Results from juice, yeast and sugar experiments

Bearclaw215 said:

Freezing will actually kill some bacteria, but cannot be relied upon. Freezing, often does cause lysing of the cells, but doesn't always do this, and the cell simply is suspended until it thaws out. Bacterial cultures are often frozen in glycerin stocks to keep them in perpetuity. So even though they are susceptible to death by freezing, they can survive the temperatures, so you can't rely on it.

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So whats my best coarse of action? Maybe soak then in some cheap vodka? Or am I basically just tossing them in there and crossing my fingers?

kgressler said:

So whats my best coarse of action? Maybe soak then in some cheap vodka? Or am I basically just tossing them in there and crossing my fingers?

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throw the berries in some warm StarSan or whatever no-rinse sanityzer you use then drain off the fluid. It will thaw the skins and kill whatever is living or dormant on the skin.

Okay sounds like a plan Mark. Thanks

CvilleKevin:
My questions for you is when i cold crash I suppose I should take the airlock off and put a whole bung on? Then after the crash is done pull it out and put another airlock in to check for further fermentation for 2-3 days?
Then I can proceed to bottle?

My questions for you is when i cold crash I suppose I should take the airlock off and put a whole bung on?

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Yes, just make sure the bung is in good and tight so that it doesnt pop out while the cider is cooling and yeast is still active. I generally release the pressure from the bung after ~12 hours or so, then 24-48 hrs later check again, any new pressure build up should be minimal.

Then after the crash is done pull it out and put another airlock in to check for further fermentation for 2-3 days?
Then I can proceed to bottle?

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Normally after the crash, I would rack to a new carboy, put on another airlock and let it sit at room temp for at least 2-3 weeks to make sure it doesnt start back up.

However in your case, it sounds like (a) you dont care if it starts back up, and that you'd actually prefer a bit of carb and (b) you have fridge space to put them if they do carb up - to keep them from overcarbing into bottle bombs. So in that case, just bottle them right after the crash and drink at least one every couple days or so. Dont leave them in the sun or heat. If they do start carbing up, it will likely go slow and take a while, so just make sure you get them in the fridge before the carb gets too strong. Dont go on vacation with them sitting at room temp. At least not with your first batch

CvilleKevin said:

Yes, just make sure the bung is in good and tight so that it doesnt pop out while the cider is cooling and yeast is still active. I generally release the pressure from the bung after ~12 hours or so, then 24-48 hrs later check again, any new pressure build up should be minimal.



Normally after the crash, I would rack to a new carboy, put on another airlock and let it sit at room temp for at least 2-3 weeks to make sure it doesnt start back up.

However in your case, it sounds like (a) you dont care if it starts back up, and that you'd actually prefer a bit of carb and (b) you have fridge space to put them if they do carb up - to keep them from overcarbing into bottle bombs. So in that case, just bottle them right after the crash and drink at least one every couple days or so. Dont leave them in the sun or heat. If they do start carbing up, it will likely go slow and take a while, so just make sure you get them in the fridge before the carb gets too strong. Dont go on vacation with them sitting at room temp. At least not with your first batch

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OK so dont worry about racking it after the crash into a new carboy or my bottling bucket just bottle right out from the fridge in the same carboy its in?
Should I let it get back to room temp before bottling or just do it straight from the fridge while its cold?

OK so dont worry about racking it after the crash into a new carboy or my bottling bucket just bottle right out from the fridge in the same carboy its in? Should I let it get back to room temp before bottling or just do it straight from the fridge while its cold?

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Right - I'd just bottle right out of the fridge, from the same carboy you crashed in (this is with the caveat that you will be drinking at least one bottle every couple of days or so and can put them all in the fridge if they start becoming carbonated). I'd recommend that you let the carboy sit for about 15 min after moving it out of the fridge - not so that it comes up to temp, but so that any sediment that gets stirred up will have a chance to settle back down before bottling. Try to be very careful when you move the carboy so as not to stir things up. Probably also a good idea to drink the last half dozen or so bottles first - since your racking cane will be closer to the bottom for the last few bottles and you are more likely to pick up a bit of yeast towards the end of the bottling session

Alright I Beleive I have my plan all laid out now. I did add 1.5 lbs of raspberries this morning. So i think Sunday or Monday I will check the sweetness and see if it where I want it. Hopefully I can bottles this next Friday or Saturday. I'm asuming there isn't much harm if it's in the fridge an extra day or two?

