Coldbreak Brewing Giveaway - Open to All!

Home Brew Forums > Home Brewing Beer > Lambic & Wild Brewing > Pitchin' Dregs from Jolly Pumpkin
Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old 06-15-2011, 01:18 AM   #1
mydementia
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Apr 2011
Location: Westminster, CO
Posts: 17
Likes Given: 1

Default Pitchin' Dregs from Jolly Pumpkin

Hi guys.
I made my attempt at the CYBI Bam Biere clone recipe a few weeks ago and have had some interesting results.
First of all, I scaled up the recipe for a 10 gallon boil that would yield about 8 gallons of wort. I racked 5.25 gallons to a carboy and pitched a fresh tube of WLP550 and the remaining 2.5 gallons over to a small carboy and pitched 2x Bam Biere dregs and 1x ESBam dregs...

Day 2, the dregs carboy took off - krausen looked good... all was on track. When I tasted it after a week, it was already getting sour... thought it was strange, but verified that the pH was actually 0.5 point lower than the WLP550 batch. After the second week (yesterday) it is VERY sour... bordering on unpleasant... both are at TG... yielded about 3.5% ABV (was going for a session beer, after all).

What's going on in the dregs beer? Obviously some lactic acid bacteria has taken strong hold... but I haven't read about anything that sours that quickly... I intend to blend the two and bottle... but I don't want any gushers!!

Thanks!
Mike


mydementia is offline
 
Reply With Quote
Old 06-15-2011, 02:31 AM   #2
Prionburger
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Posts: 181
Liked 1 Times on 1 Posts

Default

Funny, I started a 10 gallon batch of the CYBI Bam Biere recipe 3 days ago. I'm growing up some dregs from a Calabaza Blanca and Madrugada Obscura (my favorite!) to throw in the secondary. WLP550 is fermenting the wort right now.

I think to avoid gushers, you'll want the blended beer to sit for a while. I'm not sure how long though. From the CYBI show it sounded like Bam Biere is rather fast for a sour beer.


Prionburger is offline
 
Reply With Quote
Old 06-15-2011, 02:34 AM   #3
Revvy
Post Hoc Ergo Propter Hoc
HBT_LIFETIMESUPPORTER.png
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
 
Revvy's Avatar
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: "Detroitish" Michigan
Posts: 40,812
Liked 2867 Times on 1696 Posts
Likes Given: 3510

Default

You'll find the info you need in the Similar threads box below. Note the first thread.

__________________
Like my snazzy new avatar? Get Sons of Zymurgy swag, here, and brew with the best.

Revvy's one of the cool reverends. He has a Harley and a t-shirt that says on the back "If you can read this, the bitch was Raptured. - Madman

I gotta tell ya, just between us girls, that Revvy is HOT. Very tall, gorgeous grey hair and a terrific smile. He's very good looking in person, with a charismatic personality... he drives like a ****ing maniac! - YooperBrew
Revvy is offline
 
Reply With Quote
Old 06-15-2011, 03:18 AM   #4
mydementia
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Apr 2011
Location: Westminster, CO
Posts: 17
Likes Given: 1

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Revvy View Post
You'll find the info you need in the Similar threads box below. Note the first thread.

Those posts were certainly interesting, but all discussed not getting discernible sourness for a few months... and the first post is about mold??? Definitely no mold going on here... and it's WAY sour after 2 weeks fermenting...

Prion - the hardest part is going to be figuring out the right ratio! Might rack off 4 gallons of the straight beer into a 6.5 gallon bucket and add 1/4 gal at a time until I like it... we'll see... I still need to add the oak and dry hops!!!

Thanks for the replies!
Mike
mydementia is offline
 
Reply With Quote
Old 06-15-2011, 05:22 AM   #5
Prionburger
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Posts: 181
Liked 1 Times on 1 Posts

Default

JP beers start out pretty mild, if you try a young one. I think they just increase in sourness over time until they reach an end point. One Calabaza Blanca I had was almost not sour at all.

Maybe it would be best to inoculate your un-soured beer with the sour one, and wait a month or so for the gravity to drop to a safe level so you can bottle without worry about gushers.

