Apple Wine Hangover

So here's the deal. A few months ago I decided to take a stab at some homebrew apple wine. It seemed like an easy, inexpensive way to make some diy alcohol, and since I had the equipment just sitting around I went for it. I kept things simple, using the following recipe.

5 gallons organic apple juice
8 lbs honey (looking for a high alcohol content)
1 packet champagne yeast (can't remember the exact brand)

I let it ferment in my modified cooler at 64 F, and racked it after about 3 weeks and things seemed to be going great. Fast forward a couple of months; I decide to crack one of the bottle's open, and enjoyed it enough that I put away about 5 (5 oz glass) glasses in one evening. I woke up the next morning with the most excruciating headache I have ever had in my life. It was so bad that all I could do was lie on the couch for about an hour waiting for the ibuprofen to take the edge off.

Mind you, I'm an unashamed drinker. I put away 2-6 drinks (scotch and/or wine) almost every evening, more a couple of times a month with friends, and never experience bad hangovers unless I just go really overboard.

Since that night, my wife and I have tried smaller samplings with similar results. As little as 1-2 glasses seems to be sufficient to give either of us headaches the next day, even when making sure to chug plenty of water. It's starting to look like I'm going to have to make apple cider out of the stuff, but I'm just really curious as to what went wrong. Everything I read says that apple based alcohols can sometimes have a higher methonol content, but not to any degree that should be concerning. It certainly shouldn't be high enough that 1 glass would be toxic. Any thoughts?

Sounds like fusel alcohol if I had to guess.

Rick

That's a thought, though I was under the impression that fusel alcohol had a very noticeably "hot" flavor. The wine is quite mild, even milder than white wine with a slight apple hint. As I said, I kept the temps a constant 64F through the entire process. Would it still be possible that the fusel alcohol content is too high?

Mr_Manhands said:

That's a thought, though I was under the impression that fusel alcohol had a very noticeably "hot" flavor. The wine is quite mild, even milder than white wine with a slight apple hint. As I said, I kept the temps a constant 64F through the entire process. Would it still be possible that the fusel alcohol content is too high?

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I'm not sure to be honest. At that fermentation temp you wouldn't think you'd get any fusels, or not enough to be an issue. It's just the only thing I can think of that would give you a raging headache. It's a bummer for sure and without pinpointing the cause it'll be hard to avoid next time out. Hopefully someone will chime in that knows more than I, I've never used champagne yeast.

Rick

Have you regularly drank a large amount of wine before without any issues?

My husband only drinks wine with food, because he gets wicked effects from drinking wine besides with dinner.

With 8 pounds of honey (assuming a 5 gallon batch?), you're looking at a 15--18% ABV wine (depending on how much natural sugar was in the juice). That'd be enough to give me a rocking headache if I drank more than a glass or two.

You definitely got your wish- you wanted a high alcohol wine. :cross:

Maybe some of the higher alcohols will age out a bit with some time, so you can try putting some away.

In the meantime, many people like apfelwein mixed and served with sprite, so if you like wine spritzers, you could try that.

F250 said:

I'm not sure to be honest. At that fermentation temp you wouldn't think you'd get any fusels, or not enough to be an issue. It's just the only thing I can think of that would give you a raging headache. It's a bummer for sure and without pinpointing the cause it'll be hard to avoid next time out. Hopefully someone will chime in that knows more than I, I've never used champagne yeast.

Rick

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I agree that the symptoms do sound a lot like fusel alcohol contamination, but none of the other signs are there. Tis a mystery

Yooper said:

Have you regularly drank a large amount of wine before without any issues?

My husband only drinks wine with food, because he gets wicked effects from drinking wine besides with dinner.

With 8 pounds of honey (assuming a 5 gallon batch?), you're looking at a 15--18% ABV wine (depending on how much natural sugar was in the juice). That'd be enough to give me a rocking headache if I drank more than a glass or two.

You definitely got your wish- you wanted a high alcohol wine. :cross:

Maybe some of the higher alcohols will age out a bit with some time, so you can try putting some away.

In the meantime, many people like apfelwein mixed and served with sprite, so if you like wine spritzers, you could try that.

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Yeah, I have no problem with wine. I can polish off a bottle over the course of an evening on my own and not regret it the next day. I did try cutting the apple wine with apple juice recently to bring the alcohol lvls down, but still ended up with a headache after a couple of glasses. It's just a bummer to put the effort into it and not know why it didn't come out properly.

BTW, is that a young Tom Waits in your avatar? Cool pic.

Mr_Manhands said:

It's just a bummer to put the effort into it and not know why it didn't come out properly.

BTW, is that a young Tom Waits in your avatar? Cool pic.

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Just let it age. I'm not sure why you're getting headaches, but age can't hurt. I often age 15-18% wines for three years! So age can't hurt, might help mellow the higher alcohols.