Started a little half gallon batch of cider from a White House brand "Fresh Pressed" jug. I had some East Coast Ale yeast that I harvested after a batch of American Amber and decided to give it a try. Anyone used this yeast on cider? I'm considering adding a little fresh ginger in secondary. My investment in this little experiment is about $3, so I won't complain if it's a complete flop.

CvilleKevin said:

Right - I'd just bottle right out of the fridge, from the same carboy you crashed in (this is with the caveat that you will be drinking at least one bottle every couple of days or so and can put them all in the fridge if they start becoming carbonated).

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So I cold crashed the carboy on monday morning around 6AM. When I got home that evening the bung had popped off and from reading is pretty normal. Ive since popped the top off 2 or 3 times to see if any pressure has built up and each time it has been less and less till this morning it had no pressure when I popped the bung off. I am assuming this is a good indication that the yeast has gone dormant. Now there has been very little clearing and maybe a 1/4 inch of lees on the bottom of the carboy. SHould I see more clearing before I start to bottle or is this about as good as its gonna get before bottling?
It looks like I am going to be off from work on Xmas even which will be two days should I try and bottle here in hopes of catching some carbonation if not I must wait till this weekend which will put the crash at 6 days. I guess this should result in less chance of carbonation and a better chance of some clearing?
And If i do choose to try and catch some carbonation will I be dealing with some of the lees sitting in the bottom of the bottles as it ages? Is this going to be an issues? If you were handed a cider to try and it had a layer of lees on the bottom would you have an issue with it or just drink it with second thought?

It looks like I am going to be off from work on Xmas even which will be two days should I try and bottle here in hopes of catching some carbonation if not I must wait till this weekend which will put the crash at 6 days. I guess this should result in less chance of carbonation and a better chance of some clearing?

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That's a tough call. Yeah, its a bit of a trade off, but I think you will be fine either way. I'd go with whatever works best for your schedule. You probably will get some additional clearing (and maybe some additional yeast precipitation) if you let it go 6 days, although in my experience you will see most of the clearing in 2 days.

And If i do choose to try and catch some carbonation will I be dealing with some of the lees sitting in the bottom of the bottles as it ages? Is this going to be an issues? If you were handed a cider to try and it had a layer of lees on the bottom would you have an issue with it or just drink it with second thought?

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In my experience, all ciders will get crystal clear if you keep around them long enough, so if they are not crystal clear when they go into the bottle, you will eventually see some lees on the bottom if you dont drink them first. Its not a problem. When I make experimental one gallon batches, I always bottle them right after the crash, just like you are planning to do, and there is almost always some sediment at the bottom after a few months, even when there is no carb. In that case, I just pour from the bottle. All things being equal, most people prefer a cider that is carbonated and clear, but as long as the cider tastes good, people are going to drink every drop regardless.

Went ahead and bottled this all up
This morning.
Only issue I ran into was trying to bottle out of the carboy. You really need an extra pair of hands to use the bottling wand and then holding the siphon so it won't sit it the lees at the bottom of the carboy.
After a few seconds I decided it stead of making a mess I would just siphon it into a bottling bucket then bottle it from there.
It's cloudy as the dickens and the bottles have some sentiment in them already. But it taste pretty good. Still pretty alcoholic(y) but there is definitely an apple and raspberry flavor in there and nine of the buttery smell I was getting a week or so ago.
I put these in the basement it's pretty cool down there and I'll see how the carbonation goes. After a week or two if I don't see anything I'll bring it upstairs and see if warmer temperatures helps.
In the mean time I picked up another 6 gallons today featuring Jonathan Golden Delicious and Fuji and I used 2.5 lbs of clover honey.
Figured this is the last of the cider this year and just in case it's really good I better have enough.
Thanks for all the help CvilleKevin.

