritative sources) that claim chloramine can be removed in minutes. But look at these responses. It's as if I shot their mommas! Hilarious.
Go buy a chloramine test kit. Do your method. Test. Post results.

If you want to be taken seriously, take your science seriously.

Until then, the standard treatment for chloramine is Campden tabs.
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Old 09-19-2012, 02:30 PM   #36
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For what it's worth, I use vitamin C to treat my water instead of campden tablets. I purchased a big bottle of powdered vitamin C (probably a lifetime supply) for a couple bucks online.

 
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Old 09-19-2012, 02:51 PM   #37
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Quote:
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For what it's worth, I use vitamin C to treat my water instead of campden tablets. I purchased a big bottle of powdered vitamin C (probably a lifetime supply) for a couple bucks online.
How much do you use? I have some of this from Puritan's pride but wasn't sure on the dosage.

 
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Old 09-19-2012, 05:15 PM   #38
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RCCOLA View Post
How much do you use? I have some of this from Puritan's pride but wasn't sure on the dosage.
16mg per gallon of water for typical water treatment concentrations. The half-life for the reaction is about 4 minutes, so what I do is add the vitamin c as I start filling up the pot and heating it for dough-in. By the time I get to my strike temp it's usually been long enough for the reaction to have removed the bulk of the chlorine/chloramine.

 
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Old 09-19-2012, 05:40 PM   #39
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Thanks Martin and AJ (and others) for continuing to help us understand water issues relating to homebrewing. It's making my beer better, it's not as hard as it initially sounds (thanks to your explainations and calculators), it's cheap, it works, and it is science not voodoo.

Cheers.

 
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Old 09-19-2012, 06:00 PM   #40
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Quote:
Originally Posted by weirdboy View Post
16mg per gallon of water for typical water treatment concentrations.
Is that correct? That's .08 gram per 5 gallons. That is a tiny amount.

 
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