Mash question for Dude's Leg humper clone.

I'm getting ready to try my first AG batch and I'm having some difficulty getting the sparge calcs down. I'm going to do a batch sparge and I plan to have 6.5 G for the boil. Now I used the infusion temp calc in "how to brew" and came up with 164 degree water. I'm shooting for 154* mash and I'll be using 19 quarts initially to account for absorbtion. Does that sound right?

I also plugged it into a trial version of promash and came up with the same temp. I'm sort of looking for reassurance here.

Just base your mash water needed by doing 1.15-1.25 quarts per pound of grain.

164° sounds in the ballpark, but remember it is much easier to cool down the mash than it is to raise the temp. Have some cool water ready, and mash in with about 167-168°, IMHO. Thermal mass of your mash tun, surrounding environment, and even grain temp have a ton to do with hitting your targeted msh temp. Keep careful track of what you strike at so you can narrow it down in the future. You won't hit dead on the first time or 2, so don't get down. After that, you'll be able to do it in your sleep.

Dude said:

Just base your mash water needed by doing 1.15-1.25 quarts per pound of grain.

164° sounds in the ballpark, but remember it is much easier to cool down the mash than it is to raise the temp. Have some cool water ready, and mash in with about 167-168°, IMHO. Thermal mass of your mash tun, surrounding environment, and even grain temp have a ton to do with hitting your targeted msh temp. Keep careful track of what you strike at so you can narrow it down in the future. You won't hit dead on the first time or 2, so don't get down. After that, you'll be able to do it in your sleep.

Click to expand...

Ok, I figured I would need 1.58qt/pound to reach my boil volume, does that sound right?

This is what my math looked like,



Grain 12 pounds
absorbtion 6 quarts
boil volume 26 quarts
1st batch 19 quarts
2nd batch 13 quarts
qt/lbs 1.58
T1 70
T2 154

Infusion temp 165


What you're saying about being a bit high being better makes sense, I'll probably go a little on the high side. When it comes to total volume of water I use I want to use my boil volume plus the amount the grains will absorb right? If not I will either have to add water later or boil longer, right?

I'm sure all this will make much more sense after I have done it the first time.

Todd

Todd said:

When it comes to total volume of water I use I want to use my boil volume plus the amount the grains will absorb right? If not I will either have to add water later or boil longer, right?

I'm sure all this will make much more sense after I have done it the first time.

Todd

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I don't think I'm getting this....first off, how are you going to sparge? Batch or fly?

Mashing in is separate from sparging. When you mash in, you do not want the total volume of what you intend on boiling. That happens during the sparge. If you fly sparge, you sprinkle water over the mash bed and drain it into the kettle SLOWLY until you have about 7 (or 8 depending on how much you boil off) gallons. If you batch sparge, I'd do 2 separate runs of approximately 4-5 gallons each and stir in between.

I'm going to batch sparge.

My plan was to use 19 quarts of water in the mash, then sparge with 13 quarts. I assumed .5 quart/pound absorbtion so this shoud give my boil volume of 26 quarts. I was also figuring on 1 gallon boil off.

I was planning to stir in between also.

This procedure is how Plamer laid it out which is what I was trying to follow, I did my own calcs for the volumes.

I batch sparge and this is how I usually figure it. Remember to preheat the cooler with some hot water as this will help to maintain the mash temp. I mash at 1.2 quarts per pound and figure .1 quart per pound for absorbtion. You should also determine how much deadspace you have in your tun and use this in your calulations. I think 164 is low on the temp side. My grain is 68-70 degrees and I have to get the water to 170 for a 154 mash temp. Here is a good page of info on batch sparging if you have not already read it:>http://www.hbd.org/cascade/dennybrew/

Wow so you only get .1 absorbtion? That really changes the calc. Should I be shooting for my boil volume at the end of the mash or is it best to just use a certain ratio and add water or boil extra if needed?


For this recipe am I correct that you would mash with 15.6 Quarts and sparge with 14.4 giving you 28.8 boil volume?

I understand this is not an exact science and some things will change with my setup vs what someone else is using. I'd just like to be close, not short and not boiling for 2 hours.

I appreciate the input, I'm planning to do this tonight so if anyone else has input try to reply before 5pm est.

Thanks

Remember, that is .1 quart per pound so with your recipe that is 1.2 gallons. You want to get your final volume at the end of the 2nd run, so you shoot for 2 equal runnings.

12 X 1.2 = 3.6 gallons
Absorbtion = 1.2 gallons
Your left with 2.4 so add .8 to 1 gallon of near boiling water at the end of the mash. Stir well and vourlauf. Then run into your kettle.

Add 3.25 water for the 2nd running to get your final volume. You might want to have a little extra water in case the first running does not equal 3.25. Hope this makes sense.

Do you know how much deadspace there is in your system?? I leave about a quart in the cooler that I cannot drain.