Little update:

After 3 days there is slight carb the plastic pet bottles arent rock hard and Ive compared them to other soda bottles and they arent nearly as hard yet. Although my temperature is in the low 60's. The clarity really hasnt improved much yet though.
I went ahead and drank one and while it was pretty tart I compared it to the other ciders I had on hand "Samuel SMith Organic Cider" Which right now is probably my favorite cider thus far and "Smith and Forge" which isnt bad.
Its slightly drier then Samuel SMith cider which is a good thing for my taste.
I think the raspberry flavor overpowered the apple flavor in the cider a bit.
Im guessing the tartness is attributed to it being very young and will lessen with a bit of time. But Its definitely drinkable as is and I am damn happy so far. Just want to be careful of bottles bombs. This should be fantastic come spring... Atleast i anticipate it will be.
Speaking of bottle rockets If no futher carbonation develops how long will it take before I should/could be in the clear. Or once the basement begins to warmup in the spring will I again need to be careful and watch them closely?

I got a hold of some more accurate ph test strips as I wanted to take a small sample of of the 3 ciders I have sitting in carboys to taste and test the ph.

-Pippin, Winesap, Stayman blend - ph was 3.6 and this one tasted the best, very good actually. Strong apple smell and flavor. Completely dry but I can still see a bubble or two rising in the carboy which might be some malolactic fermentation. My guess is that the pippin brought the acidity down to the right range. It is tempting to go ahead and carb and drink this one...

-Virginia Winesap single varietal. I can't tell the pH on this one as the color on the test strip doesn't really match any on the key so I am afraid this one might be higher than 4.4. I may need to get the next set of test strips to test it again. Very strong apple smell (actually this one smelled the best, and I am not surprised as the Winesap smelled the best as I was grinding the apples). Flavor is pretty good, interesting, maybe a little flat.

-Winesap & Stayman blend - this cider was completely clear and then about a week ago turned cloudy and started fermenting again. There is definitely some residual sugar in it (I didn't check the s/g today though). Has a mild apple smell and mild apple flavor -- kind of bland. Ph test strip showed a ph similar to the winesap cider. It may need some acid blend.

Hi Everyone,

I am making cider for the first time and had a quick question about using 1 gal jugs... First though, I am using some local organic cider, UV treated from a mix of New England varieties and Safale S-04. Temp range in my basement is about 60-70 depending if the wood stove is going. I can keep it a around 60safely

Now my question. If I don't plan to bottle it separately and cold crash it and then rack it into another clean 1 gal jug, should I just keep it in the fridge? I'd like a little carb with the cider, but don't want to break the bottle. Im after taste here. Any way to accomplish this?

I am after a style close to DownEast Cider in Cambridge, MA.

Thanks in advance.

If I don't plan to bottle it separately and cold crash it and then rack it into another clean 1 gal jug, should I just keep it in the fridge? I'd like a little carb with the cider, but don't want to break the bottle. Im after taste here. Any way to accomplish this?

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You could do this but if you dont rack at least once, you will have a lot of yeasty sediment that gets stirred up every time you try to drink. Also, if drinking out of the gallon you are introducing air each time.

For the first few batches, I'd recommend using plastic bottles. They can take more pressure and it is obvious when they are carbed. You can buy beer bottles that are made for this but anything that will keep a tight seal and you can easily sanitize works. I used gatorade bottles when I was starting out.

If you looking for minimal effort, skip the rack before crashing. When your gallon tastes like where you want it, put it in the fridge for a few days and let it clear up. Then rack into some plastic bottles, which you can keep in the fridge or put at room temp to carb up. If you let them carb, put the cider in the fridge when its a little sweeter than you want it and keep an eye on the bottles daily. When they are hard, put them in the fridge and keep them in the fridge until consumed.

Thanks for you reply!

Could I also rack before cold crashing, then rack after it has settled as well? I don't have to get a fizz, like I said, Im just working on my methods.

I plan on getting a bunch of friends together and drinking the gallon all at once. Maybe once I have my methods down, I will begin bottling.

Thanks again all.

Could I also rack before cold crashing, then rack after it has settled as well?

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Yes, that would work. You probably dont want to keep it in the fridge for too long after the 2nd rack, as you will have a bit of extra headspace in the gallon jug after 2 racks. You might want to wait until your friends start showing up and then do the 2nd rack right into a pitcher

Man last batch I did took 16 days t ferment to 1.008 from 1.054. No other fermentables. This batch I added 2.5 lbs of honey(1.064sg) and it will be a month on Saturday and its still around 1.018.
Have you noticed a slower fermetation when using honey at all?

