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Old 05-14-2013, 07:59 PM   #261
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Originally Posted by wobdee
I brewed 2 different 2.5 gal batches last week and both were FO only hop stands of 30 minutes.

One batch was a 1.060 Red Ale with 3oz Centennial thrown in at 190 degrees, stirred/whirpool every 5 min then cooled down to yeast pitching temps in 15 min. Temp dropped down to 175 after 30 min but I kept the lid on hoping to keep flavors in.

The other was a 1.058 Pale Ale with A 190 FO addition of 2oz Citra for 30 min. I also plan on dry hopping this brew with another oz.

I'm quite curious to see how these turn out, especially if they have enough bitterness, will ley you know in a few weeks.
Just tapped the Red and have to say I'm pretty impressed. The beer turned out well balanced with a great hop aroma.

I really didn't think the aroma would be there this strong without dry hopping but it is.

Hop flavor is also great but well balanced with a little darker malts.

Bitterness is just about right for me, no lasting sting on the back of the tongue, just a smooth bitterness that blends well with the flavor. If I had to guess IBU's I'd say somewhere between 30-40 IBU.


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Old 05-15-2013, 02:20 PM   #262
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Very interesting thread, thanks to all who have shared their experiences.

What sort of cold breaks have people being experiencing with these techniques? It seems many are letting the temperature drop gradually during the hop stand. Has anyone seen any noticeable or comparable affect on clarity?

Assuming the cold break will start occurring at about 60C (or 140F, whether that's a safe assumption or not, I'm not too sure) then provided you chill quickly past this point then the cold break should come as it usually would? Or not?


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Old 05-17-2013, 11:37 PM   #263
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skunk27, I believe that there would be no difference, if you chill quickly or no chill.

I am a no chiller. I did a hop stand, but I also consider it the same as a whirlpool, time wise, whether the wort is swirling or not.

Cold break settles at some point. I siphon off the clear wort out of my cubes to ferment.
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Old 12-07-2013, 09:50 PM   #264
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This is a great thread. Just wondering if anyone has been using this method without dryhopping and what the results are compared to late boil additions (15, 10, 5, 0 minute). I mostly brew APAs but I don't often dry hop. Seems to me that massively dryhopping along with a hop stand would make it tough to determine how effective the method is at adding flavor/aroma.
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Old 12-08-2013, 09:20 PM   #265
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Quote:
Originally Posted by thisjrp4 View Post
This is a great thread. Just wondering if anyone has been using this method without dryhopping and what the results are compared to late boil additions (15, 10, 5, 0 minute). I mostly brew APAs but I don't often dry hop. Seems to me that massively dryhopping along with a hop stand would make it tough to determine how effective the method is at adding flavor/aroma.

Don't know if your referencing particular posts, but dry-hopping and flame-out additions will never taste exactly the same.

-You would have to take into consideration that delicate hop oils boil off at temperatures well below flame-out temps. And that not all hops contains similar amounts of the various essential oils, Myrcene in particular.

-You would have to consider that fermentation activity drives off
the delicate hydrophobic oils and that adding them to the boil would expose them to this fermentation activity when compared to dry hopping late in the fermentation cycle.

-In addition to fermentation activity driving off hop oils, they will also bind to proteins and yeast cell walls and settle out in the ferementer. This can be overcome by adding more hops though, but something to consider when making comparisons to dry hopping.
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Old 12-08-2013, 11:35 PM   #266
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Originally Posted by markg388
Alright, so now that they're carbed up and conditioned the side by side test was done today. I also had my friend taste them without knowing which one was which.

The recipe, it's pretty out of season.
10# pilsner
8# gambrinus "esb" malt
1# carafoam
.5# honey malt
mash @ 154
90 minute boil

.8oz magnum @12.5%

When it was chilling time i split the beer into 2 pots and added .7oz saphir to each, immediately chilling the first 5 gallons and letting the other 5 sit there while the first batch chilled. Each bucket received a re-hydrated pack of S-05. The OG was 1.042 and I didn't measure the FG.

The verdict? Steeping the hops for 20 or so minutes before chilling will get more aroma and flavor out of them. All the hops were pellets.

The one that was chilled instantly doesn't really have any hop qualities at all, maybe a tiny "green" or "plant" flavor if you search for it. Pretty much a waste of hops, it mostly has a mild candy-like sweetness with a bit of malt flavor, but overall it's quite a low-flavor chuggable beer. I'd probably like it more if it was hot outside.

The one that was steeped has a modest, bright hop essence that mixes nicely with that sweetness. You can actually smell a bit of hops in it and taste them too. It's still a real mild, chuggable low-flavor beer, but there's more going on than in the other one. I think the steeped beer has a teensy bit more bitterness, but I couldn't tell until i re-tasted them to see what the difference was.

So there we go! I'm excited to find out how much more intense my hoppy brews are going to start getting pretty soon here.
GREAT info complete with a real life example. Perfect! I'm sold!
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Old 12-09-2013, 12:08 AM   #267
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Quote:
Originally Posted by thisjrp4 View Post
This is a great thread. Just wondering if anyone has been using this method without dryhopping and what the results are compared to late boil additions (15, 10, 5, 0 minute). I mostly brew APAs but I don't often dry hop. Seems to me that massively dryhopping along with a hop stand would make it tough to determine how effective the method is at adding flavor/aroma.
Dry hopping vs late kettle hopping for me have always resulted in different tastes. The two aren't interchangeable and I think you'll find that anyone doing a lot of late kettle additions is likely dry hopping as well as the flavour/aroma differences compliment each other.

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Old 10-27-2015, 06:41 AM   #268
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Some great information here. I've been trying to understand the implications of flame out hop additions at different temps.

I can attest to the late hop additions being phenomenal for hop flavor/aroma.

My problem is that to get the IBUs I need from flame out hop additions, I have to add a ton of hops and I get some really crazy haze.

I'm talking an insane amount of haze. Hold it up to the light and it blocks out the sun.

I've cold crashed and tried to fine with gelatin. The gelatin helps *a little* but the beer is not clear. I have made IPAs where I get my IBUs from 60/30/20/5 and I can get them pretty clear.

How do others handle clarity with crazy late hop additions?

Some other details about my process. Post boil, I add 2-3 oz for 20 minutes right after flame out, then chill down to 180, another 2 oz for 20 minutes, then chill to pitch temps. My second chill is pretty quick, about 15 minutes with a whirlpool and an immersion chiller running to get from 180 to 65.
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Old 10-27-2015, 02:40 PM   #269
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If the big guys don't worry about it, why should we

I honestly don't know how they keep them so cloudy. Mine usually clear pretty well after a few weeks in the keg. And I've never done any filtering or clarifying step except cold crashing a few times.



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Old 10-27-2015, 02:45 PM   #270
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I just embrace the haze. Added 1/4lb of wheat flour to my last DIPA along with a lot fo flaked wheat for an appearance and smell of OJ but with +20oz of hops. 3 weeks in the keg and its still entirely opaque


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