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Old 03-09-2011, 05:59 AM   #1
J-Malone
 
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I just want to know the difference between the two orifices. Can I drill a LP orifice and make it high pressure? Or is it the other way? I am build a stand and I am at the gas manifold stage as you might have guessed. Any help us greatly appreciated ...
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Old 03-09-2011, 02:12 PM   #2
ajwillys
 
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I don't think its either. The regulator determines the pressure. Some stoves are able to switch between low pressure LP and low pressure NG by changing out the orifice. In that case, NG is bigger.

There are a few stoves that people have mentioned can be low or high pressure (such as the hurricane) but I haven't seen anyone actually verify that. They just "look" alike. Let me see if I can find an example.

EDIT: Here you go

High Pressure:
http://www.alliedkenco.com/catalog/p...oducts_id/2390

Low Pressure:
http://www.williamsbrewing.com/HURRI...AND-P2677.aspx

If you ask me, these look like the same burners but are being sold differently. Also, the high pressure says 155K BTU and the low says 60K BTU

 
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Old 03-09-2011, 03:00 PM   #3
J-Malone
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ajwillys View Post
I don't think its either. The regulator determines the pressure. Some stoves are able to switch between low pressure LP and low pressure NG by changing out the orifice. In that case, NG is bigger.

There are a few stoves that people have mentioned can be low or high pressure (such as the hurricane) but I haven't seen anyone actually verify that. They just "look" alike. Let me see if I can find an example.

EDIT: Here you go

High Pressure:
http://www.alliedkenco.com/catalog/p...oducts_id/2390

Low Pressure:
http://www.williamsbrewing.com/HURRI...AND-P2677.aspx

If you ask me, these look like the same burners but are being sold differently. Also, the high pressure says 155K BTU and the low says 60K BTU
That is interesting...I was under the impression that you could make banjo, hurricanes, or the 6" Bayou classics into either Hi or low pressure by just changing the orifice and making sure you were providing enough pressure through the regulator?

I am using the 6" BG12 which I got from Agrisupply in the low pressure version. I had a 0-10 psi regulator on hand and when I went to fire them up last night, I couldnt get more than a tiny blue flame from each little hole, no matter how high I turned the regulator or the gate valve...

I was thinking about getting the Hi pressure orifice and upgrading to a 0-30 psi regulator, or would the 0-10 work better with the hi presssure?

I know it seems counter intuitive but I was thinking that HP needed lower regulator pressure (10-15) and that Low pressure needed the 30 or so psi? Am I wrong?

Definitely need clarification..

thanks
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Cold Desert Brewing Company

On Tap: Berlinner Weiss (still...lol), Dickson County Pale, Evil Twin Clone (Hoppy Amber)

Fermenting: McFearless IPA (Apollo/Summit Hop Monster!)

Cold Conditioning: English Pale Ale (Yorkshire Square yeast)

In the queue: Munich Helles, Standard American Lager (My Fizzy, yella beer try), APA (10g split batch using diff yeast), ABA (Hoppy 7-8%, Imperial Janets Brown??? maybe), Saison (using WLP670 American Farmhouse), Terrapin Hop Karma Brown IPA Clone

 
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Old 03-09-2011, 03:07 PM   #4
GilaMinumBeer
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The orifice opening is larger for the low pressure gas to allow the proper flowput since the psi is normally around 3 to 6.

For LP, the pressure in the tank is in the range of hundreds of PSI and is reduced to 10 to 30 and then forced through a smaller orifice at a higher velocity to improve gas to air mixture.

 
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Old 03-09-2011, 03:19 PM   #5
J-Malone
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GilaMinumBeer View Post
The orifice opening is larger for the low pressure gas to allow the proper flowput since the psi is normally around 3 to 6.

For LP, the pressure in the tank is in the range of hundreds of PSI and is reduced to 10 to 30 and then forced through a smaller orifice at a higher velocity to improve gas to air mixture.
Thanks. But I still would like to know if I should go with a higher psi regulator for the low pressure to get the flames going or is there another issue?

My setup is pretty simple

tank-->10psi reg-->1/2" black iron pipe-->tee-->gas ball valve-->gate valve-->Low pressure orifice-->BG12 burner

I open the ball valve, open the gate up and turn psi all the way up, I can hear the pressure increase from the tank but it doesnt seem to affect the flame.

I will take a video tonight to show the flame I am getting, it is just what you'd get as you are lighting it w/o much pressure at all and it will not get larger or more intense. Just little blue bubbles on top of the burner holes.
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Cold Desert Brewing Company

On Tap: Berlinner Weiss (still...lol), Dickson County Pale, Evil Twin Clone (Hoppy Amber)

Fermenting: McFearless IPA (Apollo/Summit Hop Monster!)

Cold Conditioning: English Pale Ale (Yorkshire Square yeast)

In the queue: Munich Helles, Standard American Lager (My Fizzy, yella beer try), APA (10g split batch using diff yeast), ABA (Hoppy 7-8%, Imperial Janets Brown??? maybe), Saison (using WLP670 American Farmhouse), Terrapin Hop Karma Brown IPA Clone

 
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Old 03-10-2011, 01:26 AM   #6
joeybeer
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I am working on this problem right now too ! I have a meeting at 8am with our local propane tech .. I'm using two burners that are each 3x7 inch rectangles with similar holes as the pics you posted... So far I've tried low pressure (.5psi) and it looked like a candle flame, and 15psi which made a good noise and shot 12" flames, but they were mostly yellow and made a ton of soot, which makes me think the whole thing is running too rich and needs a smaller orifice -- I'll let you know in the AM !
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Old 03-10-2011, 01:52 AM   #7
kladue
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The gas jet size is based on pressure and Btu's of gas delivered to burner. Higher the pressure the smaller the opening to maintain needed gas flow. Also the higher the pressure the faster the gas exits from the opening and more air gets drawn in to mix and make larger flames. When you reduce the pressure the flow slows down and the air is reduced along with total burner output. You can increase the gas jet opening size but there is a limit on how much air it can pull in to mix. Usually the burner output is cut by half when pressure is reduced from 10 Psi to .5 Psi because of lower air flow into burner. For the typical 6" burner on .5 Psi LP the jet needs to be 1/16", for the 10" burner 5/64"-3/32" works well. If going to even lower pressure NG the 10" burner is probably the smallest you want to go with either the NG valve adapter or a 3/32"-1/8" opening in the gas jet.

 
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Old 03-10-2011, 03:12 AM   #8
joeybeer
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Thanks kladue ! That's the most exact answer I've gotten so far ! any idea what should I shoot for as an orifice size with a 15psi reg ??

 
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Old 03-10-2011, 03:20 AM   #9
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Here is a pic of a high pressure propane and and Natural gas orifice side by side, hope this helps.



Natural gas is on the right.

 
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Old 03-10-2011, 03:42 AM   #10
kladue
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Here is a high pressure orifice chart http://www.joppaglass.com/burner/highp_chart.html. Based on the description of 3" X 7" burner probably a good idea to start with a #62 bit and get larger after testing for clean flame with air shutter 90% open. Best thing would be to buy an orifice fitting for the 6" burner or one of the 4" burners to start, then drill larger openings if air shutter is 50% or less open to get clean flame.

 
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