ESB vs IPA

Can someone explain the difference between ESB and IPA. The recipes are very similar and both have similar gravities. The only obvious difference is the extra hops in the IPA and possibly Vienna malt.

If it is ESB and English IPA, then it is sometimes hard to tell the difference. The IPA will be a little hoppier. The ESB will probably be more robust and earthy. If it's an American IPA, then you will most likely be looking at a hop bomb, and the difference will be much more evident. There is also a stronger chance that it will have a less malty base.

So you basically answered your own question.

Also if I'm not mistaken most ESB's have a caramel flavor to them... At least thats what I pick up in my Fuller's when I'm drinking it. Damn near one of my favorite beers of all the commercials out there.

Yeah, most of the commercial ESBs I've had in the UK have a much more pronounced crystal malt presence with a lot of toffee/caramel in them.

Also if I'm not mistaken most ESB's have a caramel flavor

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+1. That iswhat I have noticed also - more malt presence - maybe sweeter?

Fuller's is sweeter, but then all of their beers are. Their yeast is less attenuative (Wyeast 1968). I've had some ESBs that aren't as sweet as theirs. But they always have more crystal from what I've seen. I prefer Ordinary and Best Bitter myself...

MattHollingsworth said:

Fuller's is sweeter, but then all of their beers are. Their yeast is less attenuative (Wyeast 1968). I've had some ESBs that aren't as sweet as theirs. But they always have more crystal from what I've seen. I prefer Ordinary and Best Bitter myself...

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Yep! When I answered I was assuming for some reason that rather than actual Fuller's ESB, he was meaning a good hearty special bitter. The ESB tag can be a bit misleading IMO as many people don't mean Fuller's when they use that term.

Anyways, that is why I used the terms robust and earthy rather than malty or sweet.

Have I just confused the issue even more?

Naw, no worries. I think the confusion stems more from some American brewers using the term too. And it's totally different, just like IPA is too. IPAs in the UK can be like 3.6%, really small beers that bear no resemblance to their American counterparts. Same thing with ESB. The ones I've had in America were just pale ales for the most part, maybe with a touch more crystal. All the bitters in the UK, to me anyway (and I was just at the Great British Beer Festival drinking a LOT of them!) are much more bready, toasty, biscuity. Some have dry hops and some don't, some are hoppier, some less hoppy, some more mineral, some more sweet etc. But usually, it seems to me, that at the top end of the bitters scale, the ESB usually has a lot more of that Crystal/Caramel note to it. The Fuller's one *is* malty and sweet-ish. And they're not even all earthy as they don't all have EKGs in them. Some have more Fuggles or Styrian Goldings character.

Anyway, my 3 cents.

The terms have been used interchangeaby and even ignored throughout history, even in the weightier texts. And, it's even been suggested that all of these styles should be subgroups of IPA. The only real defining line is between English and American in the use of hop varietals. From there, it pretty much gets chopped up into gravities as all the other attributes overlap in such a way that it would be possible to brew a beer that would fit Across of the the "style" definitions aside form gravity and continental flair.

Yeah. And generally, you don't see a lot of the term ESB in the UK that I've seen either. A LOT of beers just have a name without the designation of what it is, Bishop's Finger etc etc. Their just bitters of some sort without and real definition.

I'd say that the grain and yeast also plays a huge role in the difference between American and Brit, though. Water too. Don't think I've ever had an American beer that smelled of sulfur. And American pale ales and such don't tend to have as much fruit from esters either...

And generally, you don't see a lot of the term ESB in the UK that I've seen either.

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That's because ESB is trademarked by Fuller's. No other brewery can use the term.

flyangler18 said:

That's because ESB is trademarked by Fuller's. No other brewery can use the term.

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Didn't know that. But, still there are a lot of beers that aren't labeled with anything, they're just named. In America, it seems the majority are categorized.

Interestingly, in the program for the GBBF, there was a lot labeled "Premium ale", whatever that means. Golden Ale was another one I hadn't seen as a category before. These are hoppy pale ales, basically...

I wonder if Redhook ESB, Flying Fish ESB, . Bridgeport ESB, Bachelor ESB - Deschutes Brewing, Boont ESB - Anderson Valley Brewing, The Wise ESB - Elysian Brewing etc....know that they cannot use the term?

They're only trademarked in the UK as I recall.


ESB, and IPA, perhaps my two favorite styles. When I think of ESB I think of something with that caramel toffee malt flavor in tact, that is accentuated by the hops (fuggles and goldings, always, in my mind). IPA, especially in an American context, brings to mind a beer that showcases the hop varieties. The few English IPA's I've had are definitely more balanced, and less about hop fanaticism, though definitely more floral than an ESB.

An extra special bitter has to have that dark colored body, whereas best bitters bring to mind a more golden colored ale, and an IPA could go anywhere from golden to copper/red in color. But hey, these are just the drunk ramblings of an American.

That may be true but I know I know I've seen one or two over there on my last trip. Perhaps many do not use the term b/c it was trademarked and they don't want the brand confusion. Thames Welsh ESB (Felinfoel Brewery) comes to mind.

I think the ESB trademark expired or at least partially.

http://trademarks.justia.com/775/38...-s-esb-griffin-brewery-chiswick-77538269.html