Blender said:

Remember, that is .1 quart per pound so with your recipe that is 1.2 gallons. You want to get your final volume at the end of the 2nd run, so you shoot for 2 equal runnings.

12 X 1.2 = 3.6 gallons
Absorbtion = 1.2 gallons
Your left with 2.4 so add .8 to 1 gallon of near boiling water at the end of the mash. Stir well and vourlauf. Then run into your kettle.

Add 3.25 water for the 2nd running to get your final volume. You might want to have a little extra water in case the first running does not equal 3.25. Hope this makes sense.

Do you know how much deadspace there is in your system?? I leave about a quart in the cooler that I cannot drain.

Click to expand...

Would dividing the 3.25 gals sparge into two 1.63 gals sparge runs improve efficiency since there is that deadspace in the cooler and the first sparge would dilute that deadspace down alot and then the second would extract the remaining sugars??

Blender said:

Remember, that is .1 quart per pound so with your recipe that is 1.2 gallons. You want to get your final volume at the end of the 2nd run, so you shoot for 2 equal runnings.

12 X 1.2 = 3.6 gallons
Absorbtion = 1.2 gallons
Your left with 2.4 so add .8 to 1 gallon of near boiling water at the end of the mash. Stir well and vourlauf. Then run into your kettle.

Add 3.25 water for the 2nd running to get your final volume. You might want to have a little extra water in case the first running does not equal 3.25. Hope this makes sense.

Do you know how much deadspace there is in your system?? I leave about a quart in the cooler that I cannot drain.

Click to expand...

Isn't .1 quart per pound going to be 1.2 quarts not gallons? 12x.1 is 1.2. Sorry.

I don't know the dead space yet, I think I can drain nearly everything, the cooler has a dip built in at the spigot, I played with it with water last night and almost everything came out. I don't know how grain will effect this though.

I think I'm following everything, I'll try striking at a higher temp, I can always cool if needed.

Thanks.

I should have pics of my equipment and this brew session in a few days, hopefully it goes off without a hitch!!

Oh should I sparge at 170 as well or hotter? Also is it a good idea to start heating for the boil after the first runnings or should I wait for everything to be in?

Dude said:

164° sounds in the ballpark, but remember it is much easier to cool down the mash than it is to raise the temp. Have some cool water ready, and mash in with about 167-168°, IMHO. Thermal mass of your mash tun, surrounding environment, and even grain temp have a ton to do with hitting your targeted msh temp. Keep careful track of what you strike at so you can narrow it down in the future. You won't hit dead on the first time or 2, so don't get down. After that, you'll be able to do it in your sleep.

Click to expand...

I have been using my wort chiller to cool my mashwater lately for my single decotion lagers. It works like a charm to drop the temp a few degrees to hit your target mash temp.

Todd said:

Isn't .1 quart per pound going to be 1.2 quarts not gallons? 12x.1 is 1.2. Sorry.

I don't know the dead space yet, I think I can drain nearly everything, the cooler has a dip built in at the spigot, I played with it with water last night and almost everything came out. I don't know how grain will effect this though.

I think I'm following everything, I'll try striking at a higher temp, I can always cool if needed.

Thanks.

I should have pics of my equipment and this brew session in a few days, hopefully it goes off without a hitch!!

Oh should I sparge at 170 as well or hotter? Also is it a good idea to start heating for the boil after the first runnings or should I wait for everything to be in?

Click to expand...

My bad it is .1 gallon. I usually heat the sparge water to 185,the grain temp then gets up to 165 or so. You can cool the mash with ice cubes, it works pretty well. Take good notes because it takes a few times to learn how your system works but, it sure is fun.

docbee said:

Would dividing the 3.25 gals sparge into two 1.63 gals sparge runs improve efficiency since there is that deadspace in the cooler and the first sparge would dilute that deadspace down alot and then the second would extract the remaining sugars??

Click to expand...

docbee, everything I have read from others and my experience lead me to believe there would not be a difference. The crush of your grains seems to make the biggest improvement.

Blender said:

My bad it is .1 gallon. I usually heat the sparge water to 185,the grain temp then gets up to 165 or so. You can cool the mash with ice cubes, it works pretty well. Take good notes because it takes a few times to learn how your system works but, it sure is fun.

Click to expand...

Yeah I am stoked to try it. Any tips on measuring output in a keggle?

Blender said:

docbee, everything I have read from others and my experience lead me to believe there would not be a difference. The crush of your grains seems to make the biggest improvement.

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Thanks. Wasn't trying to hijack thread but trying to learn as much practical info in preparation to going to AG brewing in the near future. This site is super for learning!! Thanks to all contributors.

Todd said:

Yeah I am stoked to try it. Any tips on measuring output in a keggle?

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If your kettle isn't marked I have heard of some using a wooden stick that is marked along the edge with volumes.