Have you noticed a slower fermentation when using honey at all?

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Not really. I definitely do see a slower fermentation later in the season as temps drop though. Temps can make a big difference. The first batches I did this season mostly fermented out in about 2 weeks. The last batches that we pressed in November took 5-6 weeks.

I just got more juice last week - Stayman, Pink Lady and Albemarle Pippen. SG was 1.064. I've got all of those batches fermenting in a guest bedroom instead of my basement. The basement is a lot more convenient, but also a lot colder. I'm hoping to do one more juice run at the end of Feb, and didnt want to take a chance on not being able to get my primaries empty by then

If you are not in a rush, a 46 point drop in 4 weeks is a nice pace. That's about a point and a half a day, which gives you plenty of time to determine exactly when you want to crash. My experience with adding honey is that it almost always gets more clear during the crash

Well the only difference between them was the first batch temps ran 60-62 for the most part with a few days hitting 58.
This current batch has been 58-60 for most of the time with a few days hitting 56.
You think this small change in temp with Nottingham is what's doubling the fermentation time?

kgressler said:

Well the only difference between them was the first batch temps ran 60-62 for the most part with a few days hitting 58.
This current batch has been 58-60 for most of the time with a few days hitting 56.
You think this small change in temp with Nottingham is what's doubling the fermentation time?

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Yes

You think this small change in temp with Nottingham is what's doubling the fermentation time

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Could be. I'm not sure I would attribute all of it to lower temps, but given that the recommended low end for Notty is 57F, you are right on the edge of what it likes. I've generally had no problems going down to 55F or so during the winter with Notty, but 5 week ferments are normal then. Unless you are using the exact same apples, there can be some variability in nutrient levels, and this can affect fermentation times. Also dont forget that you started this batch 10 points higher than the first one, so in addition to slightly colder temps, the alcohol level is higher.

Ah I think you hit it on the difference on apples. The first batch was Jonathan golden delicious red delicious.
This batch was Jonathan golden delicious and Fuji.
I figured the 10 points might add a week to 10 days more but I guess it probably a combination of all the above different apples more sugar and lower temperatures.

CvilleKevin said:

Yes - racking is a form of nutrient reduction. If you use a yeast that consumes a lot of nitrogen during fermentation (most ale and wheat yeasts), you can induce a stuck fermentation by racking. If you bottle right after the rack, you could get a bit of carbonation before the ferment completely sticks.

You're right that this would be risky, because you usually dont get rid of all the nutrient with a single rack. I've used racking to stop ferments instead of cold crashing before. Sometimes it takes only one, but usually it takes three or four to get the ferment to stop with some sweetness. This is using juice from an orchard that does not use nitrogen fertilizers and no nutrient added. Its somewhat yeast dependent - 3068 usually sticks with a single rack regardless of juice. I've also done this with S04 and Notty, which sometimes take a single rack and sometimes more.

I think it might be possible to bottle carbonate a sweet cider somewhat reliably by racking enough times that the ferment completely sticks - and leaving it in the secondary long enough to verify that it is indeed stable - and then pitch a little more yeast on it. Theoretically, the yeast should last just long enough in a low nitrogen environment to get just a bit of carbonation. I havent tried this yet and probably wont get around to it this season, as keg conditioning is a lot easier, but if someone is dead set on bottle conditioning a sweet cider, it might be a little more reliable - just be prepared to crack a few bottles while working out how much yeast to add at the end

One of these days I need to go back and re-write this thread so that all of the info is consolidated. When I go back and read the first post, I'm struck by how much I've learned in just a year - a lot of stuff I thought I knew a year ago was wrong. Probably wont be till after cider season. That'll give me something to do in the Spring besides drink this season's cider

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Curious If you have tried cold crashing and then letting it sit in a secondary to make sure its stable then adding yeast before bottling yet?

Ive now done two batches with Notty one without any fermentables one with 2 lbs of honey. The first one was pretty cloudy and has been bottled for a month and is still pretty cloudy but slowly clearing. My second batch with the honey is pretty clear and I just bottled it yesterday.
So far my only gripe is getting the cider more clear. Figured If I could allow it to sit in secondary longer to clear and still be able to bottle carbonate I would be set.

