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Old 06-30-2009, 02:59 PM   #1
Bobby_M
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I can't find any specific data on whether flaked wheat can benefit from a protein rest at 122F. It's specified in Jamil/Palmer's BCS and Palmer's How to brew lumps flaked wheat in with raw/unmalted wheat but then you read description of flaked wheat elsewhere and it's described as being pre-gelatinized for better enzyme access. What gives?


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Old 06-30-2009, 03:02 PM   #2

Witbier recipe?

I've done single infusion mashes and step mashes with flaked wheat in a Witbier recipe without any perceptible difference in either flavor or efficiency; raw unmalted wheat, on the other hand, definitely benefits from a brief 122 rest for 15 minutes then stepped up to the final rest for the remainder of the time.



 
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Old 07-01-2009, 03:14 AM   #3
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Yeah, I'm specifically talking about the Wit from classic styles. He calls for a 122F rest for 15, then a slow ramp to 156F. There's no raw wheat in that, just pils, flaked wheat and a pound of flaked oats. I'm probably just going single sac rest at 152 and call it a day.
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Old 07-01-2009, 04:01 AM   #4
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Everything I've read has said Flaked Wheat (and other flaked grains) is pre-gelatinized and that a protein rest is not necessary.

 
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Old 07-01-2009, 12:42 PM   #5
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I just did a Wit with flaked wheat using a brew in a bag method - no rest - and it worked out fine. Everything I read about flaked wheat says you don't need the protien rest. That's only true for raw wheat but I think the flaked is somewhat converted.
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Old 07-01-2009, 12:49 PM   #6
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Just listened to the "Brewstrong" podcast about enzymes, and Jamil/Palmer stated that flaked wheat is pre-gelatinized, so it's ready to be added right to the mash. The process of the wheat going through the rollers when its flaked adds enough heat and moisture to gelatinize the flakes. You should be good to just do your normal mash.

 
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Old 07-01-2009, 01:46 PM   #7
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You can understand my confusion when a recipe in the book written by both guys in that same podcast recommends a protein rest. WTF.
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Old 07-01-2009, 03:58 PM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bobby_M View Post
You can understand my confusion when a recipe in the book written by both guys in that same podcast recommends a protein rest. WTF.
Yes, I've seen other contradictions from them in what they say in the book vs. on the podcasts. However, they are still among the best out there IMHO.
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Old 07-01-2009, 04:19 PM   #9
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You do not need a protein rest but IMHO it will benefit the mash.

Flaked wheat is just rolled torrified wheat. Torrified wheat if hot air popped like popped rice cereal. While it is pre-gelatinized and does not need a cereal mash, it is the prime candidate for the benefits of a protein rest, just keep it under 20 minutes. I prefer to infuse to my sacc temps to make the jump quickly.

 
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Old 07-01-2009, 04:31 PM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bobby_M View Post
Yeah, I'm specifically talking about the Wit from classic styles. He calls for a 122F rest for 15, then a slow ramp to 156F. There's no raw wheat in that, just pils, flaked wheat and a pound of flaked oats. I'm probably just going single sac rest at 152 and call it a day.
I did a protein rest on this beer, came out great.

A lot of people seem to be getting confused between modification and gelatinization. Flaked grains are gelatinized but not modified, that is what a protein rest does. The protein rest will break down the proteins that bind up the starch (this normally happens in malting), this will make more starch available to be converted. This temp is in the active range for beta glucanase too, this activity will help keep the mash from being so thick, so your sparge will be easier. When I brewed this beer, I noticed of the course of the rest things got thinner.

I don't exactly remeber what Palmer said about protein rests in Brew Strong, but in how to brew:
Quote:
This rest should only be used when using moderately-modified malts, or when using fully modified malts with a large proportion (>25%) of unmalted grain, e.g. flaked barley, wheat, rye, or oatmeal.
EDIT: Also, I think their general stance on not using a protein rest is on 'regular' beers with all fully modified malt. I think this beer with 50% unmalted grain is an exception.




 
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