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Old 02-27-2013, 05:38 AM   #81
Brewitt
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This is an interesting discussion. I hope you dont mind a short hijack of the thread but I have some sour questions I have been trying to getting answers too. I don't know any sour brewers (well, I might know some sour brewers but none who brew sours). I am trying to figure out when is the right time to bottle and how much carbonation it should have. I have a sour going since August of last year. It started as a dilution of a strong dark ale wort fermented about half with a belgian ale yeast and then I added dregs from two bottles of lambic and a flemish red. I let that go for a month or two and then added 6 lbs of lightly crushed grapes off my vines to two gallons. I tasted it at about 3 and now at 6 mos. The first time it was nice and sour, good fruit and complex but had a lot of fusel alcohol taste at the end (at least I think that's what it was). At 6 mos most of that was gone and the brett flavors were developing. The sourness is still up front but blending with the complex fruit and other flavors. So, with that, how would you decide when to bottle?


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Old 02-28-2013, 11:09 AM   #82
joshrosborne
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I would probably go with a combo of gravity and flavor. If the gravity is very, very near 1.00 and you're happy with the flavor, I don't see why you shouldn't be able to bottle. Just be careful with the gravity, because the Brett will keep munching until there's about no sugars left, which can lead to exploding bottles if you bottle too early.



 
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Old 03-05-2013, 04:24 AM   #83
Zippox
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Logistics question here. I have 5 gallons of this in a bucket and I have yet to transfer it to a glass carboy. The plan is to lift the lid a little bit, add some tubing to the buckets spigot and turn it on. I have been planning on reusing the yeast cake at the bottom but I wonder what I should do if there is a hard pellicle? Do I just pour the new wort on top of it and shake it all up as I would a normal batch of beer?

 
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Old 03-15-2013, 07:11 PM   #84
HarkinBanks
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Read the thread and I didn't see it answered, perhaps I missed it.

To the OP, did you bottle without any priming sugar and just use some of the natural stirred up yeast to let it carb up? Or did you add priming sugar?

 
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Old 03-18-2013, 12:21 PM   #85
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HarkinBanks View Post
To the OP, did you bottle without any priming sugar and just use some of the natural stirred up yeast to let it carb up? Or did you add priming sugar?
I usually don't add extra yeast, but it is cheap insurance. And yes, you always add priming sugar.
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Old 03-18-2013, 05:09 PM   #86
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AmandaK

I usually don't add extra yeast, but it is cheap insurance. And yes, you always add priming sugar.
The guy who asked the question brings up a good point, Lambic producers never use priming sugar, but Americans are stuck on the idea. Cantilllon, for example, bottles with no sugar or yeast and let the bottles sit for six months in vaults. The yeast continues to work, providing carbonation. That's why guezes, containing some young lambic, are traditionally much more carbonated then straight lambics, which are typically older vintages with less residual sugar. thus, the BJCP guidelines

I do think for a straight lambic like this, I would use priming sugar. When I get to a gueze, however, I'll keep tradition and skip it.
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Old 03-18-2013, 05:14 PM   #87
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bellmtbbq View Post
When I get to a gueze, however, I'll keep tradition and skip it.
I tried that with my gueuze. It's still uncarbonated after 3 months in the bottle. Can't say I would do that again.
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Old 03-18-2013, 07:08 PM   #88
ocluke
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bellmtbbq View Post
The guy who asked the question brings up a good point, Lambic producers never use priming sugar, but Americans are stuck on the idea. Cantilllon, for example, bottles with no sugar or yeast and let the bottles sit for six months in vaults. The yeast continues to work, providing carbonation. That's why guezes, containing some young lambic, are traditionally much more carbonated then straight lambics, which are typically older vintages with less residual sugar. thus, the BJCP guidelines

I do think for a straight lambic like this, I would use priming sugar. When I get to a gueze, however, I'll keep tradition and skip it.
If you produce a lot of the exact same wort and have a resident microflora that you can count on to always attenuate your wort to the same gravity each and every time, this would be a fun way to bottle in the traditional method. However, for many homebrewers each batch is slightly (or a lot) different than the previous due to equipment changes, process variations or recipe tweaking. This makes it difficult to know exactly where the terminal gravity might end up, which would cause a lot of variation in carbonation levels after bottling, with some batches producing still pLambic and others producing bottle bombs. That's a bit of a risk for something you waited over a year to bottle.
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Old 03-18-2013, 09:07 PM   #89
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ocluke

If you produce a lot of the exact same wort and have a resident microflora that you can count on to always attenuate your wort to the same gravity each and every time, this would be a fun way to bottle in the traditional method. However, for many homebrewers each batch is slightly (or a lot) different than the previous due to equipment changes, process variations or recipe tweaking. This makes it difficult to know exactly where the terminal gravity might end up, which would cause a lot of variation in carbonation levels after bottling, with some batches producing still pLambic and others producing bottle bombs. That's a bit of a risk for something you waited over a year to bottle.
Yea, Im going to brew the same grain bill three times, use my house culture, etc. then it's just math to figure bout how many points of gravity you need
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Old 03-19-2013, 01:11 AM   #90
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Zippox View Post
Logistics question here. I have 5 gallons of this in a bucket and I have yet to transfer it to a glass carboy. The plan is to lift the lid a little bit, add some tubing to the buckets spigot and turn it on. I have been planning on reusing the yeast cake at the bottom but I wonder what I should do if there is a hard pellicle? Do I just pour the new wort on top of it and shake it all up as I would a normal batch of beer?
Sorry to quote myself but would anyone be able to help me decide a best option? I'll be brewing the second 5 gallons tomorrow.



 
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