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Old 03-09-2012, 09:13 PM   #581
meadowstream
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My experience has been that balance is not only abv versus ibu - malt flavor also plays a role. It is true that beginning brewing books do emphasize abv/ibu relationship. Does anyone else use malts to help balance the flavor to achieve the outcome wanted?
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Old 03-09-2012, 09:48 PM   #582
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Yes but that doesn't just mean roasted malts. Plus in order to get these beers to attenuate to where they should you need to use high proportions of very fermentable sources. Medium temp mashing with very fermentable syrups is what balances these beers with the IBUs utilized. You don't want a beer in the 1.020+ range because it will be too sweet. Westy 12 is high alchohol, it's dark, and it's like 40ibu almost (according to Brew Like A Monk at least).

I am beginning to sense you just like to debate/argue a side. I don't know what else we have to offer you in explanation. I have brewed this a couple times and won with the old world recipe using ONLY dark syrup for color and additional flavor. I won a second place at a comp judged by pro brewers, and I won a best of show at a Belgian only competition. So you be the judge by the results of my beers and others whom have brewed it and won. You go right ahead and throw chocolate or roast barley in there it might turn out good, but it won't be what we're making and aiming for. The best you can likely do is midnight wheat for the dark color with a lack of intense flavor.
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Old 03-10-2012, 12:16 AM   #583
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Will try a batch w chocolate malt and one w candi sugar only and compare. It seems i am wrong about the total effect of dark candi syrup and i am looking forward to trying it on its own.

You should tone down the aggressiveness hole, it is out of place in a discussion about beer.

Thanks to all for the info on this thread - have enjoyed it since its start.
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Old 03-10-2012, 11:40 AM   #584
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Quote:
Originally Posted by meadowstream View Post
Will try a batch w chocolate malt and one w candi sugar only and compare. It seems i am wrong about the total effect of dark candi syrup and i am looking forward to trying it on its own.

You should tone down the aggressiveness hole, it is out of place in a discussion about beer.

Thanks to all for the info on this thread - have enjoyed it since its start.
If I come off as aggressive I'll have to apologize, I'm passionate about brewing Belgian ales and its just how I am. Plus its tough to read people's intent through words, and I tend to throw lots of sarcasm into my posts. While I try to make it blatantly obvious I'm being sarcastic it may be difficult for some to read into my true intent. I felt you were coming off as a person that just wanted to foster an argument. You kept saying dark malt while everyone else was saying dark candy sugar.
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Old 03-10-2012, 09:35 PM   #585
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Quote:
Originally Posted by smokinghole View Post
If I come off as aggressive I'll have to apologize, I'm passionate about brewing Belgian ales and its just how I am. Plus its tough to read people's intent through words, and I tend to throw lots of sarcasm into my posts. While I try to make it blatantly obvious I'm being sarcastic it may be difficult for some to read into my true intent. I felt you were coming off as a person that just wanted to foster an argument. You kept saying dark malt while everyone else was saying dark candy sugar.
syrup. dark candi syrup.
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Old 03-10-2012, 09:47 PM   #586
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Yeah syrup, sorry I forget those colored sugar rocks still exist. I meant syrup when I said sugar.......
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Old 03-11-2012, 11:43 PM   #587
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Pulled a sample from the keg today of the NW recipe i brewed back in early November. It's been kegged and sitting at 45-50 degrees for the past 3 months waiting for the right time to bring it out. Couldn't wait any longer and decided to hook up a picnic tap to pour a glass. WOW. that's about all i can say. By far the best beer i've made to date. It's amazing how easy it drinks for being 10%. I'll probably enter this in a few comps just for ****s and giggles.
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Old 03-12-2012, 05:11 AM   #588
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Just brewed the new world for my first 5 gallin all grain - with a couple changes. I only had dark Candi rocks I made a few days before, so after plugging it into beersmith, I threw them in.

Now, its bubbling away nicely, and has risen so far to 72.
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Old 03-12-2012, 09:48 AM   #589
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mightynintendo View Post
1.)

...

3.) i asked this question myself a while back. it seems that a lot of people hold a low 70's ambient temperature and let the beer self rise to the target temp. at some point you may need to even cool it off to keep it from getting TOO hot. once the temperature starts to drop from its target, that's when you should start heating it externally to hold it at the target for the appropriate length of time. at least this is my understanding.
Yes. Spot on. At the proper pitch rate and ambient temp the high krausen bio-thermal should reach 81F (some say up to 82F). We've found Abbey yeast produces desirable esters at 68 as at 72F so we no longer use external heating.
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Old 03-12-2012, 09:56 AM   #590
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Any hints as to how this version may turn out yet?
saq is likely a brewing genius (really) but don't tell him I said that

This recipe looks very very good. Possibly under-pitched but saq has ways of coaxing Abbey yeast to do things most brewers generally don't...we'll just have to wait on the blue ribbon to see.
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