Curious If you have tried cold crashing and then letting it sit in a secondary to make sure its stable then adding yeast before bottling yet?

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No - I've thought about this and I believe it's possible, but it would take a bit of trial and error to get this right. Errors could involve broken glass. Then you need to make sure your juice has consistent levels of nutrient, so its repeatable. Measuring nutrient levels is difficult. Its a worthwhile goal for someone to pursue. Since I've already got a kegging system, I'm thinking more these days about how to improve that process.

For someone who wanted to try this, BRY97 might be a good candidate for the first yeast. It seems to use a lot of nutrient. The last two BRY97 batches I did leveled out at 1.012 and didnt budge for several weeks before I finally crashed them.

My second batch with the honey is pretty clear and I just bottled it yesterday.

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Yeah, that's been my experience - adding honey almost always makes it more clear after crashing.

So far my only gripe is getting the cider more clear.

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Crashing the cider a second time almost always makes it more clear. Also, the apples being picked when they are just ripe makes a big difference. This season my ciders have clearing better than average, which I think has a lot to do with more of the apples in these mixes being specifically picked for cider, so a little riper than normal.

Below is a pic of secondaries from early November pressing, taken last weekend right before I kegged 4 of these. Two wheat yeast batches, which are usually a bit more cloudy, were almost completely clear. I had to crash those twice because they started back up after the first time. Nottingham batch was almost completely clear, Brupacks slightly less clear, but could still see through the carboy. These were all 5-6 weeks on shelf post-crash. The others have not been sitting quite as long

Another nice thing about kegs is if a batch still has a little bit of haze when you keg it, any additional precipitating sediment will collect near the diptube and comes out on the first couple of oz. So rest of pours are clear

OTOH - the batch of juice that I got from a cider pressing party in October has been crashing for almost 4 weeks and it is still really murky. Its the only batch this season which didnt get nice and clear. These were #2 apples that came from another orchard. They were Stayman, Winesap and Pippen and they looked nice but I dont think they were ripe. That is a risk for #2s when the trees get picked all at once. It was great for drinking fresh, but SG was low and probably a lot of starch and pectin in the juice. Usually, when a batch wont clear at all like this one, I just keg it and drinking it ASAP. This particular batch still tastes a little hot so I am going to rack it and let it sit on the shelf to mellow for a while.

The pressing method may also be a factor. Last year, the cider I got from the pressing party also came out cloudy, even though these apples came from yet another orchard. These were mostly Winesaps and seemed to be fairly ripe. Sugar levels were good. My friend's hand press uses a drum scratter, as opposed to the press at the orchard, which I believe uses a hammer mill.

Having the cider get clear is nice for aesthetics, but the cloudy hand pressed batch from last year was one of my favorite kegs. I managed to keep that keg on tap for almost 4 months, because I didnt give much away. At a tasting party last spring, it scored 4th out of 20 bottles, so cloudy did not seem to be a problem for my friends either. I saved the last bottle until this season's pressing party. By then, it had finally cleared and there was about an inch of alcoholic applesauce at the bottom of the bottle. Still tasted great. Of all the attributes that a cider might have, I'd probably rank clarity last.

Adding oak chips in the secondary may also help with clearing. I've oaked a couple batches this season and both times I've noticed that after adding the chips, the carboys started clearing faster. Not sure if that is a coincidence or something to do with the oak chips.

Figured If I could allow it to sit in secondary longer to clear and still be able to bottle carbonate I would be set.

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I believe that is probably doable, but likely would take some experimentation to work out and especially to be consistent. Make sure to be very careful not to let bottles overcarbonate, because that can cause real damage. If you use cold temps to shut down an ale yeast ferment in the bottle, make sure you dont let the bottles leave the fridge until you drink them.

Dude, is that your house? Or a commercial cidery? Nice!

These were all 5-6 weeks on shelf post-crash. The others have not been sitting quite as long

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Oh well then my first batch only took 16 days till I cold crashed it and 2 days later I bottled all of it. This was on Xmas Eve so I could see some more clearing as time goes in the bottles?

Having the cider get clear is nice for aesthetics. Of all the attributes that a cider might have, I'd probably rank clarity last.