I don't have any experience with brewing sour beers, as a disclaimer. I'm only starting.
Prionburger is offline
 
Reply With Quote
Old 06-15-2011, 11:54 AM   #6
smokinghole
Senior Member
HBT_LIFETIMESUPPORTER.png
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
 
smokinghole's Avatar
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Lucid Dream Land
Posts: 2,917
Liked 124 Times on 102 Posts
Likes Given: 12

Default

It's my understanding that a reason why your beer is so sour is because JP doesn't ferment with the bacteria in primary. They only do that in barrels and in the bottles. So that way the lactic sour twang isn't overwhelming like you seem to have ran into. What's the pH of the sour portion right now?

Next time I would add the microbes at the middle/end of fermentation. The Lactobacillus and Pediococcus (if JP uses it) will ferment all available glucose they can get their grubby little cell membranes on. That all leads to increased acidity. One of the reasons metabolically many people add bacteria to already fermented beer is to control the acidity. The reason the bacteria can still ferment sugars into acid at that point is the b-glucosidase that the brett produces. The b-glucosidase liberates glucose and makes it available for itself and the bacteria (I assume it's a sort of symbiosis). I could be wrong but this is my understanding of the process, I don't want to come off like an expert that is infallible.

I know that RR Santification is fermented with pedio, brett, and lacto all in the beginning.
__________________
Going through life is hard.
Going through life stupid is harder.
smokinghole is offline
pkalder Likes This 
Reply With Quote
Old 06-15-2011, 10:08 PM   #7
jtejedor
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: Las Vegas
Posts: 653
Liked 10 Times on 9 Posts
Likes Given: 6

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Prionburger View Post
JP beers start out pretty mild, if you try a young one. I think they just increase in sourness over time until they reach an end point. One Calabaza Blanca I had was almost not sour at all.

Maybe it would be best to inoculate your un-soured beer with the sour one, and wait a month or so for the gravity to drop to a safe level so you can bottle without worry about gushers.

I don't have any experience with brewing sour beers, as a disclaimer. I'm only starting.
I just had a calabaza blanca and it was not sour at all. Not one bit. The date on the bottle was 1/13/11 so not super fresh. I thought maybe I had just gotten one of the beers they make without bugs.
jtejedor is offline
 
Reply With Quote
Old 06-16-2011, 01:59 AM   #8
phished880
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: JP/Boston
Posts: 306
Liked 6 Times on 6 Posts
Likes Given: 2

Default

I've got a bottle of La Roja from Nov 07 in my cellar, will these bugs still be effective?
phished880 is offline
 
Reply With Quote
Old 06-16-2011, 02:11 AM   #9
smokinghole
Senior Member
HBT_LIFETIMESUPPORTER.png
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
 
smokinghole's Avatar
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Lucid Dream Land
Posts: 2,917
Liked 124 Times on 102 Posts
Likes Given: 12

Default

Only one way to tell.
__________________
Going through life is hard.
Going through life stupid is harder.
smokinghole is offline
 
Reply With Quote
Old 06-16-2011, 07:14 PM   #10
Prionburger
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Posts: 181
Liked 1 Times on 1 Posts

Default

jtejedor: That bottle is actually pretty fresh by JP standards. It must have been kept refrigerated for that time. I had one from that same batch just a couple weeks ago, and it developed a pretty nice sourness and funk from being stored at room temperature.


Prionburger is offline
 
Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Developing a unique house yeast using Open Fermentation, ala Jolly Pumpkin brewmonger Lambic & Wild Brewing 9 04-11-2012 08:46 PM
What is this on top of my Jolly Pumpkin dregs? Pics elproducto Lambic & Wild Brewing 10 06-10-2011 03:58 PM
What To Do With My Jolly Pumkin Dregs devildancer Lambic & Wild Brewing 12 05-17-2011 02:48 PM
Culturing Dregs from Jolly Pumpkin Bsquared Lambic & Wild Brewing 15 04-27-2011 03:37 PM
Jolly Pumpkin La Roja 1234 Lambic & Wild Brewing 18 01-30-2011 08:48 PM


Forum Jump

Newest Threads

LATEST SPONSOR DEALS