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Old 07-07-2010, 07:44 PM   #11
SumnerH
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rexbanner View Post
I've also heard that post-fermentation aeration isn't really a cause for concern, either. I could be misinformed though.
Post-fermentation aeration risks oxidation. It's not going to kill things immediately, but it'll decrease the storage life of your beer (possibly dramatically, depending on other factors like whether you're bottle conditioning and the like). A minor splash here and there isn't a huge deal, but it's definitely worth keeping things as still as possible during post-fermentation transfers.


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Old 07-07-2010, 07:47 PM   #12
psuchunk03
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Originally Posted by jakecpunut View Post
What about straining? I've been pouring my cooled wort into the fermenter through a strainer and that seems to aerate it pretty well... any thoughts on that?
SO I NEED TO RUN INTO YOU OVER HERE, JAKE!!!! lol we miss you over at MrBeerFans... guess you've moved on to bigger an better things

yeah, the strainer will aerate plenty... any other method you use, as long it's not pure O2 supersaturation, won't hurt either.



 
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Old 07-07-2010, 07:51 PM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jakecpunut View Post
What about straining? I've been pouring my cooled wort into the fermenter through a strainer and that seems to aerate it pretty well... any thoughts on that?
It aerates the wort a little, but it doesn't do a lot.

Yeast need oxygen to reproduce. Boiling removes a lot of oxygen from the wort, so without aeration your yeasts have to struggle with the available oxygen, which can result in slow or stuck fermentations, especially if you underpitch and/or the wort has a high SG. The more aeration you can do, the better.

 
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Old 07-07-2010, 09:10 PM   #14
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Hot side aeration will increase melanoidins in your wort
Riddle me this? How does this happen, with references?

Melanoidans will act as antioxidants after the boil, but melanoidans are mostly formed during the boil.

 
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Old 07-07-2010, 09:23 PM   #15
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I use a sanitized spoon to whip up the wort both prior to pitching and after pitching my yeast.



Photo of my fermenter after pitching some dry yeast and aerating it with a spoon.

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Old 07-07-2010, 11:05 PM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SumnerH View Post
Post-fermentation aeration risks oxidation. It's not going to kill things immediately, but it'll decrease the storage life of your beer (possibly dramatically, depending on other factors like whether you're bottle conditioning and the like). A minor splash here and there isn't a huge deal, but it's definitely worth keeping things as still as possible during post-fermentation transfers.
There are several non-saccharomyces strains of yeasts that require oxygen in the solution to grow. These yeasts come in contact with your beer when you rack and bottle, but generally they cannot multiply because you beer is full of CO2 and no oxygen. When you get aeration post-fermentation, you increase contact with these yeasts and give them the necessary oxygen to multiply and consume sugars in the beer. These yeasts are responsible for the cardboard taste in beers that are associated with oxygenation.

If I remember correctly, they are also the same yeast strains responsible for yeast infections. Mmmmmmmmmmmmmmm!

 
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Old 07-07-2010, 11:15 PM   #17
oceanselv
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SumnerH View Post
Hot side aeration is nearly impossible to introduce at the home-brewing scale.
Just sloshing things around at home isn't going to accomplish it.
Quote:
Originally Posted by marc06 View Post
Riddle me this? How does this happen, with references?
Here is a synopsis of an article by George Fix. http://www.brew-dudes.com/hot-side-aeration/124. And from Chapter 6 of How to Brew by John Palmer: "Chapter 6 - Yeast

6.9.3 Aeration is Good, Oxidation is Bad

The yeast is the most significant factor in determining the quality of a fermentation. Oxygen can be the most significant factor in determining the quality of the yeast. Oxygen is both your friend and your enemy. It is important to understand when which is which.

You should not aerate when the wort is hot, or even warm. Aeration of hot wort will cause the oxygen to chemically bind to various wort compounds. Over time, these compounds will break down, freeing atomic oxygen back into the beer where it can oxidize the alcohols and hop compounds producing off-flavors and aromas like wet cardboard or sherry-like flavors. The generally accepted temperature cutoff for preventing hot wort oxidation is 80°F.

Oxidation of your wort can happen in several ways. The first is by splashing or aerating the wort while it is hot. Other beginning-brewing books advocate pouring the hot wort after the boil into cold water in the fermenter to cool it and add oxygen for the yeast. Unfortunately the wort may still be hot enough to oxidize when it picks up oxygen from the splashing. Pouring it down the side of the bucket to minimize splashing doesn't really help either since this increases the surface area of the wort exposed to the air. Thus it is important to cool the wort rapidly to below 80°F to prevent oxidation, and then aerate it to provide the dissolved oxygen that the yeast need. Cooling rapidly between 90 and 140°F is important because this temperature region is ideal for bacterial growth to establish itself in the wort."
Melanoidans will act as antioxidants after the boil, but melanoidans are mostly formed during the boil."
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Old 07-07-2010, 11:34 PM   #18
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Here's some good info for you:
http://www.byo.com/stories/wizard/ar...yeast-too-much
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Old 07-07-2010, 11:37 PM   #19
marc06
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Thank you, however I still disagree that HSA will affect melanoidan formation. In the synopsis article of George Fix, it doesn't say anything about melanoidan formation, only oxidation. That melanoidan oxidation is what is going to cause staling of beer.

 
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Old 07-08-2010, 01:31 PM   #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by psuchunk03 View Post
SO I NEED TO RUN INTO YOU OVER HERE, JAKE!!!! lol we miss you over at MrBeerFans... guess you've moved on to bigger an better things

yeah, the strainer will aerate plenty... any other method you use, as long it's not pure O2 supersaturation, won't hurt either.
ha, yeah i only did 2 Mr Beer batches... i'm gathering the equipment to do AG and should be there by this weekend! FUN STUFF

btw, I still lurk around MrBeerFans!



 
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