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I will say I noticed the honey made the last batch a little hot as you described after tasting it before bottling. Is this from the honey or just because I raised the SG about a point. I mean I know adding more fermentables will raise the SG but does honey making it hotter then say dex or turbino would?

Make sure to be very careful not to let bottles over carbonate, because that can cause real damage. If you use cold temps to shut down an ale yeast ferment in the bottle, make sure you don't let the bottles leave the fridge until you drink them.

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Well I cold crashed in a carboy then bottled. My first batch was bottled on Xmas Eve and carbed up decent in my basement. Its sitting in the low to mid 60's most the time. I check on them every few days but the carb doesn't appear to be building.I filled up a 1 PET bottle for every 8-10 glass bottles just to judge the carb as I got to the bottom of the bottling bucket.
Theyve been stable for over a month and I dont expect temps to start rising in the basement till March or April.
Im guessing at this point I need to be cautious and make sure they arent starting to carb again or will 3-4 months being stable in a cool environment
knockout the yeast?

This was on Xmas Eve so I could see some more clearing as time goes in the bottles?

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In my experience, even the most cloudy ciders will eventually become crystal clear within about 9 months, often sooner. Whether or not its worth the wait is up to you

does honey making it hotter then say dex or turbino would?

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I dont think so. I've done batches with honey that were perfectly drinkable right after the crash. I dont think Notty particularly likes honey though. I mostly use S04 for cysers these days. Sometimes Wy3333. Wy1010 tastes the best for cysers IMHO, but kicks out a lot of sulfur and I wouldnt recommend it for bottling.

Its still a mystery to me as to why some batches are perfectly drinkable after the crash and others take a few weeks in the secondary to sort themselves out. I'm sure that there are plenty of microbiological reasons, but from a process/recipe perspective there doesnt seem to be a lot of rhyme or reason. Even the large commercial cideries around here have to deal with that. Sometime a batch just needs to sit in the secondary a while to sort itself out. I'd estimate that on any given pressing where I ferment 8 carboys, 2 to 4 will be ready to drink immediately after the crash. The rest might taste a little too hot, too acidic, sometimes a little eggy, sometimes just weird, but they almost always sort themselves out after another 2-6 weeks in a secondary.

Im guessing at this point I need to be cautious and make sure they arent starting to carb again or will 3-4 months being stable in a cool environment knockout the yeast?

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You need to continue to keep an eye on these. Definately dont let them get any direct sun. I've lost a couple bottles that way. I sometimes lose a bottle or two in the summer when temps get up to 80+ in the basement, although no problems last summer. If you can put your bottles in bottle crates and set the bottom crate in a tupperware bin, that will make the cleanup a lot easier if you do forget and get a burst bottle. If you didnt sulfite these, I wouldnt recommend keeping them around much past April anyway. They might be OK for longer, but the risk of them turning increases over time

You need to continue to keep an eye on these. Definately dont let them get any direct sun. I've lost a couple bottles that way. I sometimes lose a bottle or two in the summer when temps get up to 80+ in the basement, although no problems last summer. If you can put your bottles in bottle crates and set the bottom crate in a tupperware bin, that will make the cleanup a lot easier if you do forget and get a burst bottle. If you didnt sulfite these, I wouldnt recommend keeping them around much past April anyway. They might be OK for longer, but the risk of them turning increases over time

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When you say risk of the turning do you mean into vinegar or exploding?

I have enough fridge space if needed to store these once it gets warm. I really didnt plan on drinking all of these by April. My understanding is they would last a year or so without sulfite. I was hoping to have these for this spring and early summer.

I plan on trying S04 and Wy3333 this coming fall when fresh cider is available again. I will keep that in mind when using honey again.

When you say risk of the turning do you mean into vinegar or exploding?

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Both

My understanding is they would last a year or so without sulfite.

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I've had many batches go a year or longer without sulfite, but after ~6 months its a bit of a crap shoot. If you want these to have the best chance of surviving into early summer, I'd put them all in the fridge as soon as they are carbed and mellowed enough to your liking - but would still get them all chilled by April at the latest. If you are feeling adventuresome, maybe only refrigerate half of them. Just make sure you can contain any spills if a bottle breaks. Also, if they do get a little vinegary, its not the end of the world. Some people prefer just a bit of a tang. I've still got a keg from the 2013 season that IMHO has too much tang for drinking by the pint but goes really well with poultry for dinner.

