Does anyone know where I can buy Simcoe hops rhizomes or plants? Scouring the internet and I'm not finding them.....then again I'm not known for being technologically advanced. It was all I could do to figure out how to join and post this.
If you try, do yourself a favor and don't talk about it. I know the penalty for growing that genetic material for sale is pretty stiff. I'm not sure what the law says about growing it for your own personal use but its not something I would do.
H22W said:So long as the patented variety wasn't being used for commercial uses, pretty sure that there would be no issue for a lucky "Joe" with Simcoe in his backyard.
The patten owner wouldn't have suffered any monetary damages, so there shouldn't be anything to sue "Joe" for.
The pattern owner might likely have enforceable contracts with authorized growers and collect money from them if they were at fault for enabling "Joe" to get his hands on growable Simcoe.
Joe no longer buying Simcoe hops due to personal, unlicensed supply = monetary damage
day_trippr said:^ Yup.
And courts often do not limit damage awards to actual monetary damage...[edit: ref RIAA lawsuits]
Cheers!
Carlscan26 said:Joe no longer buying Simcoe hops due to personal, unlicensed supply = monetary damage
I guess I'm a spirit if the law vs letter of the law guy. Just because they won't come after you doesn't make it right for you to cheat the source.
Molybedenum said:Patents are actually meant to allow for private construction of an identical product. This is why patents require the full disclosure of design. They grant a monopoly within the market for that product, however. Patents are meant for suppression of competition. You'd be busted if you sold your homegrown Simcoe / rhizomes, for instance.
Whether living things should be patent-able is something else entirely.
That's quite the distortion.
Patents are the publication of a new device or process in exchange for a guaranteed period of exclusivity. There are three types of patents: utility, process and plants.
Go argue about the sentient-ness of plants somewhere else. Maybe you need to stop making beer since you're killing hop and barley plants. Never mind the yeast...
While you're at it, go read a patent on a plant. It doesn't describe taking an accidentally found rhizome head in a package you receive of hops and growing your own plant. Read the patent and spend the time and money and energy to follow it to make your own Simcoe plants. And yeah don't sell them. But oh wait, use of that product during the exclusivity period still violates the protections afforded by the patent. But hey who are you hurting? Just an evil grower who brought you such an awesome hop that you're now compelled to grow it by any means necessary?
Reference: http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Plant_breeders'_rights
Molybedenum said:L2R.
With these rights, the breeder can choose to become the exclusive marketer of the variety, or to license the variety to others.
This is purely for marketing purposes. For personal use, a patent is non-applicable. The issues that you see coming up with farmers and Roundup plants are due to them accidentally getting patented material via natural reproduction of their plants... but farmers also bring their product to market, and do not have those exclusive rights.
Even further down in this article is the explanation of the exemption for farm saved seed. Due to the fact that farmers do not bring the seed to market, they are exempted from the infringement claim.
My point stands: If for home use, it's non-infringing. That has always been the case with patents, and a major reason why they differ from copyrights.
Carlscan26 said:I half hate to dig up this thread but I don't want to leave it out there unfinished and with a good bit of misguided and flat out wrong information.
I had a chance to talk to a friend of mine who is a patent attorney today. Here's what he sent me after we talked:
"So you're asking: 'can you use some patented invention as long as you're doing it at home in your garage for your own private use? Not selling anything or making money on it in any way?' Technically, if the claims of the patent are infringed, it would be patent infringement. There's no "private use" exception to patent infringement."
H22W said:You might want to ask that anonymous attorney friend for the most obvious follow-up question: "How about an example where somebody was successfully prosecuted for patent infringement where the defendant had no commercial activity?"
H22W said:Never happened right? Kind gets down to "letter of the law" v.s. practically of the law.
Grantman1 said:Sure is getting heated in here. Maybe we should create a law section on the forums for you guys.
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