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Old 05-17-2010, 01:05 AM   #1
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Default Lager yeast vs S-05 at 60 degrees

Lagering is a tough thing for those of us short on space (no extra lagerator, etc)

So say you made the same beer (like a lawnmower style) and fermented it with S-05 at 60 degrees, and then the 2nd batch with a lager yeast at lager temps (like 52 degrees).

Aside from the actual lagering after fermentation, what would the difference be flavor-wise?


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Old 05-17-2010, 01:43 AM   #2
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I'm not actually going to answer your question, but the general advice on such a topic is that a lager made with lager yeast at the incorrect temperature is generally a better route than trying to use ale yeast. That is to say, the lager yeast version will be what you intended, if fermented too warm it will clean itself up (diacetyl) and be close to what you intend, whereas using ale yeast makes it different.

I would rather use the lager yeast @ 60F than the US-05 @ 60F if I was trying to make a lager. Using US-05 changes it. Kind of like going from a light Pils to, say, a Cream ale.


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Old 05-17-2010, 02:01 AM   #3
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A clean ale is much better than a bad lager. US-05 is clean in the low sixties but I seem to be getting some tartness from it. Alt yeast is even better.

I'm doing some lagers now but I rather make ales. My brewery can kick out ales fast. Lagers hold space for too long. IMO the ales are every bit as good, just different.
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Old 05-17-2010, 02:02 AM   #4
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There are several yeasts that you could use for the in between temps. California Lager for steam beers is one, as I recall Cry Havoc would work as well.
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Old 05-17-2010, 02:05 AM   #5
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Good thoughts, but what I don't quite understand is what flavor-wise do you not get from using say a Cali Lager yeast than a true lager yeast?
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Old 05-17-2010, 01:24 PM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by joex444 View Post
I'm not actually going to answer your question, but the general advice on such a topic is that a lager made with lager yeast at the incorrect temperature is generally a better route than trying to use ale yeast. That is to say, the lager yeast version will be what you intended, if fermented too warm it will clean itself up (diacetyl) and be close to what you intend, whereas using ale yeast makes it different.

I would rather use the lager yeast @ 60F than the US-05 @ 60F if I was trying to make a lager. Using US-05 changes it. Kind of like going from a light Pils to, say, a Cream ale.
It's funny, but my experience is exactly the opposite. You can get a pretty "clean" almost-lager like ale with using nottingham at 60 degrees. No esters or weird flavors, and a few people might mistake it for an actual lager. Using lager yeast too warm, though, is fruity and somewhat odd tasting. I've really not known any other brewers who prefer the lager yeast fermented too warm vs. the correct ale yeast. This might be the first time I've heard of someone having success and liking it.

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Originally Posted by fastricky View Post
Good thoughts, but what I don't quite understand is what flavor-wise do you not get from using say a Cali Lager yeast than a true lager yeast?
The Cali lager yeast is a hybrid yeast. It still retains some lager characteristics fermented as high as mid 60s, but it's much more flavorful and fruity than a regular lager yeast.
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Old 05-17-2010, 09:07 PM   #7
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Thanks!

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Old 05-17-2010, 09:38 PM   #8
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This is absolutely totally wrong. Do not take this advice.

On what basis are you making these claims? What "general advice" can you cite? You are absolutely incorrect. Have you ever made a lager at 60? You will get an estery mess that will not "clean itself up."


Quote:
Originally Posted by joex444 View Post
I'm not actually going to answer your question, but the general advice on such a topic is that a lager made with lager yeast at the incorrect temperature is generally a better route than trying to use ale yeast. That is to say, the lager yeast version will be what you intended, if fermented too warm it will clean itself up (diacetyl) and be close to what you intend, whereas using ale yeast makes it different.

I would rather use the lager yeast @ 60F than the US-05 @ 60F if I was trying to make a lager. Using US-05 changes it. Kind of like going from a light Pils to, say, a Cream ale.


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