And yep, Tom Waits. I just love him!

I've been bumping around different threads involving apple wine and haven't really seen anyone else posting these problems, but after thinking about it for a while, I realized my insistence in using honey over sugar really makes this stuff half mead. Long story short, I'm starting to think that F250 hit the nail on the head. I've found a couple of different forum posts on this very same subject.

http://www.addisonhomebrew.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=16&t=1217

The good news is that aging for a year+ seems to help, so it looks like I'm just going to have to make another batch using sugar to fix me for the short term. I appreciate everyone's input. You've saved a perfectly good batch of alcohol from being turned into apple cider vinegar.

Well, hopefully you discovered the cure.

Rick

Probably not the reason, but I have noticed that at least with me, sweeter drinks seem to cause more headaches. Apfelwein, which is close to your recipe, only 2 lbs dextrose in place of the honey will give me the headache hangover, where when I drink the equivalent amount of alcohol in beer feel 10X better in the morning. Easy drinking dry high ABV drinks also seem to drain the glass much much quicker.

DrunkleJon said:

Probably not the reason, but I have noticed that at least with me, sweeter drinks seem to cause more headaches. Apfelwein, which is close to your recipe, only 2 lbs dextrose in place of the honey will give me the headache hangover, where when I drink the equivalent amount of alcohol in beer feel 10X better in the morning. Easy drinking dry high ABV drinks also seem to drain the glass much much quicker.

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I hear ya on the sweeter drinks causing hangovers, but this batch actually came out quite bland. Given the lack of sweetness despite the amount of honey I put in there, I'm assuming it is approaching the 18% alcohol mark that champagne yeast is capable of.

The severity of the headache and how little it takes to get it makes me think that there is something else going on here.

6 bottles of 18%, that's like drinking two bottles of champagne. I can drink 6 Bourbon and cokes, but two bottles of dry wine or champagne, I'd be hurting too! Any time I drink dry stuff if makes me really dehydrated. Next time eat before you sleep and drink some gatoraid to get some electrolites in your system.

Might it be your body has an aversion to champagne yeast? Different people can definitely have different reactions to the same chemicals.

I seem to have a bit of an aversion to some of the Belgian yeast strains. I can drink and enjoy Duvel and Orval but Orval definitely leaves me feeling a bit crappier the next day. And that's only having a couple of bottles of it with some other beer.

dannylerch said:

6 bottles of 18%, that's like drinking two bottles of champagne. I can drink 6 Bourbon and cokes, but two bottles of dry wine or champagne, I'd be hurting too! Any time I drink dry stuff if makes me really dehydrated. Next time eat before you sleep and drink some gatoraid to get some electrolites in your system.

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If you read the OP in its entirety (I realize it's a bit lengthy) you'll see that my wife and I were getting headaches off as little as one glass. I agree that so many glasses of that stuff was excessive.

Ogri said:

Might it be your body has an aversion to champagne yeast? Different people can definitely have different reactions to the same chemicals.

I seem to have a bit of an aversion to some of the Belgian yeast strains. I can drink and enjoy Duvel and Orval but Orval definitely leaves me feeling a bit crappier the next day. And that's only having a couple of bottles of it with some other beer.

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I hadn't thought of that. I've had champagne without any problems, but never more than a couple of glasses at a time. It would be a pretty big coincidence if both my wife and I had such a strong sensitivity to champagne yeast, but I suppose it's in the realm of possibility.

I realize it has been a few months since this thread was active, but I wonder if the hangovers have improved with a little more aging of the wine? I tried my hand at a 5 gallon batch of EdWort's Apfelwein and I have been having similar problems. I didn't even use as much dextrose as the recipe calls for, I used about 1.3 lbs instead of 2 lbs. As little as one 8 oz. glass can give a splitting headache the next morning. Here is how I made it.

Pitched Montrachet yeast
Primary at basement temp of 63-64 degrees
Ferm temp seemed to be around 68 degree for a couple of days and then it dropped to around 65 degrees
Kegged after 6 weeks on primary
Immediately put in kegerator at 40 degrees with 12 psi pressure

It has now been in the keg for about two weeks. The taste of the wine is fine. Similar to a dry Chardonnay with a little bit of apple flavor. It's pretty good dry or back sweetened with Sprite.

I had two glasses one night and got a mild headache after a couple of hours. My wife has had a splitting headache the next morning from one glass. One of her friends has also had a bad headache then next morning from one glass. I am thinking of taking it out of my kegerator. I can't in good conscience serve this to people.

I'm trying to figure out how to salvage this. Will letting it age at 40 degrees in the kegerator do anything? Does anyone think it would make sense to take it out of the kegerator, let it warm back up to the mid-60s, and try to let it age a little bit more?

Hmm never had any issues with my cider, but that is a super high ABV!