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Old 03-12-2012, 04:00 AM   #11
jusware
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I'm interested to hear your opinion on these. I noticed you're not using any Lacto or Pedio. I've tried using Acid Malt previously, and after waiting 6 months I was annoyed that I didn't add lacto. Have you heard of the "Nuevo Sour" method? I read about it awhile back. Take 1 gal of the initial wort and add pedio and lacto only. Keep the temps hot (80 -110F) for approx a week, or longer depending on how sour you want it and then pastuerize it and add it back to the rest of the batch. It won't have the complexity of an extended pedio/lacto ferment, but is better than just using acid malt. Im planning on trying it on an upcoming "Oud Bruin".

 
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Old 03-12-2012, 10:54 AM   #12
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Well these beers are good, if you've had the opportunity to taste an Ithaca sour it's a similar profile. However the sour saison I did with pedio/lacto has a much stronger acid presence. These beers have a sourness for sure but it's a different sourness. I basically wanted to just give this method a shot, and it doesn't suck, but I probably won't do it a second time. I'll leave final judgement for a cooled and carbonated version. While it's good I don't think it's the way to get anywhere close to what I wanted.
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Old 03-13-2012, 06:26 PM   #13
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I did a sour cherry saison last year. There was a saison yeast that had Brett in it, but I cant remember the name or number for it. I let it sit on cherries for 2 months. It came out alright, not a real strong cherry flavor, but it did have a nice, sour flavor to it.

 
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Old 03-19-2012, 06:13 PM   #14
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Well after a month the ECY03 portion has dropped clear. The Dupont is still slowly going. I poured a healthy dose of my yeast mercenary, the dreaded and feared by all sugars, WY3711. I hope to bottle this next week sometime.
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Old 03-30-2012, 06:15 PM   #15
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I bottled this yesterday. I decided to blend it together. The dupont portion had a great yeast flavor that the ECY03 half slightly lacked. So I bottled up a 9L bottle, a 3L bottle, 1.5cases of 750s, case of grolsch, and a hand full of mixed bottles. I'll try one in a week or two to see how it tastes carbonated and chilled. I was happy with the initial results though.
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Old 03-31-2012, 04:02 PM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jusware View Post
I'm interested to hear your opinion on these. I noticed you're not using any Lacto or Pedio. I've tried using Acid Malt previously, and after waiting 6 months I was annoyed that I didn't add lacto. Have you heard of the "Nuevo Sour" method? I read about it awhile back. Take 1 gal of the initial wort and add pedio and lacto only. Keep the temps hot (80 -110F) for approx a week, or longer depending on how sour you want it and then pastuerize it and add it back to the rest of the batch. It won't have the complexity of an extended pedio/lacto ferment, but is better than just using acid malt. Im planning on trying it on an upcoming "Oud Bruin".
I don't think pedio will work that fast, even at those temperatures. Maybe pitching a whole smack pack or vial in a gallon will get it moving faster but I seem to recall reading pedio is slow at fermentation. In that case you are most likely getting lacto fermenting all the sugars.

 
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Old 03-31-2012, 05:50 PM   #17
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I think pedio has the reputation of being slow because it doesn't get the "choice" sugars to ferment since the saccharomyces, and lactobacillus are faster to act. If you just fed pedio straight up glucose I'm sure it'd go plenty fast. Plus I think the reason it's "slow" as a fermentor is because it can withstand the lower pH environment along with the brett. So in the end the two are working on concert because not much else is living in the beer and if it is it cannot really ferment what's left that the pedio and brett metabolize.

Whether or not it can go fast I think that you'd need to do much more than a gallon to sour a whole batch.
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Old 04-01-2012, 11:09 PM   #18
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smokinghole (love then name by the way), is correct. When pitched with Sacc, Lacto and Pedio won't start fermenting until after the sacc is nearing completion. Without Sacc, Lacto and Pedio will go nutz, especially when you ramp them up closer to their ideal temp of 110F. if I recall properly, the method was published by Michael T (the mad fermentationist) in BYO a few months back. I'll post the issue/page if this wasnt one of issues that my kids dropped in the crapper (-: They like looking at the pictures ..

 
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Old 04-02-2012, 01:07 AM   #19
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Mike T = Mad Ferm..... = Oldsock. He is around here somewhere. maybe he will chime in.

 
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Old 04-02-2012, 12:15 PM   #20
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You can look to Santification as an example of a soured beer that I think is supposed to be a 2-3 month turn around. It's lacto and pedio soured and fermented with brett. I don't know if they're pitched at different times but I do know there's no saccharomyces in there.
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