Well I left one of the pet bottles out in warmer temps upstairs (70-72) just to see how stable the ones in my cooler basement will be once it warms up. It has carbed up pretty well. Im just gonna put it in a small rubbermaid container and check it everyday. Hopefully it will hold up well a a minimum it will let me know when I need to throw them in the fridge.

Okay so I'm doing a 2.5 gallon batch from pasturized cider. The initial gravity reading was 1.050. I'm going to use Danstar BRY-97. So should I add about a half pound of dextrose?
Also I have to bottle, so can I prime then bottle or is this a bad idea?

Okay so I'm doing a 2.5 gallon batch from pasturized cider. The initial gravity reading was 1.050. I'm going to use Danstar BRY-97. So should I add about a half pound of dextrose?

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4oz of sugar per gallon raises the sg by 10 points, so assuming you want to start at 1.060, that would be 10oz. I generally use a mix of 2/3 turbinado and 1/3 dextrose when I'm adding sugar. IMHO, that is the closest taste to natural apple sugar, although its not a huge difference compared to using all turbinado or just regular granulated sugar. I dont like the taste of straight dextrose quite as much for cider, but again its not a huge difference, so if its what you have on hand it works OK

Also I have to bottle, so can I prime then bottle or is this a bad idea?

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It depends on what your goal is. If you want a dry cider with minimal effort, then fermenting all the way dry and priming before bottling to get carbonation is about the most foolproof method. In that case, I'd use S04 instead of BRY97. The advantage of BRY97 is that it is more likely than other yeasts to stall out before it hits 1.000, so its easier to make a sweet or semi-sweet cider with it. Carbonating a semi sweet cider is a lot easier and less dangerous if you have a keg setup vs bottles. Bottle carbonating a semi sweet is doable but requires understanding of nutrient reduction and a lot more attention to minimize the risk of broken bottles. It has been discussed many times in this thread, so I would suggest reading some of the past posts, as well as the sticky on bottle pasteurization before attempting to do something like this.

Kegging is an impossibility for me here in Korea. I've bottled everything I've brewed up to this point with no problems and I figured that priming with just 50g or less of priming sugar would put me in a "safe zone" for bottling. As far as yeast, for some reason S-04 is not easy to find here, so what I have is BRY-97, S-33, S-23, and S-05.

I've bottled everything I've brewed up to this point with no problems and I figured that priming with just 50g or less of priming sugar would put me in a "safe zone" for bottling.

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Are you looking to make a dry cider or sweet/semi sweet cider? Unlike beer, all of the sugars in apple juice are fermentable. If you want to bottle carbonate, then the easiest way is to ferment to dryness and use priming sugar. Bottle carbing a sweet or semi sweet cider is more difficult.

Yeah, I think my original idea was to ferment for a couple of weeks (or until dry) then cold crash in secondary, then bottle with priming sugar. Does this make sense? Or am I just over thinking the whole process?

That'll work just fine, you just have to make sure fermentation is complete before bottling.

Yeah, I think my original idea was to ferment for a couple of weeks (or until dry) then cold crash in secondary, then bottle with priming sugar. Does this make sense? Or am I just over thinking the whole process?

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If you are making a dry cider, then you just need to ferment it out, wait for it to clear a while and then bottle with some priming sugar. If you are not trying to stop the cider before it finishes fermenting, you can skip the cold crash. The cider will clear up for a while on its own when it is done fermenting.

Of the yeasts you mentioned S23 works the best for a dry cider IMHO. However it likes cooler fermentation temps (55-60), or else it tends to get stinky. I've never tried BRY97 for a dry cider. It works great for a sweeter cider, but you might have to add some nutrient to get it to ferment all the way out.

I DO have 2oz of yeast nutrient I can use. Since I'm fermenting a "half batch" could I also use a whole pack of yeast to help ferment out, or would the ammount of yeast have no effect?

I DO have 2oz of yeast nutrient I can use. Since I'm fermenting a "half batch" could I also use a whole pack of yeast to help ferment out, or would the ammount of yeast have no effect?

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You can use the whole pack of yeast and then add nutrient later if you need to. Depending on your juice you might not need it, but it would be good to have on hand just in case the fermentation sticks